At what location does an encounter happen?


Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion

Silver Crusade

The general situation is that you explore and begin an encounter. Something happens before the check that forces you to move to a different location. Where is this encounter now taking place, the old location, the new location, or a combination of both. Below is a more detailed specific situation (with potential spoilers) that came up in play.

We are playing the scenario "The Nahyndrian Mine". All the locations are closed save for two: Abattoir and Harvester's Pit. Crowe is at Harvester's Pit, and Shardra is at Abattoir. Shardra explores Abattoir and encounters the villain, Hepzamirah. Crowe attempts to temporarily close Harvester's Pit by summoning and defeating the henchman Harvester. Shardra fails her Strength check and is forced to move to the Harvester's Pit. Crowe succeeds at defeating the Harvester, temporarily closing Harvester's Pit.

What happens now? Does Shardra continue the villain encounter as though she had not moved? Can Crowe attempt one of the checks to defeat the villain now (following the sequential checks rule), since Shardra is now at his location. Is the villain difficulty still increased by the Abattoir "At This Location" effect? If (however it happens) the villain is defeated, is the Abattoir closed, thus winning the scenario (I believe this should be the case, because no matter what the villains location deck should be the one it came out of)?

We settled it for our game, but I'm still interested in how this situation should play out, in case it comes up again.


Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Maps, PF Special Edition, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Maps Subscriber

Shardra continues the encounter with the villain. If she succeeds, the villain's location (the Abbatoir) is closed. Shardra is not at the Abbatoir, so the At This Location effect for it does not impact her.

As for Crowe helping out... not sure on that one. I think RAW says yes he can help out, but I'm not convinced that is what RAI should be.


In a post I cannot currently locate, Vic Wertz wrote that an encounter happens where you are.

This leads to the resolution skizzerz has already pointed out.


Link to Vic's quote.


Hawkmoon269 wrote:
Link to Vic's quote.

Well seems to me that that doesn't answer precisely on all the points raised in this very good question from Parimer.

"Encounter happens where you are" clarifies for Alahazar but the full rule should be IMHO "Encounter happens where you are although the location and location deck of the encountered card don't change". It's tricky as a wording but seems to cover it. Especially where to shuffle back villains, henchmen or other banes and boons should some movement happens during the encounter.

Note that - should it happen in the future - there would be IMHO a difference if a encountered card who say : "If encountered in a location with an Abyssal trait" vs "If that card's location deck (if it comes from one) has that Abyssal trait"


Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Maps, PF Special Edition, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Maps Subscriber
Frencois wrote:
Hawkmoon269 wrote:
Link to Vic's quote.

Well seems to me that that doesn't answer precisely on all the points raised in this very good question from Parimer.

"Encounter happens where you are" clarifies for Alahazar but the full rule should be IMHO "Encounter happens where you are although the location and location deck of the encountered card don't change". It's tricky as a wording but seems to cover it. Especially where to shuffle back villains, henchmen or other banes and boons should some movement happens during the encounter.

Note that - should it happen in the future - there would be IMHO a difference if a encountered card who say : "If encountered in a location with an Abyssal trait" vs "If that card's location deck (if it comes from one) has that Abyssal trait"

That clarification/wording change is not needed, all of the relevant rules already focus on the location deck the card came from and not the location you're currently at:


  • For defeating villains: If You Defeat the Villain, Close the Villain's Location. I think we can all agree that Villain's Location = location deck you pulled the villain out of.
  • For evasion: If you evade the card ... shuffle it back into the deck. "Back into the deck" implies the deck it came from due to the word back.
  • For undefeated stuff: it is undefeated -- shuffle the card back into its location deck. Even more explicit than evasion, but again is the deck it came from


Agreed, that's absolutely how we play and the rules are self-sufficient for any PACG veteran. But I can understand that a newbee may have to think it over twice to understand how a monster may still have its deck in location A when you encounter it in location B.

Paizo Employee Chief Technical Officer

The quote referenced above was only as accurate as it needed to be to answer the question being asked, and it's technically incorrect. Technically, *encounters* don't happen at any location.

"Where the encounter is" is never relevant—no cards or rules ask about it. The things that may be relevant are where the encountering character is, and where the encountered card is (if it's even in a location), and those two things need not be the same.


Perfect Vic.
This is how i will explain it to newbees to avoid tricky questions.

Actually this can lead to fun situation like :
Character A is exploring. She is in location X, but for whatever reason has a power allowing her to explore location Y.
Character B is in location Y and has a power allowing her to add to the check of a character at another location.
Then actually B can help for a check against a card at its own location.
Fun.


Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Maps, PF Special Edition, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Maps Subscriber
Frencois wrote:

Perfect Vic.

This is how i will explain it to newbees to avoid tricky questions.

Actually this can lead to fun situation like :
Character A is exploring. She is in location X, but for whatever reason has a power allowing her to explore location Y.
Character B is in location Y and has a power allowing her to add to the check of a character at another location.
Then actually B can help for a check against a card at its own location.
Fun.

I'd explain it that both A and B are at Y but A moves to X as part of a Before You Act power on the encountered card.

This is because exploration is required to be at your character's location due to how the rule is worded: "When you explore, flip over the top card of your current location deck. If it is a boon, you may attempt to acquire it; if you don't attempt that, banish it. If it's a ban, you must try to defeat it."

Either that or reword A's power as allowing her to encounter a card at another location deck, rather than explore it.

EDIT: I totally just realized those were two separate thoughts (how to explain it to newbies and a hypothetical "fun" situation -- not that the situation is something you'd be explaining to newbies), but leaving reply intact because note about it being impossible to explore a location you aren't at is still valid. A power could exist that can do something similar to that, but it wouldn't be called exploring.


Vic Wertz wrote:

The quote referenced above was only as accurate as it needed to be to answer the question being asked, and it's technically incorrect. Technically, *encounters* don't happen at any location.

"Where the encounter is" is never relevant—no cards or rules ask about it. The things that may be relevant are where the encountering character is, and where the encountered card is (if it's even in a location), and those two things need not be the same.

So umm. I'm still lost on how cards like abattoir work.

Let's say Hepzamirah is part of the Abattoir and Shardra is no longer there.
So is the villains difficulty increased because she is part of that location or is it not since the character does not encounter her there.
The first one would mean that a character at the abattoir encountering a summoned bane would not increase the difficulty since that bane is not part of the location.


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Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Maps, PF Special Edition, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Maps Subscriber
Michael Klaus wrote:
Vic Wertz wrote:

The quote referenced above was only as accurate as it needed to be to answer the question being asked, and it's technically incorrect. Technically, *encounters* don't happen at any location.

"Where the encounter is" is never relevant—no cards or rules ask about it. The things that may be relevant are where the encountering character is, and where the encountered card is (if it's even in a location), and those two things need not be the same.

So umm. I'm still lost on how cards like abattoir work.

Let's say Hepzamirah is part of the Abattoir and Shardra is no longer there.
So is the villains difficulty increased because she is part of that location or is it not since the character does not encounter her there.
The first one would mean that a character at the abattoir encountering a summoned bane would not increase the difficulty since that bane is not part of the location.

The character's location is the only thing that matters. If the character doing the check is at the Abattoir, the difficulty is increased. If the character doing the check is not there, the difficulty is not increased. That is the only thing you need to care about and check, everything else (such as the fact the villain is from the Abattoir location deck) is irrelevant for At This Location powers.

Now, if Shardra successfully defeats the villain, then the villain's location deck matters -- the Abattoir gets closed and the villain attempts to escape. It does not close Shardra's location if she's somewhere else.

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