2-00: Fate of the Scoured God

[Arc Riley]

This seems completely wrong, but the scenario seems to imply that unless a PC is a Scoured Stars Veteran they receive 0 XP for playing through this special?

Also... um, Fame awards seems insanely convoluted. As a baseline the success conditions section on page 48 says everyone gets 2 fame and 2 reputation with their slotted faction (and specifically doesn't say anything about XP).

So is it 6 (2+4) fame if applying the first benefit from Overcome the Past, or 7 (2+5) if the second? If the boon would otherwise override the fame benefits then it doesn't make sense for the 2 fame to be listed at all.

[Kyrand]

Unless a boon specifically mentions it is changing the normal scenario rewards, any effects of such a boon are usually in addition to the normal rewards. A sentence to that affect could be helpful for future, similar boons, though.

[Arc Riley]

Ok so there's an "instead" word in the boon itself. Is it instead of the 4 Fame, and/or is it instead of the 2 Reputation:slotted and 2 Fame awarded by the scenario?

Eg

Not a scoured stars veteran: 1 XP, 2 Reputation:slotted, 6 Fame (2 plus boon adds 4)

Scoured Stars Veteran: 3 XP, 5 Reputation:slotted, 5 Fame (boon gives 5 instead of 2)

Or is Scoured Stars Veteran 4 XP 7 Reputation:slotted 7 Fame?

[Kyrand]

Arc Riley wrote:

Ok so there's an "instead" word in the boon itself. Is it instead of the 4 Fame, and/or is it instead of the 2 Reputation:slotted and 2 Fame awarded by the scenario?

Eg

Not a scoured stars veteran: 1 XP, 2 Reputation:slotted, 6 Fame (2 plus boon adds 4)

Scoured Stars Veteran: 3 XP, 5 Reputation:slotted, 5 Fame (boon gives 5 instead of 2)

Or is Scoured Stars Veteran 4 XP 7 Reputation:slotted 7 Fame?

My belief is that it is instead of the 4 extra Fame. It feels weird, but my reading would also end up with the Chronicle granting a total of 4 XP, 7 Fame and 7 Reputation to a Scoured Stars Vet.

Now that we've pointed that out, though, I'm less certain I'm right, and hope Thursty can swing by for a clarification.

[Arc Riley]

Clarifications over XP/Fame rewards are among the most important, especially at a convention with out-of-town players (whereas tracking them down for corrections is especially difficult)

[Soluzar]

Also, suppose you take the 3 XP (or whatever number it ends up being). Won't this throw off your character's WBL numbers? That extra exp doesn't seem to come with any extra cash as written.

[CptJames]

Is this also subject to the "you get the credits for the level your character is, not the tier you played" like #1-99 was?

(Clarification: I haven't got the scenario yet, and I'm running it end of the month, but I'm curious about this. This happened to me in PaizoCon UK, I played a 4 in a tier 5-6, and only got level 4 credit when I slogged through 5-6. There was an issue with players, hence why I got at this table.)

[Kyrand]

Soluzar wrote:

Also, suppose you take the 3 XP (or whatever number it ends up being). Won't this throw off your character's WBL numbers? That extra exp doesn't seem to come with any extra cash as written.

That's because neither the OP or I had written out the full boon. It also includes:

2-00 boon wrote:

Apply this XP 1 point at a time, each time earning additional credits based on the subtier most appropriate to your level.

[Lindley Court]

One of my GMs is preparing tier 1-2 and 3-4, and noticed that the tier 2 Jinsul Assault Craft has +12 Engineering (2 ranks), but the tier 4 has +10 Engineering (4 ranks). That doesn't seem right.

[Ascalaphus]

If you receive the Overcome the Past boon to gain 3 XP, is that in addition to the scenario's normal XP? So 4 XP in total or 3 XP in total?

[Kishmo]

Prepping for this weekend in subtier 9-10, and I have a question about Dhurus's Divine Turbocharge ability. For reference:

Divine Turbocharge:

Divine Turbocharge (Su) Kadrical’s siphoned energy grants Dhurus exceptional agility. This ability functions as a constant haste effect, except that Dhurus can use a full attack action to use a spell-like ability and still attack once using its slam attack or all of its multiattacks. If Dhurus uses a fire pulse attack during this special action, the herald takes a –6 penalty to the attack roll. This ability cannot be dispelled or countered, but can be removed via a device or scenario condition.

