Superstition - how does it work

[felipe f]

Hey guys ,

My Barbarian is about to get the Superstition rage power and im wondering how it actually works in game .

so here is my question , lets say that someone targets me whit a spell , supertition says that i must make a saving throw to resist it , okay . but what i fail that throw , do i get to roll a second time like everyone else to decide if i take full or half damage from the spell ?

is this right ?? i roll the frist time and if i pass im completly imunne to the spell , if i fail , i get a second roll like everyone else to see what happens .

[Ciaran Barnes]

You make only one save against the spell.

If an ally casts a cure wounds spell on you, you make make a Will save. If you succeed on the save, you heal 1/2 the normal number of hit points. You need to look at the saving throw line in each spell though, because the result will vary. For example, if an ally casts haste and you succeed on the Fort save, the spell has no effect at all on you.

[Glorf Fei-Hung]

Superstition (Ex) wrote:

The barbarian gains a +2 morale bonus on saving throws made to resist spells, supernatural abilities, and spell-like abilities. This bonus increases by +1 for every 4 levels the barbarian has attained. While raging, the barbarian cannot be a willing target of any spell and must make saving throws to resist all spells, even those cast by allies.

So, while raging, you have a +2 Morale bonus to save vs any Spell, Spell like ability, or Supernatural ability. which increases by +1 at 4, 8, 12, 16, & 20. However, while you are raging, you also ALWAYS try to resist anything cast on you. So if an ally tries to buff, or heal you for instance, you still need to try to save against that spell. This would result (as Ciaran mentions) in a heal only healing you for half, or a haste not effecting you at all.

The ability never offers you an additional save, nor does it grant complete immunity from every spell if you succeed at a save. It also does not provide you with the option to make a save against a spell or ability that does not normally provide a save.

[SheepishEidolon]

Glorf Fei-Hung wrote:

So you ALWAYS have a +2 Morale bonus to save vs any Spell, Spell like ability, or Supernatural ability.

While your posting is exhaustive and otherwise correct (as far as I understand):

Core Rulebook wrote:

A barbarian gains the benefits of rage powers only while raging

And actually, it makes sense to me to get the +x bonus and the enforced save only in a bundle: Both come from exaggerated wariness. Which is a weaker argument than a citation of official rules, sure, but a flavor explanation makes rules easier to swallow.

[Rysky]

Point, but the "While raging," line that precedes the last line is what raises questions, since if you can't use the power outside of Raging why was that callout necessary?

[Glorf Fei-Hung]

SheepishEidolon wrote:

Glorf Fei-Hung wrote:

So you ALWAYS have a +2 Morale bonus to save vs any Spell, Spell like ability, or Supernatural ability.

While your posting is exhaustive and otherwise correct (as far as I understand):

Core Rulebook wrote:

A barbarian gains the benefits of rage powers only while raging

And actually, it makes sense to me to get the +x bonus and the enforced save only in a bundle: Both come from exaggerated wariness. Which is a weaker argument than a citation of official rules, sure, but a flavor explanation makes rules easier to swallow.

You are correct, while the specific call out within the rage power for resisting all spells while raging threw me off, the lack of a specific call out for the bonus to saves being applied all the time means that portion too would only apply while raging, Due to the Rage powers entry you quote in CRB.

Updated my post ;-)

For Rysky's post, it is definitely redundant, or the writer had intended the bonus to saves to always apply and just pulled an epic fail in how he wrote the entry for it to actually work that way.

[SheepishEidolon]

Rysky wrote:

Point, but the "While raging," line that precedes the last line is what raises questions, since if you can't use the power outside of Raging why was that callout necessary?

Hmm, the enforced save is a bigger change to game mechanics than just modified numbers, so maybe the writer wanted to really make sure the player doesn't save against healing all the time.

Reading through the wording of all CRB rage powers, it's quite a mix of:

a) Restating the rage requirement at the begin of the rage power description.
b) Putting this requirement in the middle of the text.
c) Adding it at the end, especially with 1/rage and x/day powers.
d) Not mentioning it at all.

Maybe it's due to different authors, maybe they wanted to use varying language to make the reading more smooth. APG and ACG are more clear, they appearantly have a reference to rage for each power (in some cases indirectly via totem or required other power). Unchained does the opposite (no reference to requiring rage with the rage powers), the only exception I found was Increased Damage Reduction. That's even better to read, but could also be due to page limitations.

So to me it looks like the intention is: Rage powers only work during rage, unless otherwise stated.

[Rysky]

*shrugs*