So, I was looking into ideas for a new character, and found a Skittermander grapple vanguard build elsewhere on the forums here that looked interesting.. but when talking to my GM and looking at the math, we decided not to go with it as there was a strong likelihood that it would be too good at shutting down a single target and make the combats unfun for the group - there have been similar problems in the past in Pathfinder.
I was curious if anyone else has run this, and how it worked out.
For example, at level 5, 18 DEX:
5 BAB + 4 DEX + 2 racial + 2 weapon grapple property + 1 weapon focus + 4 imp. combat maneuver = +18 vs. EAC (because vanguard)
We looked at a few CR 5-8 monsters and found roughly 17-19 EAC. Taking the higher value, for a CR8, this would mean a 9 or higher would grapple, and a 14 or higher would flat out pin. Then there's also a great likelihood that on the second round, you can succeed again, and steal an item to break the grapple.. which appears to include held weapons. While it doesn't shut down spellcasting, grappling also prevents any two handed items, so anyone with a longarm or heavy weapon is likely to be severely hampered.. and that's a CR 3 above your level. It's much easier on anything lower. Plus, with vibrogarrote, you can do entropic strike damage on top of that.
If the creature then wants to grapple you in turn, there's a good chance that they'll be able to as well (in the example above, depending on your armor, roughly an 8+ would work), but they don't get to deal damage, and unless you're pinned right back, it's likely you'll be able to regrapple on your turn. If they just attack, they suffer all the penalties and are hitting likely the most defensive party member. This may be fine for creatures with a strong attack that doesn't rely on two hands. Size differences seem to be GM discretion, but could also mitigate things.
Am I missing something here? Is it really not as strong as it seems? I'm not sure it's any one piece of this pushing it over the top.. it's the incremental bits from having the grapple weapon property and weapon focus, being able to target EAC, etc. but grapple and especially pin are so crippling that it seems like it's just too strong. It's true that sometimes you'll have a larger number of weaker enemies, but most of the time, there is a clear target that's more dangerous. I saw a lot of discussions saying combat maneuvers are too weak, but most seem to be from before the Armory and COM came out.
That's fair.. most of the other maneuvers seem to be not nearly as problematic.. except for maybe Bull Rush or the like using Add Leverage with 4-6 arms. Grapple just shuts down a lot more.