K, so, as a full attack action, Dhurus can:
- Spell-Like Ability and 1 Slam @ +26
or
- SLA and Multiattack (3 Slams @ +20 each)
Everything's great so far. The part I don't understand is how the ranged Fire Pulse fits into it. Can Dhurus just add in a Fire Pulse ranged attack with a -6 penalty to it to either of the above combos? If Dhurus does SLA + 1 Slam + Fire Pulse, is the one Slam at the usual +26, or would the 1 Slam also take the usual -6 for multiattacking to become +20? I would assume so, meaning Dhurus can do something like this:
- SLA and 1 Slam @ +20 and 1 Fire Pulse @ +17

Similarly, can he add a Fire Pulse into the Multiattack combo, even though it's not in the Multiattack line? Or, asked another way, is this possible?
- SLA and Multiattack (3 Slams @ +20 each) and Fire Pulse @ +17

For even more fun, his Fire Pulse ranged has an automatic mode. So can he, for example:
- SLA and Multiattack (3 Slams @ +20 each) and Fire Pulse Automatic Mode in a 60 ft cone @ +17

That last combo seems pretty vicious to me, but I mean....he is basically a demi-god soooooooo :D

[HoloGnome]

In part 3, there is an issue that requires rules clarification relating to the biochem weapon, as follows:

Biochem Weapon:

The text of the biochem weapon states that: "This is an inhaled physical track disease (Fortitude DC 17) that bypasses the protections offered by armor."

Life Bubble, as a spell (not armor) vs. inhaled diseases, should logically provide immunity to this effect.

Life Bubble states: "It also makes the targets immune to harmful gases and vapors, including inhaled diseases and poisons as well as spells with a harmful gaseous effect."

So, unless the biochem weapon were to state that it specifically bypassed magical immunity (which goes beyond the moderate protection offered by armor environmental seals), then the PC with Life Bubble should be immune to the effect. Otherwise, if it did bypass Life Bubble, then there should be some explanation/rationale.

Please provide an explicit ruling on this issue and supplement or correct the scenario text accordingly. Thanks!

[CptJames]

HoloGnome wrote:

In part 3, there is an issue that requires rules clarification relating to the biochem weapon, as follows:

** spoiler omitted **

Please provide an explicit ruling on this issue and supplement or correct the scenario text accordingly. Thanks!

Hey HoloGnome, just to help me understand, what is your question here?

The BioChem weapon ignores armour protection, but life bubble blocks it as per the spell.

So any PC with Life Bubble is then immune to this effect.

Just trying to understand what your question is here please? :)

[Ascalaphus]

Weirdly the tier 9-10 version does have the text about bypassing armor.

I still think all these "bypasses armor" gases are a bit of a sore loser writer thing. You had an idea, it turns out this idea doesn't make that much sense in Starfinder, but you insist on doing it anyway.

[HoloGnome]

I agree that the biochem weapon should not bypass Life Bubble as explicitly stated by the spell, the weapon description and the UCR definition of Immunity, but table GMs are ruling that it does. And, honestly, this general class of issue has happened to me in other scenarios (with the whole 'special gas' thing). We all go with the table GM call in the interest of fun and focus, but some things occasionally deserve additional discussion.

So, I have posed this issue as an open question in the hope that the discussion/clarification might help eliminate adjudication issues for this scenario that result in players paying fame unnecessarily for remove affliction for diseases they never should have contracted (which happened at our table, but not to me). Maybe not a huge deal in a 6 fame scenario, but also not a correct adjudication in my opinion.

PFS/SFS rules can be complex, and since this scenario includes a special item that bypasses normal protections, it would be helpful if it had one additional clarifying sentence about not bypassing magical immunity so that GMs can adjudicate with certainty in the moment vs. applying what they believe is a good-natured best guess at RAI. It happens vs. time, prep, rules complexity, focus, etc.

Alternately, if there is some reason why it should bypass magical immunity, then in the interest of rules clarity, it requires extra explanation. In RPGs, things aren't always black and white and maybe the author had other intentions, etc. I don't know the answer to that one.

