I find that there are a lot of items and weapon/armour qualities which are never used because they sound cool and useful until you realise that at level 12 a DC14 Save is never going to be failed so you may as well take the less interesting item or effect which is at least a guaranteed bonus.
I am not sure what the best way to improve this is , at the moment my idea is to have the item saving throw scale with the primary attribute of the using character.
I don't intend to apply this to wands but to miscallaneous items of various sorts , weapons, armour etc.
Any better ideas would be much appreciated
I'd scale with 1/2 character level of the user to represent better expertise by more experienced characters and keeping the base primary stat mod the same to represent the basic power level of the item.
I'd scale with 1/2 character level of the user to represent better expertise by more experienced characters and keeping the base primary stat mod the same to represent the basic power level of the item.
While that does put the bonus on the experience of the character, it is important to remember that most items are based off of spells, and the mechanics of spells (and spell-like abilities) means DC= 10 + spell level + ability bonus. Of course one could change the formula to emulate Supernatural and Extraordinary abilities, DC= 10 + half level + ability mod.
I don't yet have an opinion on what the best solution is, although I support the idea. I just wanted to point out JohnHawkins suggestion is less "invasive".
As and aside, I have long considered abandoning the spell DC formula altogether. Changing to 10 + half caster (or character) level + ability mod, would go a long way toward renewing the usefulness of lower level spells, and especially magic items (you could increase the effective CL). I originally thought character level was better, it would allow a higher level character who multiclassed in a spellcasting class to be effective. However, I have come to think that such transitions need not be catered to. After all, in PF the only good reason for such a major shift in character class is likely of the munchkin-dip sort.
I'd scale with 1/2 character level of the user to represent better expertise by more experienced characters and keeping the base primary stat mod the same to represent the basic power level of the item.While that does put the bonus on the experience of the character, it is important to remember that most items are based off of spells, and the mechanics of spells (and spell-like abilities) means DC= 10 + spell level + ability bonus. Of course one could change the formula to emulate Supernatural and Extraordinary abilities, DC= 10 + half level + ability mod.
the 1/2 level just makes you treat it as the highest level spell you could cast. Pretty within the pathfinder formula. I like this kind of system primarily because linking it to the characters ability mod rather than character level encourages and rewards stat stacking and ability scores uber alles. I just feel your basic attributes already have way too much influence on character power. Linking them to item use exacerbates that.
Thanks for the thoughts. UMD is out as that is just a skill tax if I used it and limits items to classes with good Cha or lots of skills.
Looking at the 2 options (1/2 level or stat) assume base item save of 14
PC Lvl(stat) Level appropriate spell DC Item DC STAT Item DC lvl
1 (18) 15 18 15
4 (19) 16 18 16
8 (22) 20 20 18
12 (25) 23 21 20
16 (28) 27 23 22
20 (34) 31 26 24
The stats are fairly typical for what my players end up with for their main stat ,(unless I make a mistake and let them get templates then what happens is my own fault)
I am only really interested in the lvl 8 +comparison as at lower level I don't expect many of these items. Not sure which one I will implement
|
There are already some mechanics in the game to boost save DCs for items, under very specific circumstances, such as the [url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/prestige-classes/other-paizo/c-d/cyphermage/]Cyphermage's abilities.
I'd be inclined to go with something like the expanded use of Use Magic Device, or build in some sort of cost to the option to use your own stat bonuses/feats to boost the DC, like expending a spell of equal level (as a free action) to the one being used from the item.
A feat tax might alternately (or additionally) be an option.
I'd have permenent items scale with 10 + 1/2 level + cha mod. That way charisma has a little something nice and the items never becomes irrelevant Maybe. only use your cha mod if it is higher then the minimum to cast the spell normally.
You could add a feat for it too:
prerequisites: Cha 11, Use Magic Device 1 rank
benefit: Choose one item you possess that has a save DC that scales with your charisma. Increase the item's save DC by 2. You may change the item this feat affects by spending one hour meditating on a new item.
Thanks again for the ideas. I Think the feat is something which would fit in better with the standard approach to these things, However I want to experiment with making the option of making these rare items available for all characters. I think the option which will suit my players best is adding their primary stat , although I will give them the option of half their character level so as not to disadvantage MAD characters as much.