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Our GM is giving us a medieval campaign in which the governing lords are complete jerks (that's putting it mildly) and the royalty is oblivious to what is going on.
Upon hearing the idea I immediately thought of doing a character loosely based on Robin Hood. (cheesy I know) My concept was a human Ranger who has brushed alongside the wrong side of the law (as the governor sees it). He basically thumbs his nose at the local law and takes from the fat old 'pigs' as he sees them.
I have him willing to give the things he takes to the church in secrecy to prevent any of the constables and the sheriff from seeing him. I have a list of questions for this character. This is a 7th level campaign.
Is CG a well-suited alignment for him? He only keeps enough money to sustain him barely. He gives 90% to the church to give to the people. He also tries not to kill the people he steals from, he doesn't believe that killing them will help the commoners any at all.
The feats I have for him are: Far Shot, Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Rapid Shot, Improved Precise Shot, Stealthy, and Skill Focus (Stealth). Are these good feats for him? I'm trying to go for a sneaky archer type.
Would he have conflicts with a paladin? There is going to be a Paladin in the group, and I was wondering would this type of guy rub the Paladin the wrong way.
Those are it right now. I'm still gaining his background, but he is the son of a nobleman who fought against the corrupt officials and his father was executed. That gives him motive but he has also seen the havoc the jerks have done to the common people.
I'm still ironing out the details.
I think the chaoticness would annoy the paladin but unless taken to extremes(I know, very vague), they should be able to co-exist.
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I think the chaoticness would annoy the paladin but unless taken to extremes(I know, very vague), they should be able to co-exist.
I think I'll have him keep a low profile with the paladin, at least when he's stealing from those rich passerby.
Do you think a level or two of Rogue would be a good idea for him?
I think the chaoticness would annoy the paladin but unless taken to extremes(I know, very vague), they should be able to co-exist.I think I'll have him keep a low profile with the paladin, at least when he's stealing from those rich passerby.
Do you think a level or two of Rogue would be a good idea for him?
It depends on what you plan to have him do mechanically in the game. You don't have to give him rogue levels to RP him as a thief. I know he will be stealing, or at least that is my assumption, but will he be stealing at sword point, or doing more pick pocketing when the opportunity presents itself?
PS:I would take one level of rogue if you plan to use sleight of hand to steal things. :)
I think the chaoticness would annoy the paladin but unless taken to extremes(I know, very vague), they should be able to co-exist.I think I'll have him keep a low profile with the paladin, at least when he's stealing from those rich passerby.
Do you think a level or two of Rogue would be a good idea for him?
A bit of rogue sounds like a good fit. I'd be inclined to say Scout archetype, though you really need something like 8 levels of it before it does much of anything for an archer. The sniper archetype gets a good ability from level 1, so that might work too if you want to keep your distance to the things you shoot at.
Heck, an all rogue scout/sniper (you can be both!) could work for the concept too.
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I think the chaoticness would annoy the paladin but unless taken to extremes(I know, very vague), they should be able to co-exist.I think I'll have him keep a low profile with the paladin, at least when he's stealing from those rich passerby.
Do you think a level or two of Rogue would be a good idea for him?
It depends on what you plan to have him do mechanically in the game. You don't have to give him rogue levels to RP him as a thief. I know he will be stealing, or at least that is my assumption, but will he be stealing at sword point, or doing more pick pocketing when the opportunity presents itself?
PS:I would take one level of rogue if you plan to use sleight of hand to steal things. :)
I see him as more of a hold at sword and arrow point type. Though the level of Rogue may come in handy with being in town and giving away the riches.
I'll definitely take that into consideration. :)
Take leadership so you can accumulate a band of merry men (and a blind manservant). Chaotic Good is perfect for [Robin]. He does what is right and doesn't care what the law says.
As to the paladin, it will really depend on the players of both characters as well as the way they meet. [Robin] is a victim of corruption of the law- if he can prove it to the paladin, they should be able to get along. If, however, the paladin's only exposure to [Robin] is that he steals from people and thumbs his nose at the lawful community leader (the sheriff), then of course there'll be conflict. Especially if the sheriff has a chance to butter the paladin up first.
