Gibbering Mouther Engulf ability 1 action?


Rules Discussion


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The Gibbering Mouther's stat block states that its Engulf ability is only 1 action. Every other creature with Engulf needs 2 actions to use it.

Is it possible that this is a typo, and that the writers meant to either list it as a 2-action ability or that they meant for it to be Swallow Whole instead of Engulf?

For reference, Engulf allows a creature to stride twice its speed and attempt to swallow any creatures in their path. It's way too powerful for a single action ability

Scarab Sages

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Lost Omens, PF Special Edition, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Bump. Does anyone know if this is a typo. This came up in Malevolence.


It wouldn't surprise me if it were one action, partly because a Gibbering Mouther is so very slow (10' on land!) and engulfing is its shtick. Also it could easily be kited w/ only a 30' spit attack unless it grabs hold of a foe early, preferably while somebody's Confused.

If it could Engulf multiple PCs (like say if someone built an upgraded version size Large+), then it'd probably be important to change Engulf to the two actions it is by default. But balanced against its Jaws attack, they aren't so different in power level. (A party of Sprites might disagree...)

Grand Lodge

There is a possibility, that this is a mistake in the write-up.

But there are several reasons that make it less powerful as it seems.

1) The Gibbering Mouther has Base Speed 10

2) Engulf can only be done once per round on each different PC

3) On a successful Reflex Save you can decide to end in the path of the monster and end it's movement

4) The Gibbering Mouther is medium. It can only engulf a single medium or small creature and can't use the engulf after that

So yes - theoretically it could move three times 20 feet and try three times to engulf a different target.

Practically this would only work on a large open field with three Sprite characters (tiny). Otherwise the first success would stop any further engulfs (already full) or the first fail might stop it (getting in the way - say a narrow corridor - can't engulf that one again)

So as written it likely will engulf one character sooner or later - but that ends it. Unless you are a group of sprites - in this case - was nice to have known you.

Scarab Sages

Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Lost Omens, PF Special Edition, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Thanks thod and Castillano for your responses.

Engulf Rules 1st Paragraph:
The monster Strides up to double its Speed and can move through the spaces of any creatures in its path. Any creature of the monster’s size or smaller whose space the monster moves through can attempt a Reflex save with the listed DC to avoid being engulfed. A creature unable to act automatically critically fails this save. If a creature succeeds at its save, it can choose to be either pushed aside (out of the monster’s path) or pushed in front of the monster to the end of the monster’s movement. The monster can attempt to Engulf the same creature only once in a single use of Engulf. The monster can contain as many creatures as can fit in its space.

Thod wrote:
1) The Gibbering Mouther has Base Speed 10

If engulf is one action RAW this creature would never take the Stride action since it doesn't need to actively engulf someone. It could just make the engulf action to move 20 ft. Which might be why it's a base speed of ten!

Thod wrote:

There is a possibility, that this is a mistake in the write-up.

2) Engulf can only be done once per round on each different PC

The engulf ability says `once per engulf action`. This is the biggest reason why I thought that perhaps it was a mistake. I don't mind if it's one action to do engulf, but you could just go back and forth over the same clustered players over and over again which is terrifying.

Thod wrote:

Unless you are a group of sprites - in this case - was nice to have known you.

Great imagery!

Grand Lodge

Zexcir wrote:

If engulf is one action RAW this creature would never take the Stride action since it doesn't need to actively engulf someone. It could just make the engulf action to move 20 ft. Which might be why it's a base speed of ten!

Think about it like a coiled up snake. The Gibbering Mouther is a slow moving mass - unless you get too close (20 feet or less) and it suddenly moves a lot quicker to engulf you as hunger propels it to new speeds (ok - 20 still isn't lightning fast but at least dwarven fast).

I would cry 'foul' if it would use engulf if there is not a single opponent inside 20 feet. RAI it should be clear that engulf would need someone.

So the save distance would be 45 feet away. Double Stride plus engulf would move it a max or 40 feet.

I'm aware that some players - if they would have the ability - would latch onto such an oversight in the way that the rule is written.

Edit:You are right - I misinterpreted the once in a single use to once in a single round (which it also would be with 2 actions). Not sure if I misread or subconsciously interpreted it that way from the 2 actions and that it can't be done more often.

Scarab Sages

Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Lost Omens, PF Special Edition, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Thod wrote:

Think about it like a coiled up snake. The Gibbering Mouther is a slow moving mass - unless you get too close (20 feet or less) and it suddenly moves a lot quicker to engulf you as hunger propels it to new speeds (ok - 20 still isn't lightning fast but at least dwarven fast).

Awesome, I am going to use this analogy if it comes up in the future! Thanks again.


Quote:
(3) On a successful Reflex Save you can decide to end in the path of the monster and end it's movement

Where do you get this? I don't see how you're able to stop a "lunging" Gibbering Mouther with a successful Reflex save, only that you end up at the end of its movement.

When I ran a set of Mouthers, I was allowing them to path over as many targets as they wanted with an Engulf action (well, as many as you could fit in a 20ft move speed), with the caveat that they'd stop either at the end of their movement or if they successfully engulfed a target.

Grand Lodge

Nygmus wrote:
Quote:
(3) On a successful Reflex Save you can decide to end in the path of the monster and end it's movement

Where do you get this? I don't see how you're able to stop a "lunging" Gibbering Mouther with a successful Reflex save, only that you end up at the end of its movement.

When I ran a set of Mouthers, I was allowing them to path over as many targets as they wanted with an Engulf action (well, as many as you could fit in a 20ft move speed), with the caveat that they'd stop either at the end of their movement or if they successfully engulfed a target.

That was me reading too quickly and reading 'to the end of the monster’s movement' as 'to end the monster's movement'.

You handled it correctly. Someone else noted it but it was way, way past the hour you can edit and correct yourself.

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