Per RAW, I don't see a reason for adjudication variation in this instance, as above, but maybe there is a different rules perspective that I'm not seeing or parsing correctly. It happens to all of us periodically, and the post-game discussion and clarification benefits the overall learning/adjudication process that makes us better GMs.

[Christopher Wasko]

@HoloGnome: The way I intended it, life bubble would prevent infection from the biochem weapon, even though armor environmental protections would not. The biochem weapons (as well as the invisible torpedoes) were inspired by the jinsul weapons development lab detailed in another scenario (spoiler below). This is also part of my rationale for their bypassing EP (though I sympathize with Lau's frustration with it coming across as a "sore loser writer thing"): Given the jinsuls' intended use for the synthetic disease as a starship weapon, part of their R&D would include devising a means for the disease to bypass the most common technological barrier to its effecting a crew. Magic, even a 1st-level life bubble spell, puts the kibosh on that because magic should be, well, magical, capable of doing things even advanced technology can't.

Scenario with Jinsul Weapons Lab:

#1-23: Return to Sender.

[HoloGnome]

Thanks - appreciate the time, response and clarification on the above! Enjoyed the scenario and diverse encounters. I missed some meta, but need to play more back-story scenarios. Tough encounters in a party of 4 at 7-8. Still reflecting on it, especially as a mystic vs. mind-affecting immunity. Wish these things had 4-player adjustments! ;-)

[Ascalaphus]

Christopher Wasko wrote:

(though I sympathize with Lau's frustration with it coming across as a "sore loser writer thing")

Yeah sorry if that came across as a bit harsh. I generally like your writing :)

The problem with these armor-penetrating gases is that they've shown up several times already, so you get a bit of tarring with the same brush.

I think actually a more elegant approach might have been to specifically also let it go through Life Bubble; if you go through the effort of developing a weapon that just ignores level 10 armor, you can also deal with a level 1 spell. It's not like the Jinsuls are ignorant about magic like the Androffans were in Iron Gods. (And it looks less like the writer forgot about basic spells.)

However as a counterpoint to that, include a line in the conclusion of the scenario that the Society foots the bill for removing the disease. Having to handle a disease at the end of the scenario is always a bit irritating. So this fast-acting disease plays a role in the rest of the scenario, but after the great victory, you don't have to go hat in hand to the doctor to spend your fame to get cured.

[HoloGnome]

I agree with Lau about it showing up as a mechanic in other places, and I have also encountered it. But, for me, from a design standpoint, I would suggest a simple solution where special effects - like gases, diseases, whatever - have a level to them. And, when they have a special ability - like bypassing armor, instead of just arbitrarily saying they bypass all protections or dissolve the seals with acid, etc., they should resolve against the level of the protection conferred by the PC's item in a tier-appropriate manner (or maybe there is an item saving throw or other bonus to the PC save).

It's certainly simple to say it just bypasses, but maybe it merits some relative level considerations. The existing mechanic resolves vs. the player save and maybe that's good enough. But, if a player walks away from a scenario saying "my level 10 environmental seals weren't good enough? really??", then maybe it needs other mechanical consideration.

And, if you want to bypass immunity conferred by a spell in special circumstances, then add a "penetrating" effect that has to make an SR check that tracks the PC caster level and spell level or something similar. I'd have to think about it, but that would be one way to do it, which might then be a case for upper-level Life Bubbles that could be downcast. It's more detail...maybe it adds no value and level 1 immunity is good enough as the simplest solution. I don't know.

There might be a design gap in this general area of the SF rules, but YMMV.

[John Mangrum]

Hey all. I'm making plans around this scenario for my home game, and while I'll definitely be buying 2-00 as soon as it becomes available at the end of June, I don't have access to it until then so it's a bit of a blind spot for me right now. If it's all right, could someone spoil what the payoff reward for the Journey to the Scoured Stars boons are?

Spoiler:

From what I can gather, I think it's an XP boost, but I don't know anything past that.

[CptJames]

Hey John,

Check the Starfinder Society Guild Guide 2.0, it has the answers in there! No need for spoilers.

It can be found here - Page 40

[John Mangrum]

Ah, indeed! Totally overlooked it! Thanks.