If the paladin is righteous and sees that the overlords are corrupt/evil then he too will be willing to go against them. Although he observes the authorities he is also Good so he will not stand for taxing the people to death (example).
Though he may not agree with the methodology of a "robin hood" there is likely a middle ground to be had.
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Sounds like a fun game...
I'd probably grab one (or 2...evasion is super nice) levels of rogue, but they're not needed per se.
Feats look good, & CG is 100% the right alignment for Robin.
As far as old Mr. Stuffybritches, if you play up the "wronged good guy" role and Good part of your alignment, should be a match made in heaven.
LG doesn't mean slavish adherence to bad laws, and Good should usually win out over Law most of the time. Just don't go pickpocket crazy when he's around and adhere to his sense of justice and (kinda) fair play, and I forsee a strong "odd couple" bond forming.
I'd probably grab one (or 2...evasion is super nice) levels of rogue, but they're not needed per se.
If he goes with ranger then he will get... evasion..
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If the paladin is righteous and sees that the overlords are corrupt/evil then he too will be willing to go against them. Although he observes the authorities he is also Good so he will not stand for taxing the people to death (example).
Though he may not agree with the methodology of a "robin hood" there is likely a middle ground to be had.
I was tempted to go easy on the stealing when the pally is around anyway. I know how Paladins are seeing as I did play one, but it was a completely different setting.
I am seriously considering taking at least one level of Rogue, but I'm gonna talk it over with my GM first.
Robin Hood didn't steal from the rich, he robbed them. So, in the eyes of the law he wasn't a thief, he was a brigand.
As such I don't see much reason to add a level of Rogue, as the key features of the Rogue (backstab, find traps, sneak in the shadows) really do not fit his portfolio.
Rather I would take a level of Cavalier to represent his knightly background that he had to leave behind.
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Robin Hood didn't steal from the rich, he robbed them. So, in the eyes of the law he wasn't a thief, he was a brigand.
As such I don't see much reason to add a level of Rogue, as the key features of the Rogue (backstab, find traps, sneak in the shadows) really do not fit his portfolio.
Rather I would take a level of Cavalier to represent his knightly background that he had to leave behind.
Very good point. I'll take a look at the character sheet and see which would fit the rogue or cavalier.
I personally think Robin Hood was LG (well of course there are many different versions of Robin Hood). Someone did stamp Robin Hood as ideal DD CG long time ago based on a vague description "steal from rich, give to the poor" without looking at the Robins character at all IMHO.
Robin doesn't steal from random rich people (the versions I have seen). He steals the unjust taxes (that Sheriff of Nottingham takes without kings permission, or greedy bishop who is sheriffs friend) back to the people.
He doesn't just shoot the sheriff even when he has plenty of opportunities to do so in all the versions I've seen. He at least has a "fair" duel againt him.
When King comes back at the end he thanks Robin for keeping his virtues and essentially foiling a coup against kings throne. Thus Robin can be seen as one of the rare persons who actually hold kings law. In some versions sheriff is still alive at this point (not on Costners though :D), so Robin takes an extra mile to arrest sheriff instead of killing him (screamingly LG).
So what I'm trying to say that in Robins story the sheriff is usually plotting against government and Robin is the best man to defend it. Though his enemies still wear uniforms they would be prosecuted for a treason, if king were there. If that is kind of case in your campaign, LG characters are very justified I think.
So what I tried to say was that, if you steal from random rich people to give it to the poor & church you like you are GC. But Robin Hood is LG enough to be a paladin I think:
"Robin of Locksley (Kevin Costner), an English nobleman who joined Richard the Lionheart in the Third Crusade, is imprisoned in Jerusalem along with his comrade Peter. Robin escapes, saving the life of a Moor named Azeem (Morgan Freeman) in the process. Peter dies while escaping and has Robin swear to protect his sister Marian (Mary Elizabeth Mastrantonio). Robin returns to England with Azeem, who vows to accompany Robin until the debt of saving his life is repaid.
In England, with King Richard away the cruel Sheriff of Nottingham (Alan Rickman) rules over the land, aided by his cousin, Guy of Gisbourne (Michael Wincott), along with the witch Mortianna (Geraldine McEwan) and the corrupt Bishop of Hereford (Harold Innocent). At Locksley castle, Robin's father (Brian Blessed)(1) is killed by the Sheriff's men after refusing to join them.
