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I am a huge avid pathfinder player.
I run PFS scenarios, several gm stars, endorse the game, dm specials.
I've put much time into the game, time I consider well spent.
I love this game so much
But with the playtest I feel that I am losing my favorite game.
People in my city (a large city) are falling off, we had days when we needed a GM or two on standby just for overfill.
Now we have weeks where not enough players show to make one table.
I do not like the direction of the playtest and people around me are feeling the same way.
I understand feedback was to make a better game but I feel the feedback is not being minded.
I the people in our PFS community can just keep playing the 1st as if nothing changed but the lack of the paizo support hurts.
I know others may feel differently I'm just stating where I am coming from.
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Yeah if you didn't like PF2, yeah the change will feel like a punch in the gut. Losing 'access' to new content make the game a bit less exiting and it is sad that the people inside your city are not interested in PF2.
In my town it's exactly the opposite, people are actually playing PF now, instead of 7 D&D tables at my local game store so i am pretty happy with the change. Even my main table is currently in the process of transition to 2e.
But yeah... PF2 will be a thing, i don't think they invested 6 months in a playtest to not release the product.
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I am a huge avid pathfinder player.
I run PFS scenarios, several gm stars, endorse the game, dm specials.
I've put much time into the game, time I consider well spent.
I love this game so much
But with the playtest I feel that I am losing my favorite game.
People in my city (a large city) are falling off, we had days when we needed a GM or two on standby just for overfill.
Now we have weeks where not enough players show to make one table.
I do not like the direction of the playtest and people around me are feeling the same way.
I understand feedback was to make a better game but I feel the feedback is not being minded.
I the people in our PFS community can just keep playing the 1st as if nothing changed but the lack of the paizo support hurts.I know others may feel differently I'm just stating where I am coming from.
Don't worry. We only make up about 4% of the playerbase at the moment, so Pathfinder the brand won't be going anywhere.
It's disappointing your area isn't even continuing with PFS. If you had a stable crew of players I'd definitely recommend reaching out to them and starting a home game with them.
@ShadeRaven: It makes complete sense to me that your 5e groups would love PF2e playtest so much. That is entirely consistent with what I have observed among my own group.
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But with the playtest I feel that I am losing my favorite game.
I feel for you. I suspect you will still be able to play PF1, but not organized play, unless you were willing to translate the PF2 PFS adventures back to PF1. If you're willing to let players run 2 PCs, or "bot" a cleric perhaps you can keep a PF1 table going on the side in a PFS event.
For what its worth, in my town folks seem to be of mixed opinions about PF2. I'm in two weekly games and one of them is sticking with PF1. The other game is part of the playtest and might go with PF2, but its too early to tell. The playtest has not been a runaway hit, nor has it been a total flop. Personally speaking, I'll keep running as part of the DM rotation in the PF1 game, but I'll drop out of doing that in the second game if it goes with PF2. I dislike PF2 but not so much that I won't play it in order to hang out with friends. I don't think it fits with me as a DM.
If it's a consolation, it was said in the last Twitch stream that the playtest is not exactly what 2e will be.
No, it won't be 1st edition, but take a few breaths until you see it.
No one can ever take away the older version of something you enjoyed just by putting out a new version of it - all that old stuff is still going to be there for you to revisit.
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For what it's worth, I think overall the game hasn't actually changed as much as people think. Sure there are some things that are totally different, the entire outmoded core of 3.x has been left behind after a solid nearly 20 year run. But Pathfinder is still Pathfinder, for some that means super crunchy highly math based builds that lead in every possible direction and almost always ignore fluff, for others it's the shelter from the flood that was 4e. And still for others it's found a new life as the system where your choices matter. I don't think PF2 is really abandoning it's core as much as people think. In fact you can look at this in the same way the Honda Motor Company upgrades their Accord line, at it's core it's still a hyper reliable engine with good driving characteristics, the engine itself has changed many times over the years, and new technologies have been added, but it's still an Accord, It's still reliable, and it still drives very well.
In that vein, PF2 will still be Pathfinder, The engine got an upgrade, and we finally got airbags, but it's still Pathfinder, it's the system we have driven for ten years, but with a new engine and new features. Now we need to wait for all our favorite accessories and mods to come out for it.
I didn't think 3rd ed was recognizable as AD&D, and it took that game some time to grow on me.
