New Skills System for Planar Adventure

[Cuup]

In a campaign set entirely in the Great Beyond, where new adventures constantly bring the PCs to new Planes, a strong understanding of the many Planes can be an invaluable asset. In a non-planar-focused campaign, the Knowedge (Planes) skill is used to quantify a person’s collective knowledge on all things inter- and extra-planar.

However, when a campaign is set entirely away from the Material Plane, this simplification can do a disservice, considering every plane is infinitely more vast and mysterious than most traditional settings. The standard skills rules assume that any information regarding a Plane is attained with Knowledge (Planes) - creatures, cultures, histories, governments, etc. Meanwhile, in such a default setting, each of these categories receives its own separate Knowledge just for its own local Material address (Local, Geography, History, and Nobility, respectively). And yet, it would also seem perfectly reasonable to disallow Knowledge (History) from representing a person’s collective knowledge of historical lore within all of infinity on over a dozen unique planes of existence. Still, it WOULD be entirely unreasonable to introduce several dozen new skills to represent various categories of knowledge in every single plane (or even one single knowledge skill per plane).

The goal of this alternate Knowledge system is to validate the vastness and mystery of the Great Beyond with an expanded system, but still leave the overall skills rules largely unchanged and not overly complicated. This system is a work in progress, and I'm open to suggestions.

The Knowledge (Planes) skill no longer exists. Knowledge (Local) is now used to identify Outsiders. At each new level, PCs receive 3 Background Skills. In addition to the normal uses of Background Skills, PCs may also allocate these into Planar Foci. Planar Foci are treated in many ways as skills (total ranks per Focus cannot exceed your total HD, they can be modified by the Skill Focus Feat, etc.), but are actually used as modifiers for other skills when used on different Planes. Each Focus is considered a Trained Only skill. A class that receives Knowledge (Planes) as a Class Skill can instead select a single Planar Focus to be treated as a Class Skill. A PC may allocate normal Skill Ranks into Planar Foci, just as he may put normal ranks into any Background Skill.

When making a skill check (usually Knowledge-based) that pertains to a specific Plane or several specific Planes, a PC adds his Planar Focus modifier to the modifier of the skill being used. For example, to identify a Large Fire Elemental, a PC would roll Knowledge (Local), and also add his Elemental Planar Focus modifier. If the PC has no ranks in Knowledge (Local), OR if he has no ranks in Elemental Planar Focus, he is not considered trained, and cannot make the roll. Alternatively, if a PC wanted to know something about the ruling class in the City of Brass, they would roll Knowledge (Nobility), and add their Elemental Planar Focus modifier. If a roll could pertain to more than one Planar Focus, use the highest modifier of all that apply.

Planar Foci:
Upper (Heaven, Nirvana, Elysium)
Middle (Axis, Boneyard, Maelstrom)
Lower (Hell, Abadon, Abyss)
Elemental (Fire, Earth, Water, Air)
Energy (Positive, Negative, First World, Shadow)
Transitive (Ethereal, Astral)

A couple problems I'm already aware of with this system: It enables a PC to max out Knowledge (Local) and Planar Focus (Lower), and become doubly knowledgeable in identifying fiends than someone with the default rules, while the goal of this rules system is to prevent hyper-knowledge in the multiple infinities that is the Great Beyond. Second, a PC could simply put one rank in each Planar Foci, and then allocate ranks into Knowledges as normal, kind of defeating the whole point.

Maybe I'm over-thinking this, but I feel like simply doubling all Knowledge (Planes) DCs wouldn't really fix the problem, either. Maybe I'm overthinking this. Any feedback or suggestions are welcome!

[Taja the Barbarian]

This seems like it belongs in the PF1 Home Brew / House Rules forum: I've flagged it for transfer.

[Cuup]

Thanks! And bump :)

[Mightypion]

For me, knowledge planes is for identifying an outsiders nature, but kn. local, history, geography for its possible class level, history and particular proclivities.

Generally speaking, I try to make other knowledge skills more useful, rather then make the useful ones less useful.

History can in my games often be used for generate political insights, geography in part too, as well as for tactics, ambush positions, history can, in the case of famous individuals with more then 10 class levels that arent particularly secretive about them, also literally tell you some of their feats.

[Bjørn Røyrvik]

That's basically what I do as well. For any bit of knowledge you want to learn there will be a primary skill but with a higher DC other Knowledge skills can be used instead. Knowledge (Local) can be used in place of most other Knowledge skills within the chosen locale.

E.g. K (nature) can tell you about animals, but K. (history) with a higher DC might let you recall a story about some historical figure who encountered just such an animal and the story included some relevant facts. K. Religion might tell you about the struggle between some saint of your religion against a powerful outsider and the unearthly powers it had.

Using K. (local) can be useful - e.g. if you grew up a place with oak trees, you can identify them pretty much anywhere and most of the facts will be the same, but even if you correctly manage to identify a goblin you have no guarantee that the culture of any goblin you meet outside your chosen locale will be the same as the one within.

[DM_aka_Dudemeister]

I think Planar Foci should work similar to languages:
At 1st level you start with a material planar focus plus one other plane per point of int.

Maybe instead of Skill points you need a focus to go above DC 10 in Kn. History, Local, Nobility, Nature. Add in a feat:

Planar Scholar
Prerequisite: Int 13+
Benefit: Select another Planar focus you can apply all relevant knowledge checks to topics related to your Planar focus.