I wanted to build a PFS legal two handed fighting dwarf inquisitor with the conversion inquisition. Combo should make me combat relevant and skill relevant so I can do most things well. However, I'm finding it hard to pick a good weapon/feat chain as a Inquisitor since at level 1 my feat can't include anything with a BAB +1 requirement. As well my inquisition choice can be paired with any deity so I can get a one off proficiency in the following good weapons by picking the right god:
- Greatsword
- Falchion
- Katana (intent to get a large Katana at a later date, -2/2D6)
- Urumi (intent to get a large Urumi at a later date, -2/2D6)
- Bastard Sword (intent to get a large Bastard Sword at a later date, -2/2D8)
I think I'm leaning towards the latter 3 so I can carry a one hand option for grapple scenarios and a large two handed option as my main. I also really want the increased crit range of the Katana/Urumi.
My Stat Buy will look like this:
STR 16 [+3]
DEX 14 [+2]
CON 12 +2 [+2]
INT 12 [+1]
WIS 14 +2 [+3]
CHA 7 -2 [-3]*
*(Conversion Inquisition allows bluff, diplomacy, and intimidate to work off wisdom and charisma will only really impact me for handle animal/disguise checks)
When I went to finalize everything I realized that I can't actually pick up Weapon Focus or Power Attack because my BAB is 0 at level 1. So I was thinking about building a 1 Fighter/ X Inquisitor.
Pros:
1. 3 bonus feats (martial weapon proficiency, heavy armour proficiency which would have synergies with my dwarven ability to carry armour/weight, + 1 bonus feat of my choosing for being a fighter).
2. Get my feat progression far earlier by giving me BAB +1 at level 1. With a 1 fighter/ x inquisitor I can take Power Attack and Furious Focus at first level, weapon focus or cleave at level 3, etc.
3. Maxed 1D10 hit dice to start (+2 hp over starting with a 1D8 class)
Cons:
1. 4 Less Skill Points.
2. Delays on judgement scaling (offset by the dwarven Favored Race Bonus)
3. Delays to getting bane.
4. Loss of Stalwart at level 11 (PFS characters retire at 12)
Do people think the 1 level dip is worth it? Otherwise it looks like I get power attack at 3rd level, and furious focus at 5th, etc. It just feels like I'm waiting until level 5 to be good in melee, when I could just start that way and then become even more destructive at level 6 with Bane. What do others take as their level 1-5 feats for a straight inquisitor build? The only feats that look worth it are:
- Additional Traits (Armour Expert, Glory of Old, Fate's Favored, Adopted + Warrior of Old)
- Combat Reflexes (won't be of much use though early on)
- Dodge
- Intimidating Prowess
- Judgement Surge
- Toughness
- War Blessings (With Feronia I could pick up a Bastard Sword and a 2 Liberation ability 2 times per day which would give me the more 2/day benefit of the liberation domain as a swift action)
I don't think I'd want to take a teamwork feat, just so it can turn on at level 3.
Anyone have any build advice or is there something I might be missing?
I find sacred slayer to be a better martial inquisitor than a fighter 1/inquisitor x. Studied Target will make up for the lack of BAB. Your feats are still delayed, but you don't miss them as much when you have an extra +1 to hit and damage.
Red Griffyn wrote: - War Blessings (With Feronia I could pick up a Bastard Sword and a 2 Liberation ability 2 times per day which would give me the more 2/day benefit of the liberation domain as a swift action) i dont *think* feronia is pfs legal (if i am reading the additional resources correctly). gods that (again, as far as i can tell) are pfs legal and will get you those weapon proficiencies are ragathiel, shizuru, nalinivati, and gorum.
personally, im in favor of starting inquisitors with a 1 lvl dip into something else if you have a specific build you want to get rolling. right now ive got an inquisitor that i started with a level in swashbuckler and im trying to make him sort of a dex tank.
that being said, with either choice you make youre going to be delaying something so the real question is which aspect of the character do you want to focus on? if you want to focus on straight murderizing the enemies than you should start with the fighter dip.
if you choose to go straight inquisitor, id recommend taking heavy armor prof for your first level feat and then go down the power attack tree. also, there are a few domains that will give you a bonus to damage so you wont miss power attack as much.