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I've lost my favourite game, or at least, I've had the company stop making supplements for it, and the masses moving to the newer system. It's not a good feeling, but I've found my favourite RPGs once I got off the supplement treadmill, and my best ever campaign happened once the system stopped releasing new crunch material for players.
It's no fun not being one of the cool kids, but in a few years, something new will come along that will be your thing. PF2 has been that for me, and 2018 has been a nice surprise for me. :)
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For what it's worth, I think overall the game hasn't actually changed as much as people think. Sure there are some things that are totally different, the entire outmoded core of 3.x has been left behind after a solid nearly 20 year run. But Pathfinder is still Pathfinder, for some that means super crunchy highly math based builds that lead in every possible direction and almost always ignore fluff, for others it's the shelter from the flood that was 4e. And still for others it's found a new life as the system where your choices matter. I don't think PF2 is really abandoning it's core as much as people think. In fact you can look at this in the same way the Honda Motor Company upgrades their Accord line, at it's core it's still a hyper reliable engine with good driving characteristics, the engine itself has changed many times over the years, and new technologies have been added, but it's still an Accord, It's still reliable, and it still drives very well.
In that vein, PF2 will still be Pathfinder, The engine got an upgrade, and we finally got airbags, but it's still Pathfinder, it's the system we have driven for ten years, but with a new engine and new features. Now we need to wait for all our favorite accessories and mods to come out for it.
I feel a better comparison would be a change from gas to electric motor. For some it's a marked upgrade, and something they've been clambering for for years. But for others it's a completely unworkable change, for any number of reasons, meaning they'll have to abandon the product line. Whether you think it's a notable change likely depends on what your needs are in a vehicle.
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In that vein, PF2 will still be Pathfinder, The engine got an upgrade, and we finally got airbags, but it's still Pathfinder, it's the system we have driven for ten years, but with a new engine and new features.
I don't find the current PF2 much like pathfinder: it's much, much more than an engine change, but like a change from an airplane into a boat. Sure both has an engine and are vehicles, but they perform very differently and are used for different things.
As of our last update, I can't see a character going to sleep in PF1 and wake up in PF2 and not notice a massive change: to me that makes it seem like a totally different game. It might turn out to be a decent fantasy RPG but it takes more than that to make it pathfinder.
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@ShadeRaven: It makes complete sense to me that your 5e groups would love PF2e playtest so much. That is entirely consistent with what I have observed among my own group.
Weird, in my group the two die-hard 5e fans are the ones who most dislike the playtest rules. One in particular has hated almost everything about the system and the steps it's taken.
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In that vein, PF2 will still be Pathfinder, The engine got an upgrade, and we finally got airbags, but it's still Pathfinder, it's the system we have driven for ten years, but with a new engine and new features.I don't find the current PF2 much like pathfinder: it's much, much more than an engine change, but like a change from an airplane into a boat. Sure both has an engine and are vehicles, but they perform very differently and are used for different things.
As of our last update, I can't see a character going to sleep in PF1 and wake up in PF2 and not notice a massive change: to me that makes it seem like a totally different game. It might turn out to be a decent fantasy RPG but it takes more than that to make it pathfinder.
Then what makes it Pathfinder? Because I don't think you and I have the same definition of what makes Pathfinder, Pathfinder. I'd really like to know, because most of the time you and a lot of other people come off as hating the system just to hate the system.
I really want to know what the other side thinks, and where they come from, since knowing both sides is really the only way to actually work through the mess that has been people's opinions. Though In hindsight, I'll just post the question in a different thread becasue it's a bit broad for just a simple back and forth inside of a thread we're probably going to derail.
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In that vein, PF2 will still be Pathfinder, The engine got an upgrade, and we finally got airbags, but it's still Pathfinder, it's the system we have driven for ten years, but with a new engine and new features. Now we need to wait for all our favorite accessories and mods to come out for it.
The engine did not get an upgrade...they took the old engine, and threw it out the window. It is like going from a diesel engine to a 100% electric engine...sure, they have a few vague similarities, but at their core they are very different.
Director of Game Design
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Folks,
While I can appreciate you wanting to debate how the new game might relate to the old game, using the playtest as a lens for that analysis, I am not sure there is anything in this thread that is helpful to our process. Not to mention that this has only a passing reference to the OP.
I hope that the original poster can find something they like in the new version of Pathfinder when they get a chance to see it.
This thread is locked.