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Hello everybody.
I'm building a Shirren Overlord Mystic and I have some charm troubles. Since there are no Still/Silent Spell feats (yet), how do you advice to eventually use the "Charm" spells?
Premise. These spells are generally used out of combat, for obvious reasons.
Let's get to the point: if the target is neutral/friendly, Charm is IMHO not needed (Mystics already have many class social skills).
If the target is neutral/hostile (guards, bouncers, smugglers, rival NPCs...), the mystic will be openly casting a spell on him (pag. 342: "it is not possible to clandestinely cast a spell."), IMHO obviously getting the unwanted attention (and logical hostility) of the nearby target's allieds (who also might be watching the scene via CCTV cameras, for example...).
In my opinion, in the SF environment, and with no Still/Silent Spell feats around, this spell is almost useless. Do you agree with me? Did I miss something?
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If no one has Mysticism to identify the spell you can try a Bluff to explain what harmless spell you are actually casting before you do it in a social situation. It better be one that doesn't cause them to expect some visible effect that isn't forthcoming, however.
You can also sometimes socially engineer people to be alone with you. "Can we talk privately for a minute?" or "Why don't you and I go see the Macguffin in the next room, my friends will stay here with the rest of the guards."
It's also fine for captives you want to cooperate with you. For other social situations, use social skills.
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First of all, thank you for your reply.
If no one has Mysticism to identify the spell you can try a Bluff to explain what harmless spell you are actually casting before you do it in a social situation. It better be one that doesn't cause them to expect some visible effect that isn't forthcoming, however.
IMHO, if I can bluff that good, I don't need Charm in the first place.
You can also sometimes socially engineer people to be alone with you. "Can we talk privately for a minute?" or "Why don't you and I go see the Macguffin in the next room, my friends will stay here with the rest of the guards."
Not plausible IMHO: we're talking about a neutral/hostile target (who would attack me if he sees me casting a spell on him, especially in private).
It's also fine for captives you want to cooperate with you.
No, it isn't: "Any act by you or your apparent allies that threatens the charmed creature breaks the spell." It doesn't work on captives.
For other social situations, use social skills.
You got my point: with no Still/Silent Spell feats, there are IMHO no situations where Charm is better than the social skills a Mystic already has.
Thank you again.
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If you beat a one on one in initiative it doesn't matter that he's hostile.
Standing next to a tied up captive is not a threatening action.
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Charm is mostly useful in single target private situations where you don't have time.
Need to stroll into a lobby and convince a security guard to help you, but don't have ten minutes to convince him?
Charm.
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Still and silent spell never made magic not obvious in pathfinder, it just avoided components.
Also, just because they're unfriendly doesn't mean they attack on site. Charm person always took some creativity. My bard used it on servants to get an escort through areas that you would have been shot for going into without one. Also on a sentry on a wall to get information about their defenses, since asking him to let us in went a bit beyond the spells scope.
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'Can't cast clandestinely' doesn't mean the target is omniscient.
Casting it from cover when the target is distracted is a viable thing.
Its also still just charm person. Players have a tendency to think this spell does more than it is really capable of.
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It'd be pretty weird to have Silent or Still feats in Starfinder considering spells don't have components to begin with....
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Some of the Technomancer spells have quasi material components. Explosive Blast being the most obvious.
In my opinion, the scenarios you all have so kindly proposed (by the way, thank you so much) are not solid options.
For example, let's turn the situation around.
Your PC has been violently captured and handcuffed, and the NPC who is interrogating him starts to cast a spell.
Or, your PC is alone, guarding a door, and an unknown NPC who is approaching him starts to cast a spell.
Or, your PC meets an unknown NPC in a dark corridor, and suddely the NPC starts to cast a spell.
Would you feel, at least, "threatened"? I (logically) would: and I would then in my opinion get a +5 bonus on my ST.
And about initiative...
If you beat a one on one in initiative it doesn't matter that he's hostile.
...when you roll initiative, you already are in combat/hostile/threating siutuation.
In my opinion, Charm Person was a good Pathfinder 1st level spell, because it allowed to easily use "stealth spell feats", since it had no M components.
In my opinion, in SF, Charm spells are viable options just as spell-like abilities, aren't they?
Thank you again for your contribution.
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I don't understand your point at all. If thug A is about to stab you, rob you, or just be mean to you, you cast charm person on him. He is now your friend and decides not to stab you, rob you, or be mean to you once his initiative comes around. How is that not useful? Especially with the various abilities that make them not realize they were charmed.