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If the tentacles succeed in grappling a foe, that foe takes 1d6+4 points of damage and gains the grappled condition. Grappled opponents cannot move without first breaking the grapple. All other movement is prohibited unless the creature breaks the grapple first. The black tentacles spell receives a +5 bonus on grapple checks made against opponents it is already grappling, but cannot move foes or pin foes. Each round that black tentacles succeeds on a grapple check, it deals an additional 1d6+4 points of damage. The CMD of black tentacles, for the purposes of escaping the grapple, is equal to 10 + its CMB.
Once you are grappling an opponent, a successful check allows you to continue grappling the foe, and also allows you to perform one of the following actions (as part of the standard action spent to maintain the grapple).
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Damage: You can inflict damage to your target equal to your unarmed strike, a natural attack, or an attack made with armor spikes or a light or one-handed weapon. This damage can be either lethal or nonlethal.
Reading the above quotes it seem to me that the Black tentacles damage is part of the grappling maneuver, and so it is physical damage, not magical damage (and so subject to DR).
On the other hand the spell don't specify that it is physical damage and the the basic assumption for spell is that without a specific line of text the spell damage is a magical effect and DR don't do anything against it.Someone has a definitive answer?
With motives for the answer, please.
I think SKR once wrote that some spells deal weapon like damage.
This damage is the result of an attack roll, and should fall under that heading.
Although (not unique to this spell), it should really specify as Bludgeon/Pierce/Slash if that is the case.
RAW, it is lacking any form of classification, so it would still be 'spell damage' regardless of how the damage comes into play (in this case grappling).
Attack rolls happen all the time with spells that aren't 'weapon like' so that cannot be used as a basis for the determination.
I could definitely see someone house ruling it to deal damage as per the natural attack table - tentacle, but it would still be a house rule as the spell doesn't type the damage.
I think it's grapple damage based on the spell description. Specifically,
When determining the tentacles' CMB, the tentacles use your caster level as their base attack bonus and receive a +4 bonus due to their Strength and a +1 size bonus. Roll only once for the entire spell effect each round and apply the result to all creatures in the area of effect.
If the tentacles succeed in grappling a foe, that foe takes 1d6+4 points of damage and gains the grappled condition.
The tentacles receive a +4 bonus to CMB due to strength. They also inflict 1d6+4 damage. It doesn't actually say the +4 damage is from strength but it doesn't seems like much of a leap.
I think it's grapple damage based on the spell description. Specifically,
The tentacles receive a +4 bonus to CMB due to strength. They also inflict 1d6+4 damage. It doesn't actually say the +4 damage is from strength but it doesn't seems like much of a leap.When determining the tentacles' CMB, the tentacles use your caster level as their base attack bonus and receive a +4 bonus due to their Strength and a +1 size bonus. Roll only once for the entire spell effect each round and apply the result to all creatures in the area of effect.
If the tentacles succeed in grappling a foe, that foe takes 1d6+4 points of damage and gains the grappled condition.
'Grapple' damage doesn't exist, though adding STR into the damage would make it much more plausible as 'physical' damage.
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'Grapple' damage doesn't exist, though adding STR into the damage would make it much more plausible as 'physical' damage.
It "somewhat" exist, as grappling say:
Damage: You can inflict damage to your target equal to your unarmed strike, a natural attack, or an attack made with armor spikes or a light or one-handed weapon. This damage can be either lethal or nonlethal.You end choosing a kind of damage B/P or S depending on what you use to deal the damage, but you start with "damage from a grapple".
'Grapple' damage doesn't exist, though adding STR into the damage would make it much more plausible as 'physical' damage.
Once you are grappling an opponent, a successful check allows you to continue grappling the foe, and also allows you to perform one of the following actions (as part of the standard action spent to maintain the grapple).
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Damage
You can inflict damage to your target equal to your unarmed strike, a natural attack, or an attack made with armor spikes or a light or one-handed weapon. This damage can be either lethal or nonlethal.
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Sure grapple damage isn't a damage type by RAW, in this case the damage would be a natural attack, that doesn't invalidate my point though.
If we're trying to figure out what something does mechanically in the rule set, RAW does 'kinda' matter. And do agree with your point which is why I was being particular about the wording and clearing it up.
Sorry, I guess I took that the wrong way. I'd pick bludgeoning for black tentacles.
It is a conjuration(creation) spell. That means it is creating an actual physical tentacle. There is nothing in the spell that leads me to believe there is anything special about the tentacles that are created and most tentacle attacks in the bestary do crushing/blundgeoning damage.
I would go with calling in blundgeoning damage.
It's physical damage made possible by magic, so DR would apply. Rationale: A) no energy type specified, B) CMB roll required for a grapple check, C) it's a Conjuration (Creation) spell. Seems pretty clear from (C) that it's summoning a real thing, which as per (B) grapples you, leading to regular un-typed physical damage (A).
I think SKR once wrote that some spells deal weapon like damage.
This damage is the result of an attack roll, and should fall under that heading.
Although (not unique to this spell), it should really specify as Bludgeon/Pierce/Slash if that is the case.
I'm quoting from memory here, but I believe that all unarmed / grapple damage is bludgeoning by default. Certain feats or special abilities can modify that, of course. Monster attacks are listed (somewhere) as what type of damage they do, as well. For example, slams/tail slaps are bludgeoning, bites/stingers/pincers are piercing, and claws are slashing. Weapons, of course, specify the damage type.
As a rule of thumb I look at the spell description for spell resistance. If there is no spell resistance I take the damage as being mundane in nature.