Sorcerers: can spells learned at a heightened level be selected as a Signature Spell for that level?


Rules Discussion

Exo-Guardians

the CRB entry for Signature Spells (pg 193) says the following:

Quote:

You’ve learned to cast some of your spells more flexibly.

For each spell level you have access to, choose one spell of
that level to be a signature spell.
You don’t need to learn
heightened versions of signature spells separately; instead,
you can heighten these spells freely. If you’ve learned a
signature spell at a higher level than its minimum, you
can also cast all its lower-level versions without learning
those separately. If you swap out a signature spell, you
can choose a replacement signature spell of the same spell
level at which you learned the previous spell. You can also
retrain specifically to change a signature spell to a different
spell of that level without swapping any spells; this takes as
much time as retraining a spell normally does.

My question is about the bolded sentence-- does "one spell of that level" mean a spell with that base level, or a spell you've learned at that level?

For example: Summon Animal and Summon Construct are both 1st-level spells (or at least, their minimum spell level is 1). Say i have an Arcane Sorcerer who has added Summon Animal to his repertoire as a level 1 spell, and later added Summon Construct as a level 2 spell. Can he select both Summon Animal and Summon Construct as Signature Spells (i.e. SA for spell level 1 and SC for spell level 2)? Or do both spells still count as level 1 spells, even though one of them was learned as a heightened version?


Yes, the Sorcerer can do that.


Saros Palanthios wrote:

the CRB entry for Signature Spells (pg 193) says the following:

Quote:

You’ve learned to cast some of your spells more flexibly.

For each spell level you have access to, choose one spell of
that level to be a signature spell. You don’t need to learn
heightened versions of signature spells separately; instead,
you can heighten these spells freely. If you’ve learned a
signature spell at a higher level than its minimum, you
can also cast all its lower-level versions without learning
those separately.
If you swap out a signature spell, you
can choose a replacement signature spell of the same spell
level at which you learned the previous spell. You can also
retrain specifically to change a signature spell to a different
spell of that level without swapping any spells; this takes as
much time as retraining a spell normally does.

My question is about the bolded sentence-- does "one spell of that level" mean a spell with that base level, or a spell you've learned at that level?

For example: Summon Animal and Summon Construct are both 1st-level spells (or at least, their minimum spell level is 1). Say i have an Arcane Sorcerer who has added Summon Animal to his repertoire as a level 1 spell, and later added Summon Construct as a level 2 spell. Can he select both Summon Animal and Summon Construct as Signature Spells (i.e. SA for spell level 1 and SC for spell level 2)? Or do both spells still count as level 1 spells, even though one of them was learned as a heightened version?

I believe the answer is just a little lower in the same block of text. Changed the bolding.

Exo-Guardians

Aratorin wrote:
Saros Palanthios wrote:

the CRB entry for Signature Spells (pg 193) says the following:

Quote:

You’ve learned to cast some of your spells more flexibly.

For each spell level you have access to, choose one spell of
that level to be a signature spell. You don’t need to learn
heightened versions of signature spells separately; instead,
you can heighten these spells freely. If you’ve learned a
signature spell at a higher level than its minimum, you
can also cast all its lower-level versions without learning
those separately.
If you swap out a signature spell, you
can choose a replacement signature spell of the same spell
level at which you learned the previous spell. You can also
retrain specifically to change a signature spell to a different
spell of that level without swapping any spells; this takes as
much time as retraining a spell normally does.

My question is about the bolded sentence-- does "one spell of that level" mean a spell with that base level, or a spell you've learned at that level?

For example: Summon Animal and Summon Construct are both 1st-level spells (or at least, their minimum spell level is 1). Say i have an Arcane Sorcerer who has added Summon Animal to his repertoire as a level 1 spell, and later added Summon Construct as a level 2 spell. Can he select both Summon Animal and Summon Construct as Signature Spells (i.e. SA for spell level 1 and SC for spell level 2)? Or do both spells still count as level 1 spells, even though one of them was learned as a heightened version?

I believe the answer is just a little lower in the same block of text. Changed the bolding.

Your bolded sentence indicates that spells learned at heightened levels can indeed become Signature Spells, but doesn't really say anything about what level such a spell counts as for Signature Spell purposes.


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It obviously counts as the spell you learned it at, since there is no special clause introduced that despite only knowing a spell at level X you treat it as level Y when choosing it as a signature spell.

Spells just are the level you have learned them at.


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

If you learned Summon Construct as a level 2 spell, then it counts as a level 2 spell and is available as your level 2 Signature spell.

A spell always counts as the level that you have it heightened to/casted at/learned at. Functionally when a Sorc learns Summon Construct as one of his/her level 2 spells, then it is a level 2 spell for them.


Yes.

You can pick any spell from each spell level. You are able to add a heightened spell boosted to a higher level in your repertoire. Ergo, you can select a lower level spell in a higher level slot as your signature spell for that level.

Also, the book itself says that if you have a signature spell of a level and that spell can be cast at lower level, then you can cast it at that lower level. So pretty clear there.

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