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I apologize if this is in the wrong place.
Half-Dragons have for many years of D&D, AD&D, AD&D 3.5e, Pathfinder 1e & 2e as well as 5e has been on my mind for a long time now. I have without a doubt had an issue with one small feature of these glorious creatures, and I was wondering what the community at large felt about this issue. While I am discussing Half-Dragons here I think this issue can be applied to many other templates of the Half-(type) all together as a whole.
So the issue at hand is this ,template type aside, when applying a template to any base creature why for the love of the goddess does it always say "creature's type changes to" this has bothered me for the longest time now. Frankly why does it not just add the new type to the base creatures type as well?
For an example: Tieflings are Outsider (Natives) adding a half dragon template changes this to Dragon instead of Tiefling Outsider (Native), Dragon (type)
Maybe I am missing something in my long years of playing these games but the term Half does not mean you become the full creature type half-elves for instance do not become Elf nor are half-orcs, Orc's either. Now the most commonly used Half-anything template is Dragon yes, but there are so many other half templates out there and the little research I have done so far all of them change the race type to literally a full version, (discounting Half-Elf and Half-Orc there is no race type change), literally getting rid of the base creatures race all together so why do they get to retain the base creatures stats?
I am sure some of you have maybe had this thought hit you once in your years of playing the games yes? Cause if this question has not popped up once for you then I feel it should have by now because a half species is not a full species of either race. I used Half-Dragon as the example because as we all know from Fantasy RPG lore dragons have a history of screwing nearly anything alive. Some dragons even experiment with creating new races base on their blood so this should not be a surprise to anyone.
For all essential purposes though, Aasimar and Tielfings, are technically already half bloods in their own right. Yet they are consider a race as a whole with many alternate racial archetypes based on their blood heritage. So I propose this thought to you why have Half-(Fiend, Angel, Other) outsider templates when all they would technically create is another Aasimar or Tiefling based on their bloodline? Also speaking of bloodlines there is one major discrepancy I noticed Umbral dragons do not have cold. They have negative energy for a breath weapon thus the Bloodrager Bloodline list under primal dragons is incorrect.
Yes my research even lead me into the bloodlines of some classes cause I wanted to see if having the blood gave you the race type as well. Unlike Dragon Disciple or Dragon Shaman I did not see this as an issue in the classes. I guess my research was a bit more extensive than I stated earlier, still go look for yourselves if you find this post to be incorrect. Currently I am checking into Monster Templates as well.
First is the disclaimer: never, ever, ever apply genetics to fantasy races. That way madness lies.
Now, let's examine things a bit. Half-elves and half-orcs are humanoids. Their lineages are those of humanoids: humans, elves, orcs. No creature type changes.
Tieflings and aasimar have less than half-blood. Lineages for them let you trace back to specific subtypes (e.g. pitspawn), but they're outsiders either way. Unique races with mixed traits, true enough, but their own races.
Half-fiends and others are one parent humanoid, one parent outsider (or whatnot). Maybe they ended up with enough of the outsider parent to gain specific traits of that outsider (check out Demons Revisited for examples of half-demons with specific parents), maybe not (basic half-fiend).
Class bloodlines just tell you that you're descended from something, if even then. Even then you've got some trouble. Arcane bloodline, for example: you're descended from...magic? How'd that work? Imperial/destined bloodlines come to mind.
As for why creatures very seldom have two types: it can cause problems with a few rules interactions. Bane weapons, for example. Favored enemy ability also comes to mind. I personally don't always agree with the prioritization (I'd put outsiders over dragons, for example), but it's mostly to avoid annoying rules issues.
Do note that templates like the half-dragon change creature type. Sometimes though, subtypes hold true, telling you what lies beneath the skin.
First is the disclaimer: never, ever, ever apply genetics to fantasy races. That way madness lies.
Now, let's examine things a bit. Half-elves and half-orcs are humanoids. Their lineages are those of humanoids: humans, elves, orcs. No creature type changes.
Tieflings and aasimar have less than half-blood. Lineages for them let you trace back to specific subtypes (e.g. pitspawn), but they're outsiders either way. Unique races with mixed traits, true enough, but their own races.
Half-fiends and others are one parent humanoid, one parent outsider (or whatnot). Maybe they ended up with enough of the outsider parent to gain specific traits of that outsider (check out Demons Revisited for examples of half-demons with specific parents), maybe not (basic half-fiend).
Class bloodlines just tell you that you're descended from something, if even then. Even then you've got some trouble. Arcane bloodline, for example: you're descended from...magic? How'd that work? Imperial/destined bloodlines come to mind.
As for why creatures very seldom have two types: it can cause problems with a few rules interactions. Bane weapons, for example. Favored enemy ability also comes to mind. I personally don't always agree with the prioritization (I'd put outsiders over dragons, for example), but it's mostly to avoid annoying rules issues.
Do note that templates like the half-dragon change creature type. Sometimes though, subtypes hold true, telling you what lies beneath the skin.
Thank you Lathiira, your explanation gives me the reason as to why though I may not agree whole heartedly with that reason. I do see your point about outsider vs dragon priority though it would make more sense to me that way also. Still for it all to basically boil down to rules feels lacking to me though being a GM who prefers to follow the rules the best I can interpret them, this makes more sense. I can actually see the other side of the coin as well A.K.A. the players point of view when it comes to this kind of ruling.
Somehow seeing it written or basically hearing this makes me feel more at ease, when ever I have to tell a player that doesn't work cause such and such is not humanoid or that isn't technically a monster it is this.