So I've been DM'ing and wanted to create some Mystic Theurge NPCs for my game, but the class is just generally considered subpar and I don't want to bore my players with trash mobs that took too long for me to make. So I created This 5 level prestige class that would patch up the Mystic Theurge retroactively. Now, I showed one of my players the document and he is considering switching his character to become a MT.
So now I really need to know: is this custom prestige class balanced as-is, or could it use some work? What would you do differently to change it? I figured giving a spellcasting level back to each side of Mystic Theurge and keeping your caster level up would be incentive enough to get people to dip their toes into the prestige class finally. Thoughts?
Cross-posted from r/Pathfinder_RPG
You could let it advance non-spellcasting class abilities in some capacity. That would make it attractive to druids and witches and such, instead of the classic cleric/wizard combo, who don't lose too much in the way of non-spellcasting class abilities.
Giving a level of spellcasting would also help. One of the theurge's problems is that you can have as many spells as you want, but you still only get one or two every round (and quickened spells are a pain for theurges). Find ways to let the theurge out of their traditional "utility and buffing" role, maybe something like an arcanist's pool that lets you boost spell DC to compensate for lower spell levels.
It does fix the MT's main problem which is being weak from character levels 4-6 and taking too long to recover. You still need to be MAD, probably madder.
I'm not sure I understand Prodigious Spellcasting. Specifically, what does bonus spells from ability score have to do with caster level? Or is it two entirely independent things (one good, one bad) that should be in separate features?
It seems a bit odd to have the whole 5 levels worth of Diverse Training all in one go at the end. I'd have it applying throughout, from 1st level.
Mystic theurges don't have to be MAD. Sorcerer and oracle stack just fine, as do any non-oracle divine caster and empyreal bloodline sorcerer... or sorcerer and elder mythos cultist cleric...
It just takes some creativity.
Almost forgot the feyspeaker druid. That's a good one, too... especially if you've got the fey bloodline for extra synergy.
The Mystic Theurge was designed to give access to a wider selection of spells. Some of the latter classes have filled that role, making the class even less appealing. Witches and Shamans are often better choices for a mixed caster concept.
The Mystic Theurge was designed to give access to a wider selection of spells. Some of the latter classes have filled that role, making the class even less appealing. Witches and Shamans are often better choices for a mixed caster concept.
I'd say it's even more than that. According to the 3.5 handbook, a Mystic Theurge is "Blurring the line between divine and arcane", but that line is barely existent in Pathfinder anyway. With domain spells, deity specific extra Cleric spells, and Bloodline spells, even the CRB classes blur that line and can grab plenty of spells traditionally on the other side of the "devide", and classes like Witch and Shaman do it even more.
There are two hundred non-Cleric Wizard spells that are granted by domains, and over 120 non-Oracle Wizard spells granted by Mysteries. A Witch has access to literally half the Cleric spell list, and over 150 non-Wizard Cleric spells. Also, over 57% of spells on the Cleric list are also Wizard spells.
Doing some fiddling with my spreadsheet, I've compared spell access at 12th level, and found that even with Prestigious Spellcaster, MT + Mystic Acolyte would not have the largest access - Wiz1/Cle1/MA5/MT5 would have access to 1956 spells; a human or half-human Lore Shaman would have access to 2031 spells.
@Mudfoot/TheGreatWot: Most SAD MT options require using a spontaneous caster, thus delaying the MT by another level, but Seducer Witch combined with either Elder Mythos Cultist Cleric of Feyspeaker Druid allows a SAD MT at 7th level (without any prereq-cheating).
@Everyone with an interest in MT: Something I've been wondering for a while, did you start with Pathfinder, or did you play 3.x before? Because with all the options mentioned above, as someone who started with PF, I don't see the appeal at all. So I wonder, is the allure only nostalgia based, i.e. "it was cool in 3.5, so I want to play it in PF"?
The heck is a mystic acolyte?
The heck is a mystic acolyte?
The OP's proposed 5-level prestige class (see the first post).
The heck is a mystic acolyte?The OP's proposed 5-level prestige class (see the first post).
Ah, sorry, I can't view Google Docs here. That makes Derklord's post make even less sense to me, though. The proposed class change (or maybe just the original class's concept?) is bad because a hypothetical multiclass between the new version and old version would provide access to more spells?
Bury it, it's Friday and my brain is apparently fried.