Just use a Dwarves War axe
Imbicatus wrote: I find sacred slayer to be a better martial inquisitor than a fighter 1/inquisitor x. Studied Target will make up for the lack of BAB. Your feats are still delayed, but you don't miss them as much when you have an extra +1 to hit and damage. Throw ravener hunter on top of that and you can really make it work as a fighter inquisitor. (Ravener hunter is a new inquisitor archetype from the Blood of the Beast Companion that replaces domain with two revelations from a list of oracle mysteries, including battle. So pick up weapon mastery and either skill at arms if you don't get a good racial weapon or any other revelation if you do. Lose one teamwork feat for the demon hunter feat, solo tactics is pushed back to 6, gain all good cleric spells level 6 and under, lose all law/evil/chaos spells.)
I really like the 1 level martial dip for a dwarven inquisitor- I think it's worth it just for the proficiencies... dwarves get a bunch of decent racial weapons when they get martial weapon proficiency (longhammer and dorn-dergar/chain-flail are favorites of mine) plus dwarves should always be wearing the heaviest armor they can. Fighter's a decent option so that you can pick up 2 feats that require +1 bab at first if you want (or power attack and combat reflexes if you took longhammer), but ranger or slayer is imo even better because you don't miss out on any skill points at all.
Feronia is pfs legal via inner sea gods. I don't know about any other sources.
Imbicatus wrote: Feronia is pfs legal via inner sea gods. I don't know about any other sources. i stand both corrected and pleased to have been so
I'd skip the Fighter level. If you're going with a God with a good Favored Weapon, all you're getting is Heavy Armor and one Feat. OThat's a pretty meh reason to delay spellcasting, Judgment, Bane, and so on all one level each.
I mean, you can grab Heavy Armor Proficiency as your 1st level Feat and have AC 20 at 2nd level. Your attack will be +3 for 2d6+4, which isn't bad. By 3rd, and with a +1 weapon, that goes to +5 for 2d6+8, which is pretty solid, really.
Both those are without Judgment (or Studied Target, if going Sanctified Slayer). By 3rd, the version with a Fighter level would be at maybe +1 more to hit than that (if he grabbed Weapon Focus)...and couldn't use Judgment/Studied Target to increase it.
In short, the Fighter version has +1 to hit at 1st, maybe +2 if going with Weapon Focus, but drops to only +0 or +1 by 2nd level, and stays that way until 5th level, when the pure Inquisitor gets Bane.
So I see that Sanctified Slayer is an Archetype of the Inquisitor, however if I replace all of my judgements with Studied Target/Sneak Damage it sees like I lose out on a lot of potential flexibility in the class by losing judgements. It also nullifies my favored race bonus which applies to my judgement levels.
There is a possibility of taking a 1 Slayer / X Inquisitor, then I get studied Target (no sneak damage) but all of my judgements/spells delayed. I would get martial weapon proficiency and not lose out on any skills but at least have all the dwarven weapons and good two handed weapons like naginata open up to me.
Alternatively I could take a 1 Barbarian (Armoured Hulk Archetype) / X Inquisitor as well which gives me 6 rounds of rage/day, martial proficiency, Indomitable Stance, Heavy Armour Proficiency, and a starting +4 hp (lose 2 skill points).
The biggest issue I see is that not having BAB +1 or martial weapon proficiency limits me to using my deities favored weapon forever because so many weapons (including my dwarven named exotics) aren't actually open to me as they are only treated as martial (not auto proficient).
I tend to agree that dipping sucks for Inquisitor.
If I were to dip, Barbarian seems preferable to fighter. I'd consider Savage Technologist and pick up extra rage at level 1 but drop DEX to 12 on your point buy.
If you are planning to use a two handed weapon the Dwarven FCB doesn't do all that much for you in the context of PFS. It's best if you choose the damage option and even here 6 levels only equate to +1 damage.
Personally, I hate judgements. There are never enough per day, and I would rather have an always available studied target/sneak attack than a limited use per day judgment. Especially when the primary use of the judgment is an accuracy bonus that rises at the same rate as studied target.
If you want something more powerful than studied target & sneak attack, take a look at sacred huntmaster.
