Sacral Summoner Archetype


Homebrew and House Rules


This is just something I threw together a couple of months back and I thought I'd share it in case anyone might find it fun or useful. It's a very simple idea: a divine summoner archetype. I did also have a slight sub-motive of nerfing the summoner a bit power-level-wise, which I think this archetype achieves, as well as making it more focused on the eidolon and less focused on summoning other critters. The latter I think is also evinced by the sacral summoner's alternate class features. Anyway, here it is:

The Sacral Summoner

Hope y'all enjoy!

Cheers,
- Gears

Scarab Sages

It seems more powerful to me - more skills more spells, Channeling Energy (lest we forget, a Summoner's Summon Monster ability normally only works when their Eidolon isn't with them), Mystery abilities being generally more interesting than the standard Summoner tricks they're replacing, and of course the perks of divine magic.

It needs work - starting with a compelling raison d'etre for the class beyond "lookit, I took an arcane class and made it divine!"


The idea of the class is that you summon this creature that's like basically a servant of your god or similar. That's its raison d'etre. Personally, I would've liked the summoner to be a divine class from the beginning, or at least I would've liked a divine option, since I think it suits the class' role eminently.

I really fail to understand how anyone could consider channel energy anything but a massive downgrade, power-wise, as compared to the summon monster SLA. The latter is after all notorious for being such a powerful ability as to be preferable to having your eidolon out in a lot of cases. I definitely agree that the revelations are more powerful than the summoner class features they replace. This was intended to balance out the fact that this class casts off a vastly weaker spell list (since it's a 9-level spell list but they have 6-level casting, and thus get no early entry stuff) and because they replace the SM SLA with channel energy, a mediocre class feature even when optimized.

That being said, even though I don't agree with your estimation of the archetype's power level, I am all for changing, removing or adding things. I'm completely open to suggestions.

Cheers,
- Gears

Scarab Sages

Um, have you seen Channel Energy in action (especially Negative Channeling?) I have no idea why anyone would consider it "mediocre at best" - sounds like just another tunnel-vision bandwagon belief. Even then, unlike with the standard Summoner who must at all times choose between their Eidolon or an alternative, here you've got two assets that you can freely draw on simultaneously.

Vis-à-vis spell list; I get what you're saying about the comparative spell lists, but A) the Unchained Summoner, if that's what you're going off of, actually suffers that itself (which I don't support, otherwise liking it better than the original since you get an actual Outsider to consort with rather than a nonsensical Frankenmonster that's "I dunno, from somewhere"), and B) why not take the opportunity to make a custom divine-leaning Summoner spell list, level adjustments and all? It's what I'd do.

Here's a thought off the top of my head; rather than Oracular Mysteries (which are relatively ecumenical), why not give them Warpriest Blessings, which actually tie them closer to a deity (which it sounds like you're aiming for)?


I don't wish to get into a big argument about channelled energy. I have seen it in action and found it to be useful, but never a game changer. The idea for this archetype was a simple, quick and dirty divine option for the summoner. I've personally had a blast playing one, but YMMV. I have nothing against your suggestions, but they're beyond the scope of this rather humble project. The class needn't be deity-tied, but then again neither do oracles need to be ecumenical, so I feel like revelations are fine flavor-wise. Anyway, thanks for the input.

Cheers,
Gears

Scarab Sages

I've got a 3rd-level negative-channeling Cleric whose unusually-high Charisma makes her an exceptionally-powerful channeler - her current limited experience and the precise vicissitudes of her adventures thus far have left her with limited opportunities to show off this power, but it seems to me she'll be a singular terror waiting to happen when she feels like it (and yes, of course she has Selective Channeling).


My view of the whole matter is that yes, negative energy is a very dependable way of dealing damage without having to worry about energy resistance or DR. That's great. It's also an area of effect thing which, again, is nice, allowing you to deal damage to a bunch of foes all at once. But the damage itself (1d6 per odd-numbered class level) is hardly terrific. I've always felt like a cleric could utilize their standard actions for far better things. Especially if said cleric forgot about charisma and focused on wisdom, gaining more spells per day. That being said, I don't think channeling sucks, and arguably "mediocre" was a bit hyperbolic a word choice. I think channel energy is fine. It's a nice class feature.

Anyway, I'm going to keep it in simply because, this was just a little thing I threw together and I happened to find it fun playing one and wanted to share it. I do these little side projects now and again, but I prefer investing my real energy into original classes like the nihilurge and shadewright and similar. So I'll just let the sacral summoner rest untouched for now.

Cheers,
- Gears

Grand Lodge

2/3 casters typically don't get any bonus spells and this one gets a plethora of them. That alone is an extremely strong boost to power.

Eidolons are healable by magical healing to begin with.

I feel revelations (bonus spells aside) are much more powerful than the abilities they are replacing.


I would personally consider 2/3 spontaneous casting off the cleric/oracle spell list to be one of the least powerful 2/3 casting options I could imagine (second only to 2/3 casting off the druid or witch spell list). Basically, my thinking is that 2/3 cleric/oracle casting + revelation & cure/inflict bonus spells is still weaker, power-level-wise, than standard spontaneous casting off the summoner spell list. I would be open to arguments regarding why this is not so, of course. I wouldn't have a problem removing the spontaneous cure & inflict spells, actually, since the channeling does make those feel a bit superfluous anyway.

Good catch on the eidolons. I had somehow gotten it into my head they could only be healed via the summoner's specialist spells.

As has already been discussed, the revelations are definitely potentially more powerful than the class features they are replacing. This is because the archetype has worse casting than a standard summoner and also replaces the summon monster SLA with an inferior ability (i.e. channel energy).

Lastly, I should probably clarify that this is an archetype for the real summoner, not the unchained one. The latter I really do not care for, mechanically speaking, although I like some aspects of its flavor.

Cheers,
- Gears

EDIT: As noted, this was kind of just a thing I cobbled together rather swiftly. It's not one of my dedicated projects, so I fear I really don't have a lot of time to devote to tweaking it. While I appreciate the in-depth analysis, I think I'm just going to let this archetype quietly fade away for now, since it doesn't really seem to appeal to anyone else anyway. Cheers for the commentary, though, you two.

Grand Lodge

Ethereal Gears wrote:
I would personally consider 2/3 spontaneous casting off the cleric/oracle spell list to be one of the least powerful 2/3 casting options I could imagine (second only to 2/3 casting off the druid or witch spell list). Basically, my thinking is that 2/3 cleric/oracle casting + revelation & cure/inflict bonus spells is still weaker, power-level-wise, than standard spontaneous casting off the summoner spell list. I would be open to arguments regarding why this is not so, of course. I wouldn't have a problem removing the spontaneous cure & inflict spells, actually, since the channeling does make those feel a bit superfluous anyway.

I don't know that I agree with you. The cleric spell list is pretty powerful when you have share spells to use on an intelligent melee character. It's still not as powerful as the summoner list though. Regardless, that usually isn't a consideration when Paizo designs classes since they typically follow a standard formula without regards to power level. It's probably fine, but nothing can tell for sure without any playtesting.


I agree. If, down the line when I've finished some of my current homebrew projects I have time to playtest this one more thoroughly, I'll come back with an update on how it seems to balance out.

Cheers,
- Gears

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