After a bit of discussion from another PC that is our group's min-maxer, I have been left with the distinct impression that DEX is the most important ability score for all the stuff that it does. Mainly, it adds to initiative and AC among other things. The best starting armor you can by is Freebooter I with +2/+3, and a dex of 18 more than doubles it to a total AC of +6/+7. Frankly, that is ridiculous. From a mechanical perspective, why would a combat character not have dex be their best score?
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Oh yes, Dex is VERY overloaded right now. It controls
>EAC
>KAC
>Ranged Attacks
>Init
And that's not even counting skills.
Oh yes, Dex is VERY overloaded right now. It controls
>EAC
>KAC
>Ranged Attacks
>InitAnd that's not even counting skills.
+ Saves
+DC for Grenades| 10 people marked this as a favorite. |
In answer to the title of the thread:
Yes.
Add to IkiryO's list: Grenade saves, both theirs to make and your Ref.
And Gunners & Pilots need it for Starship combat.
And re-emphasis on EAC/KAC due to Dex being the most significant way to increase those outside of the armors themselves.
This key aspect of defense makes Dex crucial to all combatants, which means (most) everyone.
In answer to why would a combat character not have Dex be best:
Because they may have enough Dex for defense and their offense doesn't use Dex.
If the PC is wearing Heavy Armor (which even factoring in Dex is slightly better than Light at most levels), then Dex's defensive significance drops once the PC hits the Dex limit. So Dex's main use would come from offense.
But if the PC uses Str for attack rolls or spells w/o attack rolls (et al) then Dex's offensive significance drops too.
At this point I'd say Dex falls to second place, with whatever stat powers the PC's offense as first.
And then there's the question of what is a combat character?
I was looking at the broader perspective of how most PCs need to contribute to combat, but what about PCs whose primary task is combat?
Barring some rare, eccentric builds, it comes down to Str or Dex.
Ranged builds can go without Str and be effective (as my own Ysoki Soldier has shown me), but on the other hand Str allows for Heavy Armor and the ability to carry more weapons, or wield Heavy Weapons. So even a ranged specialist can benefit from Str, just as a melee specialist can benefit from Dex.
Except Str has two advantages Dex can't duplicate:
-Str works for both melee and ranged (via thrown weapons).
-Str adds to damage, doubling offense at lower levels. This, of course, makes for a great defense too. :)
Operative weapons bypass the first, but those work well only for Operatives which due to Resolve, should have Dex maxed out. But they lag behind Soldiers & Solarians for damage. For other combat focused PCs, these advantages put Str to the fore.
And melee has advantages too:
-You threaten squares
-You don't provoke when threatened, or have to guarded step back and lose a full attack.
But ranged is ranged, right? You can get more attacks in.
I had imagined Starfinder battles would be far more "pew-pew", with hangar bays, lots of cover to dart between, and crossfire being the go to tactic. I'm finding the battles actually "stabbity-stab" & "claw-claw-bite". The confines are more often tight, with lots of corridor or room-to-room fighting. In published adventures, I've seen less advantage to being ranged than to having a melee weapon out and ready to full attack. Distances get closed really fast, and SF has lots of mobility options available early so melee PCs can engage within a round. And in those rare battles where they can't, and there's no full cover, they can move & throw. I have a friend playing a Vesk Soldier who bought a cool thrown weapon knowing he'd need it, but other than using it against an incorporeal creature (it's magical and his pike isn't) he's thrown it maybe once? He's level 5 and doesn't even have the mobility tech augmentations yet.
Plus, it's pretty rough for a party without a melee to fend off the attackers rushing in on the party's secondary combatants who likely do use ranged weapons (and arguably should). They have to scatter to shoot, if there's room...
So for PCs whose secondary job is combat, I agree that Dex is the most important combat stat (because they likely need the bulk of their other stat points in their Resolve stat w/o enough to do Str too.)
But for PCs whose primary job is combat, melee is the better route, and Str makes for the best melee builds.
Or at least that's what I'm seeing in play.
This ^
Castilliano, I think that is a great summation.
Hmmm, I see. So Dex is the go to unless you want to go broly-hulk smash-punchy-face melee.
With all that said, what about CON? I feel like it's a bit of an afterthought when considering other scores.
Yeah. Dex is God, Con is almost a dump stat.
We've allowed gunnery to be based on str, dex, or int for gunnery, dependent on how the gun is mounted etc and to make the two high str PCs an effective role in space combat
Yeah. Dex is God, Con is almost a dump stat.
We've allowed gunnery to be based on str, dex, or int for gunnery, dependent on how the gun is mounted etc and to make the two high str PCs an effective role in space combat
Seems like a cool house rule. When it comes to be my time to GM, I might borrow that. Though this next bit crosses into personal griping territory, I'm kinda bummed that that CON isn't the relevant stat for survivability. I might have to come up with a house rule or two to make CON a bit more worthwhile.
Con is still important, it's just secondary. You will want to spend increases in it as you level up, it just isn't as important starting out. With the poison and disease setup the way they are you are going to want a good fortitude save.
Con is less important than it is in PF because your baseline health pool has increased so much, but it's still boosting an important save and more health is still great, especially as the game progresses. I wouldn't call it a dump stat.