The other nice thing about a slayer dip is that if you pick up a second level you can grab a combat style feat. You didn't seem real interested in my mention of the dorn-dergar, but just to offer one example of an interesting twist, if you pick up 2WF with combat style (ignoring the Dex requirement) you could take dorn-dergar master and be able to dual-wield your reach weapon and a shield (with shield bash so you don't lose the AC bonus). The -2 to hit seems harsh on a 3/4 BAB class but you have studied target, judgement, and eventually bane (with the double bane feat) to overcome that. Your spells do lag, and you get bane and judgment upgrades later, but it makes for solid skills, good AC, and the ability to kick out damage pretty fast when you need to.
So I've gone back to the drawing board based on your suggestions which are largely to avoid a dip. What if I do an intimidate build that looks like this:
Class: Inquisitor
Archetype: Sanctified Slayer
Race: Dwarf
Alternate Racial Trait: Stoic Negotiator (+2 Racial to Bluff, Diplomacy, and Profession Merchant Checks)
Traits: Fate's Favored (+1 to Luck Bonuses), Glory of Old (+1 trait bonus on saving throws against spells, spell-like abilities, and poison)
Inquisition: Conversion (Wisdom modifier instead of Charisma when making Bluff, Diplomacy, and Intimidate checks, at level 8 you get a 1/day dominate person).
Diety: Feronia or other Ragthiel. Provides EWP in Bastard Sword.
Feats:
1 - Improved Prowess (Add Strength Mod to Intimidate)
3 - Power Attack
3(Team Work) - Precise Strike (+1D6 on flanked opponents)
5 - Furious Focus (No penalty on first Power Attack)
6(Team Work) - Outflank (+4 to flanking attacks)
7 - Cornugun Smash (Free Action Intimidate on successful power attack)
8 - Rouge/Slayer Talent (Weapon Training) - Gives Weapon Focus (Bastard Sword)
9 - Dazzing Display (Retrain Level 1 Feat for 5 Prestige/90 gp, allows a full round action to intimidate foes within a 30ft radius)
9 - Shattered Defenses (shaken, frightened, or panicked opponent hit by you this round is flat-footed to your attacks until the end of your next turn.)
9 (Team Work) Living Fortress (+2 to all saves as a dwarf when next to allies).
11 Skill focus Intimidate or something else
Spells (Learned in Specified Order):
0 - Stabilize
0 - Guidance
0 - Detect Magic
0 - Read Magic
0 - Detect Poison
0 - Create Water
1 - Cure Light Wounds
1 - Divine Favor
1 - Shield of Faith
1 - Command
1 - True Strike
1 - Protection from Evil
2 - Blistering Invective
2 - Hold Person
2 - Restoration, Lesser
2 - Invisibility,
2 - Resist Energy
3 - Magical Vestments
3 - Magic Weapon Greater
3 - Dispel Magic
3 - Terrible Remorse
4 - Divine Power
Equipment (probably can't get all of these):
Main Weapon - Two-handed Adamantine Cruel Large Bastard Sword
Secondary - One-handed Bastard Sword (Cold Iron or Silversheen)
Armor - Mithral Agile Breastplate
Shield - Animated (If a shield at all)
Range - 3 Str Composite Longbow
Head - Jingasa of the Fortunate Soldier (+2 AC with trait)
Headband - Headband of Inspired Wisdom (+2 or +4)
Neck - Amulet of Natural Armor (+2)
Shoulders - Cloak of Resistance (+2 or +3)
Wrists - Bracers of Armor (+2)
Belt - Belt of Giant Strength (+2 or +4)
Chest - Hag's Shabble
Boots - Feather Step Slippers
Ring - Ring of Feather Falling, Ring of Protection (+1)
Rod - Immovable Rod, Rod of Metamagic, Extend (lesser)
Other - Lucky Horseshoe, Pearl of Power (1st), Handy Haversack, Rope of Climbing, Four-leaf Clover, Scabbard of Vigor or Scabbard of Many Blades, Efficient Quiver
Save DC based spells such as command aren't really of any use unless you really pump your wisdom score.
Studied target boosts the save DCs of all class abilities. Spells are class abilities.
Jingasa has been nerfed. It gives a +1 deflection bonus, so it won't work with Fate's Favored.
Also, the critical hit nullification now works one time only, not once per day.
It went from the magic item that everyone wants to the magic item that no one needs.
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