Fighter Archer Archetype question

[draconswan]

One of my players is asking if they can apply the archer archetype to a fighter that uses firearms. I know the book specifically says bows, but I wanted to get some others opinions. It could also apply to crossbows, as they are a type of "bow". I'm inclined to say no myself on firearms however.

[Claxon]

I mean he can uses firearms, but non of the bow specific stuff will apply, which is most (if not all) of the abilities. So none of it would work.

As for whether or not it would be too powerful to allow the player to make the archetype such that it works firearms (replacing every instance of bow with firearm)....I dunno. Probably wouldn't be that bad. The archer archetype is absolutely awful for an actual archer, I can't imagine it being good for a gun user either.

A common piece of advice here to people who ask about using the archer archetype for its intended purposes is to not take it, because what it gives up is much worse than what it gains compared to a straight fighter.

Ultimate, be happy that your player isn't trying to use the trench fighter archetype or playing a gunslinger.

*Trench Fighter archetype is from an Adventure Path that goes to Earth where firearms are commonplace and are uses the guns everywhere setting. Even if you would allow him to use the gunslinger, you shouldn't allow the Trench Fighter.

[Claxon]

Now, if your player is after the ability to do Combat Maneuvers with a ranged weapon (which could include a firearm) have him look through the Ranged Tactics Toolbox and Weapon Master's Handbook. They have options to allow that.

[Dave Justus]

Rules wise, you are correct.

I don't think it would be broken to let it be guns instead, but it would be a poor choice. Archer archtype wouldn't give the gunsmithing feat or weapon proficiency. Beyond that, Archer is considered a weak choice even when you want to use bows, generally, Weapon Master is considered a better choice, or even a non-Archetyped fighter.

Trenchfighter is an archetype for figher designed to give bonuses when using guns.

[Jeff Clem]

Cluster shot feat makes a Archer type a little better.

Clustered Shots (Combat)
You take a moment to carefully aim your shots, causing them all to strike nearly the same spot.

Prerequisites: Point-Blank Shot, Precise Shot, base attack bonus +6.
Benefit: When you use a full-attack action to make multiple ranged weapon attacks against the same opponent, total the damage from all hits before applying that opponent’s damage reduction.

Special: If the massive damage optional rule is being used, that rule applies if the total damage you deal with this feat is equal to or exceeds half the opponent’s full normal hit points (minimum 50 points of damage).

[Imbicatus]

draconswan wrote:

One of my players is asking if they can apply the archer archetype to a fighter that uses firearms. I know the book specifically says bows, but I wanted to get some others opinions. It could also apply to crossbows, as they are a type of "bow". I'm inclined to say no myself on firearms however.

Actually, it doesn't even apply to crossbows, as crossbows are a completely different weapon group from bows.

That said, the archer fighter archetype is a terrible trap option. It is a worse archer than a fighter with no archetype.