The weapon accessories in Armory make long ranged fights (and medium ranged fights with short range weapons) much more feasible if you're willing to invest some early action economy.
1. A heavy bipod on a longarm requires a move action to set up, but then grants a -2 reduction of your total range/full attack penalties. For range that's just equivalent to one range increment, which can be mitigated through other means, but for a full attack within the first range increment that is HUGE. Soldiers can pull off -4/-4/-4 full attacks in their second round, and all the 3/4 BAB classes will find full attacks much more enticing at -2/-2. The DPS advantage of full attacking just got better.
The unstated assumption here is that you maintain this advantage until forced to move out of your location where you engaged the bipod, so this also adds a tactical element and benefit for picking solid places to brace your weapon and to try to flush people out and make them shoot less accurately.
2. In addition to a bipod, you can use a scope or sight with a move action. Both, depending on version, can reduce range/cover penalties by 2 or 4. So if you're not full attacking, you can reduce range/cover penalties by up to 6 on a sniper, longarm, or heavy weapon by using both a top end scope/sight and a heavy bipod. If you invested in that feat that reduces range penalties, that's up to seven range increments you can shoot without a penalty.
But wait, there's more! A scope is strictly superior to a sight (and therefore slightly more expensive and higher item level) because you also increase your longarm/sniper/heavy weapon range increment by four.
This basically puts snipers out of business at most non-crazy ranges, given that they don't do more damage than a good longarm or heavy weapon. But it also makes short ranged long arms and heavy weapons very viable. A disintegrator weapon only has a range increment of 20-30 feet to go with its fantastic high (but variable) damage. However, if you use a high end scope you can shoot 240-360' feet without any range penalty - 80-120' increment, and -4 penalty for the second and third increment are wiped away.
(It's not stated but I assume that you have to be aiming at a single target through your scope, so you can't use this to multiply a blast or automatic weapon engagement range by four.)
Again, like with the bipod sight/scope usage has action economy and mobility downsides. But for tough enemies at range and in cover, it might be worth it to spend your first round on a pair of move actions to engage your bipod and then scope on your target, so that you can do some really nasty full attacks until that target is down or you're forced to move. (Movement will presumably require both to reset, while killing the target but not moving will keep your bipod engaged but require you to scope a new target as a move action.)
The scope/sight are no brainers, as they don't compete with any good top rail accessories, but I will note that the bipod on the bottom rail competes with a bayonet bracket or a grenadier bracket. You have to choose between better ranged/full attack capability, melee flexibility/preparedness, or an area of effect option.
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Yep, they are pretty cool. Note though that using a bipod and a sight/scope at the same time can be quite difficult, depending on what you're trying to do.
If you're using the bipod to reduce penalties on full attacks, then you're not using your move actions to aim with the sight or scope.
You could brace and aim in one round, and full attack in the next, but that takes a bit of setup, and the sight/scope benefits only apply to the first attack of the full attack.
Quite frankly, I loved how they balanced out the mechanics for the accesories. They are seriously useful, without completely overshadowing a character without accessories, and can't be stacked on such a way as to end up with an uberweapon.
The weapon accessories in Armory make long ranged fights (and medium ranged fights with short range weapons) much more feasible if you're willing to invest some early action economy.
1. A heavy bipod on a longarm requires a move action to set up, but then grants a -2 reduction of your total range/full attack penalties. For range that's just equivalent to one range increment, which can be mitigated through other means, but for a full attack within the first range increment that is HUGE. Soldiers can pull off -4/-4/-4 full attacks in their second round, and all the 3/4 BAB classes will find full attacks much more enticing at -2/-2. The DPS advantage of full attacking just got better.
The unstated assumption here is that you maintain this advantage until forced to move out of your location where you engaged the bipod, so this also adds a tactical element and benefit for picking solid places to brace your weapon and to try to flush people out and make them shoot less accurately.
2. In addition to a bipod, you can use a scope or sight with a move action. Both, depending on version, can reduce range/cover penalties by 2 or 4. So if you're not full attacking, you can reduce range/cover penalties by up to 6 on a sniper, longarm, or heavy weapon by using both a top end scope/sight and a heavy bipod. If you invested in that feat that reduces range penalties, that's up to seven range increments you can shoot without a penalty.
But wait, there's more! A scope is strictly superior to a sight (and therefore slightly more expensive and higher item level) because you also increase your longarm/sniper/heavy weapon range increment by four.
This basically puts snipers out of business at most non-crazy ranges, given that they don't do more damage than a good longarm or heavy weapon. But it also makes short ranged long arms and heavy weapons very viable. A disintegrator weapon only has a range increment of 20-30 feet to go with its fantastic high (but variable) damage. However, if you use a...