Robin returns to England to find his father dead, his home in ruins, and the Sheriff and his men oppressing the people. While fleeing the Sheriff's forces, Robin and Azeem encounter a band of outlaws(2) hiding in Sherwood Forest, led by Little John (Nick Brimble). Among them is Will Scarlet (Christian Slater), later revealed to be Robin's illegitimate half-brother. Robin ultimately assumes command of the band, encourages his men to fight against Nottingham(2) and trains them to defend themselves. They rob English soldiers and convoys that pass through the forest(3), then distribute the stolen wealth among the poor. One of their early victims is Friar Tuck (Michael McShane), who subsequently joins the Merry Men. Robin’s successes infuriate the sheriff, who increases the maltreatment of his people, resulting in more support for Robin Hood.
Hiring Celtic warriors from Scotland to bolster his forces, the sheriff tracks down the outlaws' hideout and launches an attack, destroying the forest refuge. He confines Marian when she tries to summon help from France. The sheriff proposes to Maid Marian, claiming if she accepts he will spare the lives of the captured woodsmen. Nevertheless, several of the rebel fighters are to be executed by hanging.
Robin and a handful of his most trusted aides survived the assault. On the day of the wedding and hangings, Robin and his men storm Nottingham castle, freeing the prisoners. Originally planning to free their friends and retreat(4), Azeem reveals himself and his willingness to fight the sheriff, turning the peasants to revolt. Robin kills the sheriff but is attacked by Mortianna, who charges with a spear. Azeem slays Mortianna, fulfilling his vow.
Robin and Marian profess their love for each other and marry in the forest. Their wedding is briefly interrupted by the return of King Richard I (Sean Connery), who blesses the marriage and thanks Robin for his deeds.(5)"
So:
1) The villains are securing the nobles to coup the throne by extreme measures
2) The Merry Men are really bandits/brigands stealing from random people, but Robin turns them to rebels fighting for the right cause
3) From that point they fight the coup that is going on in England. No more raiding randomly people.
4) Even at that point Robin is not bloodthirsty, he just wants to rescue the rebels (the battle isn't his fault)
5) King very clearly is very plesed for Robins actions. King sees Robin has uphold the law singlehandedly while the country has otherwise been in chaos.
Different Robin Hood depictions have had different alignments- The Errol Flynn version (my personal favorite) was fairly Lawful good to be sure. But honestly a character who pulls Robin hood antics is an easier fit for Chaotic Good. Honestly you might not want a clone anyway, so having some differences would be good.
Don't multiclass rogue- it will make you worse at what you want to do. You won't get more stealthy, in fact it will delay getting camouflage and hide in plain sight, so in some ways you'll be worse at it. Sneak attack isn't really all that useful for an archer, and the hit to BaB is annoying.
Go straight ranger.
Some sort of Multiclass (or Traits, or the Cosmopolitan Feat) might well be useful and/or necessary to acquire social skills if you wish to possess those. And most versions of Robin Hood have been quite good at various social skills.
And he was pretty darn charismatic...
Cavalier: Order of the Lion/Order of the Sword for two levels seems pretty cool. You can "challenge" (literally) your enemies.
Would be thematic and seeing as how Robin Hood was often tied to Richard the Lionheart, would be fitting.
Is CG a well-suited alignment for him? He only keeps enough money to sustain him barely. He gives 90% to the church to give to the people. He also tries not to kill the people he steals from, he doesn't believe that killing them will help the commoners any at all.Would he have conflicts with a paladin? There is going to be a Paladin in the group, and I was wondering would this type of guy rub the Paladin the wrong way.
CG is always what I think of Robin Hood. His heart is in the right place. he wants to promote good the best way possible, but he doesn't believe the laws apply to him. Anything from robbery to trespassing is fine as long as it serves the greater good.
There could be friction between the Paladin and this character... but they could also become fast friends. As long as the overall goal is helping others their methods are the only problem. And in a corrupt society, Good will probably trump Law. (like Friar Tuck)
A better example, would be to check out the old Green Arrow/Green Lantern comics. One was a Chaotic freedom fighter, the other a straight-laced Law and order space cop. There was friction, but they are considered two of comicdoms best friends.