A LN Antagonist for a Homebrew Campaign?


Advice


Hello. As I am a newbie gamemaster who is making his first homebrew campaign, an interesting question has popped into my head.

You see, one of the major NPCs the PCs will interact with is the king of the new country. Now, the problem is, by the end of the homebrew campaign, they'll have to face their greatest enemy-the king.

So here's my question:

DOES an antagonist HAVE to be any kind of evil?

Because, I have heard that the term antagonist doesn't just apply to any character that's evil-just any character that gets in the way of the protagonist's goals.


Nope, antagonist can be anyone with interests in opposition to PCs. It's easiest to do some form of evil, but even LG is possible as long as the PCs and the antagonist have some real reason to oppose each other.


The antagonist is defined by his opposition to the protagnist. Anything else is extra.


Nationalism, greed, mistaken intents, protecting one's homeland, ideology, personal hated, love, honor... Lots of reason to be even violently opposed to others that isn't "that guy is evil incarnate"'


MeanMutton wrote:
Nationalism, greed, mistaken intents, protecting one's homeland, ideology, personal hated, love, honor... Lots of reason to be even violently opposed to others that isn't "that guy is evil incarnate"'

Some of those could still imply an evil alignment, though. It's not like every evil character is a mustache-twirling villain


The term Antagonist comes from the word "Antagonize," which means to set hostility in others. In short, they make people hostile towards them. A lot of things can cause this: You're trying to take their life. You took their kids. Even looking at them funny can be considered antagonistic, because it's the reason they became hostile towards you. It's commonly referred to as being the bad guy, because 99% of stories tells the Bad Guy doing something to "antagonize" the Good Guy(s), hence Protagonist and Antagonist were born.

It is generally tradition for the Protagonists to be on the side of good, and most stories are told from the Protagonists' perspective, which means that a lot of stories will be bias toward their views. To be honest, an objective perspective determines whether the PCs are the Protagonists or the Antagonists of a story (that is, whether they're in the right or the wrong).

So, does this mean that Antagonist = Evil? No, by no means. But it most certainly can be, and usually is.

That being said, I'm confused as to how they end up being against the King, who is Lawful Neutral, no less; do the PCs break a law? Do the PCs double-cross the kingdom, and therefore the King's faction becomes at war with the PCs? Does the King just plan to use the PCs for his own gains, and when he gets what he wants, attempt to dispose of the PCs for the good of the Kingdom?

There are plenty of stories that I've seen where that is the case, and across multiple genres, so it's certainly possible thematically and mechanically. The big question stems from how you want to play it through, and this can really determine whether he is a LN NPC.


KoolKobold wrote:
DOES an antagonist HAVE to be any kind of evil?

Absolutely not. They can even be good aligned, if you can spin it right. Evil is just the typical antagonist because...well they're evil.

In fact, my very first villain for a homebrew campaign ever was a LN warcleric (a few different classes, I say warcleric for simplicity) of Zon-Kuthon.


If you read Order of the Stick, you might notice that the Order fights people from almost every corner of the alignment chart. At different times, they fight a Human Paladin (LG), Human Fighter/Rogue/Sorcerer multiclass (LE), Human Warlord, maybe? (LE), Epic Human Lich Sorcerer (CE), Half-Orc Rogue (NE), as well as a variety of lesser enemies of other alignments. Granted, they do have a fairly diverse party: LG Human Fighter, CG Human Bard/Dashing Swordsman, CG Human Rogue, CE Halfling Ranger, LE Dwarf Vampire Cleric, N Elf Wizard, as well as a housecat animal companion, raven familiar, and Bloodfeast the Extremeinator.


Darksol the Painbringer wrote:

The term Antagonist comes from the word "Antagonize," which means to set hostility in others. In short, they make people hostile towards them. A lot of things can cause this: You're trying to take their life. You took their kids. Even looking at them funny can be considered antagonistic, because it's the reason they became hostile towards you. It's commonly referred to as being the bad guy, because 99% of stories tells the Bad Guy doing something to "antagonize" the Good Guy(s), hence Protagonist and Antagonist were born.

It is generally tradition for the Protagonists to be on the side of good, and most stories are told from the Protagonists' perspective, which means that a lot of stories will be bias toward their views. To be honest, an objective perspective determines whether the PCs are the Protagonists or the Antagonists of a story (that is, whether they're in the right or the wrong).

So, does this mean that Antagonist = Evil? No, by no means. But it most certainly can be, and usually is.

That being said, I'm confused as to how they end up being against the King, who is Lawful Neutral, no less; do the PCs break a law? Do the PCs double-cross the kingdom, and therefore the King's faction becomes at war with the PCs? Does the King just plan to use the PCs for his own gains, and when he gets what he wants, attempt to dispose of the PCs for the good of the Kingdom?

There are plenty of stories that I've seen where that is the case, and across multiple genres, so it's certainly possible thematically and mechanically. The big question stems from how you want to play it through, and this can really determine whether he is a LN NPC.

Let's just say that the king may be LN, but that doesn't mean he's good-let's just say that he believes that anyone who goes against his wishes (even if said person didn't mean to cause such intentions) immediately makes him believe they are planning for treason. Especially if it involves convincing the king's son that his heart is more important in love than marrying some aristocratic woman he's never even met. It's...kinda complicated, but part of the homebrew campaign I'm making.


LN is bound by rules and laws. Often even if they do not make sense to others. It is the law so it must be followed. Now LN does nto follow every law, a very strict personal code could be LN.

A LN king saying people against his wishes is treasonous is more LE. As he uses and bends the laws to fit his comforts.

A LN king could be an easy antagonist. If the country has laws that appears silly or evil to outsiders but have specific reasons for that king. The PC breaking them is not quite treason, but definitely needs to be punished per the law. If that law suggests a harsh punishment the LN king will bliondly follow it, and the PCs may not agree.


Finlanderboy wrote:

LN is bound by rules and laws. Often even if they do not make sense to others. It is the law so it must be followed. Now LN does nto follow every law, a very strict personal code could be LN.

A LN king saying people against his wishes is treasonous is more LE. As he uses and bends the laws to fit his comforts.

A LN king could be an easy antagonist. If the country has laws that appears silly or evil to outsiders but have specific reasons for that king. The PC breaking them is not quite treason, but definitely needs to be punished per the law. If that law suggests a harsh punishment the LN king will bliondly follow it, and the PCs may not agree.

If anything, the king may start off LN, but as the campaign progresses, he'll behave as if he was a little bit of LN and LE

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