One nice thing is there is also a class of sniper weapons that is not unwieldy now. So pretty handy for people with sniper weapon spec in that it basically works like a normal long arm but if you have a time and place to really setup shop you can shoot things from way far away.
Talking about accessories: Skip bipods and go straight to Gunner's Harnesses! You don't have to root yourself in place and get to reduce the penalty on your full attacks with ranged weapons.
I did a bit of math after Armory came out and WOW is the mid-to-high-level heavy weapons soldier really dangerous with these! Does significantly more damage than a melee soldier due to the reduced penalty.
I note that Accurate weapon fusion apparently can use the same move action as a scope/sight to obtain that +1 attack bonus.
Talking about accessories: Skip bipods and go straight to Gunner's Harnesses! You don't have to root yourself in place and get to reduce the penalty on your full attacks with ranged weapons.
I did a bit of math after Armory came out and WOW is the mid-to-high-level heavy weapons soldier really dangerous with these! Does significantly more damage than a melee soldier due to the reduced penalty.
Energy heavy weapons are kind of bad at single target DPS, though, compared to longarms. Or at least not much better overall. Their main benefit is to get a blast, explode, line, or penetrating effect, not more damage itself. Most of them don't even allow full attacks. But yeah, I can see a Soldier going for an artillery laser, hailcannon, reaction cannon, machine gun, x-gen gun, colossus coil, or resonator with a gunner's harness.
Edit: Actually, long range explode shots gain from this, too, due to the range penalty reduction to hit and reflex save DC, as do automatic weapons. I guess it's just unwieldy (blast, line, no reason at all) weapons that don't benefit, which is a smaller proportion of heavy weapons.
Talking about accessories: Skip bipods and go straight to Gunner's Harnesses! You don't have to root yourself in place and get to reduce the penalty on your full attacks with ranged weapons.
This only works on heavy weapons though, and is totally useless with longarms. If you've got a longarm, the bipod is strictly better.
Shame they don't stack. Guess that'd be broken though.
They did a really good job with not making the accessories overpowered, but true accessories.
I like the rule about having only a certain amount of rails on your gun too. That way you can't have a bayonet bracket on top of a bipod with a grenade launcher underneath with a scope and sight on top.
Being able to attach any type of light size weapon to your bayonet bracket gives you some fun role playing choices to make. Do you want your space goblin soldier to attach a hand axe to his junk laser. Go for it!
They did a really good job with not making the accessories overpowered, but true accessories.
Totally agree!
How does one manage accessory bulk though? I found the rules regarding it somewhat confusing.
Do you just add it together, per the normal bulk rules, unless the base weapon is L bulk, in which case the combined bulk is a minimum of 1?
I'd say just add them together with everything else you have that is L bulk.
I haven't seen any ranged fighters ripping through things the way the melee people have been. So far most of my games have had melee quizinarcs with spellcasting, envoy, and operative ranged.
Maybe the accessories will make ranged combat more of a thing for soldiers.
Downside to bipods is the need to use a move action to brace it before getting the bonus and losing the bonus every time you move.
Makes for a semi realistic tactical rifleman feel. First turn move action to run to cover, swift action to go prone, move action to brace your weapon using your bipod. Second round full attack. If you have two rifleman you can use fire and movement tactics with one putting down covering fire and the other moving. It would work great if both soldiers had the kip up feat.
They did a really good job with not making the accessories overpowered, but true accessories.Totally agree!
How does one manage accessory bulk though? I found the rules regarding it somewhat confusing.
Do you just add it together, per the normal bulk rules, unless the base weapon is L bulk, in which case the combined bulk is a minimum of 1?
Here's the appropriate language.
In either case, add the bulk of the weapon accessory to the weapon’s bulk to determine the final accessorized weapon’s bulk. When adding multiple items of light bulk together, treat 2–10 light bulk items as 1 bulk when combined.
So you get one free L bulk item, but 2+ round up to an additional 1 bulk on your weapon.
Talking about accessories: Skip bipods and go straight to Gunner's Harnesses! You don't have to root yourself in place and get to reduce the penalty on your full attacks with ranged weapons.This only works on heavy weapons though, and is totally useless with longarms. If you've got a longarm, the bipod is strictly better.
Shame they don't stack. Guess that'd be broken though.
Note that the gunner's harness itself is 2 bulk. Add a 2-3 bulk weapon, and two L accessories upping your weapon another 1 bulk, and you're getting pretty heavy before you get to your armor and other gear.
Downside to bipods is the need to use a move action to brace it before getting the bonus and losing the bonus every time you move.
Where's the rule that says you lose the benefit if you move (or anything else for that matter)?
Note that the gunner's harness itself is 2 bulk. Add a 2-3 bulk weapon, and two L accessories upping your weapon another 1 bulk, and you're getting pretty heavy before you get to your armor and other gear.
Except the language only applies when adding multiple items of L bulk. If the base weapon is greater than light bulk, I think you just use normal math.
By your example, a 3 bulk artillary laser with a gunner's harness, scope, and grenadier bracket would be 6 bulk.
By mine, it would only be 5.2 bulk.
Downside to bipods is the need to use a move action to brace it before getting the bonus and losing the bonus every time you move.Where's the rule that says you lose the benefit if you move (or anything else for that matter)?
They didn't state it, but I think it's clearly implied. You have to use a move action to either (1) set down your bipod on a surface or (2) grasp the bipod as a grip to get the benefit. If you elect (1), you clearly lose contact with the surface when you move. I think the intent is that (2) be treated mechanically the same, and you lose/relax your grip if you move.
Note that the gunner's harness itself is 2 bulk. Add a 2-3 bulk weapon, and two L accessories upping your weapon another 1 bulk, and you're getting pretty heavy before you get to your armor and other gear.
Except the language only applies when adding multiple items of L bulk. If the base weapon is greater than light bulk, I think you just use normal math.
By your example, a 3 bulk artillary laser with a gunner's harness, scope, and grenadier bracket would be 6 bulk.
By mine, it would only be 5.2 bulk.
Hmm, you might be right.
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There is no language stating that the bipod loses stabilization when you move. If employing the bipod always required setting up on a surface (you know, like bipods work) there would be no need for the language.
The decision to add in the nonsense about getting the same level of stability by using it as a forward grip removes the logical restriction, without an additional clause, and will likely lead to a lot of people carrying weapons around in a forward-gripped position, and thereby gaining the full benefits of the bipod without ever spending the move action to set up.
EDIT: I am absolutely not endorsing this as the something that SHOULD work. But that's the item that got published.
Simplest way to make the bipod/forward grip not over powered is to interpret the rule as saying you must take a move action to re-stabilize your weapon to get the bonus if you moved. Doesn't matter if you are using the bipod or the forward grip you have to re-stabilize after movement.
I also interpret the rules as saying that you cannot stabilize with the forward grip until you have a target to aim at thus you have to take a move action to stabilize in the first round before full attacking.
It doesn't state this in the rules as written, but if you don't do this the bipod is overpowered.
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I also interpret the rules as saying that you cannot stabilize with the forward grip until you have a target to aim at thus you have to take a move action to stabilize in the first round before full attacking.
I don't see anything in either the rules or the physics of the thing that would remotely suggest that. You could very easily brace yourself at a door or behind some sandbags and be all set to shoot the zombie walking through.
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It doesn't state this in the rules as written, but if you don't do this the bipod is overpowered.
Just depends on what Paizo intended.
Did they want you to be able to move around at all times with your weapon stabilized using the forward grip and therefore able to use the bonus to full attack immediately or did they intend you to use some of your action economy to stabilize.
I'm interpreting it as the latter since all the rules for scopes, sights, and bipods all have wording that state you need to use a move action in some way to deploy them correctly.
The exception might be where you have a chance to prepare for combat before the initiative roll happens. However, a lot of the rules for scopes, sights, and bipods go out the window if you have a chance to set up an ambush before the initiative roll.
Bipods require two move actions. One to flip it out, and another to stabilize it.
There's absolutely nothing stopping someone from doing that out of combat however.
When you lose the stabilization is the point of contention that is in need of clarification.
Bipods require two move actions. One to flip it out, and another to stabilize it.
There's absolutely nothing stopping someone from doing that out of combat however.
When you lose the stabilization is the point of contention that is in need of clarification.
Moving would seem to be the best answer based on
1) striking a balance between usability and being always on
2) the physics of how the thing works.
Logically, I feel like you should be able to hold a grip and keep a weapon stable, even in between moves.
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Logically, I feel like you should be able to hold a grip and keep a weapon stable, even in between moves.
In which case there would be no reason at all to require any kind of action to stabalize, you'd wake up eat breakfast and spend the move action and go.
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Logically, I feel like you should be able to hold a grip and keep a weapon stable, even in between moves.In which case there would be no reason at all to require any kind of action to stabalize, you'd wake up eat breakfast and spend the move action and go.
This occurred to me as well, and is a fairly strong argument, but it would still matter if you ever needed to change handedness (such as when switching weapons, or freeing up a hand to pull a lever or to climb or something).