Hey everyone I am looking for a way to get the lead blades spell for a warpriest build I am working on. The plan was to have her be devoted to Cayden and use a rapier and I was thinking about sticking with the rapier and fencing grace, but I lookng for ways to increase my weapon damage dice. Lead blades (especially if castable through fervor) would be ideal but I am looking into all other options, dipping if I have too.
Thanks
Why? Your damage die would go from 1d6 to 1d8, so an average of 1 extra damage for level 1-4. By level 5, your sacred weapon damage is already 1d8 and Lead Blades has no benefit whatsoever.
Would you really consider dipping out of a casting class to get 1 extra damage?
I'm actually trying to do the same for my Warpriest of Ragathiel. I'm completely uninterested in dipping, and I don't have skill ranks, free trait spot, or Charisma mod to dependably use a Wand.
i think I'm gonna have to rely on Potions of Enlarge until I can pick up Righteous Might. oh well.
And actually, this may be one of the few times when Feral Hunter (the archetype) is worth it ... free, constant +2 enhancement bonus to the Ability score of your choice on top of Lead Blades and Faerie Fire?
If I had room to dip, I totally would.
Why? Your damage die would go from 1d6 to 1d8, so an average of 1 extra damage for level 1-4. By level 5, your sacred weapon damage is already 1d8 and Lead Blades has no benefit whatsoever.
Would you really consider dipping out of a casting class to get 1 extra damage?
I believe the ruling is that Lead blades makes your weapon count as one size larger so the effect would stack, lead blades allow you to use the Large warpriest sacred weapon table: So at level 5 I would be doing 2d6 with a a sacred rapier and lead blades if I could manage it.
You could play a Samsaran and thus be perfectly legal to port Lead Blades from the Ranger to your Warpriest.
But playing anything other than a Human or Human-descended race (Half-Orc, Half-Elf, Scion of Humanity Aasimar, etc.) as a Warpriest is just... you really miss out on Bonus Feats at that point
You're honestly probably better off as a Human taking Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Sawtooth Sabre), TWF, Weapon finesse, and Slashing Grace, however.
As a Human, you go:
Deity Achaekek (Sawtooth Sabre)
Race Weapon Finesse
CL1 Slashing Grace (Sawtooth Sabre), Weapon Focus (Sawtooth Sabre)
CL2
CL3 Two-Weapon Fighting, Dual Enhancement,
CL4
CL5 Double Slice
CL6 Greater Weapon Focus (Sawtooth Sabre), Improved Two-Weapon Fighting
You would be able to completely drop Strength, while your Dex is up at 16+ would mean you'd only really need to focus on Dex and Wis.
I believe the ruling is that Lead blades makes your weapon count as one size larger so the effect would stack, lead blades allow you to use the Large warpriest sacred weapon table: So at level 5 I would be doing 2d6 with a a sacred rapier and lead blades if I could manage it.
Oh, is that how it really works? I did not think they could stack, but perhaps I am mistaken.
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Deity Achaekek (Sawtooth Sabre)
Race Weapon Finesse
CL1 Slashing Grace (Sawtooth Sabre), Weapon Focus (Sawtooth Sabre)
CL2
CL3 Two-Weapon Fighting, Dual Enhancement,
CL4
CL5 Double Slice
CL6 Greater Weapon Focus (Sawtooth Sabre), Improved Two-Weapon FightingYou would be able to completely drop Strength, while your Dex is up at 16+ would mean you'd only really need to focus on Dex and Wis.
You can't take Greater Weapon Focus at level 6 even with a bonus feat, and you would need the bonus feat for improved TWF if you wen this route.
Lead Blades won't work with a Rapier with Fervor, because Fervor casts the spell on YOU.
Lead Blades is a personal spell, you cast it on yourself, not your weapon.
Lead Blades is the spell version of Impact.
Enlarge makes you and your weapons Large.
Impact treats your weapons as Huge.
BUT, Lead Blades and Impact don't stack, both because Impact is derived from Lead Blades, and because they both say "treat as Size Category +1".
Enlarge Person and Righteous Might actually MAKE you bigger, and your gear along with you.
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You would be able to completely drop Strength, while your Dex is up at 16+ would mean you'd only really need to focus on Dex and Wis.
You can only do that combo if you dip into either Swashbuckler or Daring Cavalier. Otherwise you get the dex to damage, but you'd still be using your strength to hit with the sawtoothed sabres.
You would be able to completely drop Strength, while your Dex is up at 16+ would mean you'd only really need to focus on Dex and Wis.You can only do that combo if you dip into either Swashbuckler or Daring Cavalier. Otherwise you get the dex to damage, but you'd still be using your strength to hit with the sawtoothed sabres.
Ah, I forgot that Sawtooth Sabres aren't Finesse weapons...
Still, I can think of a LOT worse things than also having access to Opportune Parry & Riposte, so...
You can't take Greater Weapon Focus at level 6 even with a bonus feat, and you would need the bonus feat for improved TWF if you wen this route.
Deity Achaekek (Sawtooth Sabre)
Race Weapon Finesse
CL1 Slashing Grace (Sawtooth Sabre), Weapon Focus (Sawtooth Sabre)
CL2
CL3 Two-Weapon Fighting, Dual Enhancement,
CL4
CL5 Double Slice
CL6 Greater Weapon Focus (Sawtooth Sabre), Improved Two-Weapon FightingYou would be able to completely drop Strength, while your Dex is up at 16+ would mean you'd only really need to focus on Dex and Wis.
Warpriest gives you 2 Bonus Combat Feats at lv6 as a human, so ITWF is applicable at 6 here (but only here, otherwise you have to wait to lv9).
However, yeah, I forgot GWF is requires lv8, so the earliest you could take that is lv9.
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You would be able to completely drop Strength, while your Dex is up at 16+ would mean you'd only really need to focus on Dex and Wis.You can only do that combo if you dip into either Swashbuckler or Daring Cavalier. Otherwise you get the dex to damage, but you'd still be using your strength to hit with the sawtoothed sabres.Ah, I forgot that Sawtooth Sabres aren't Finesse weapons...
Still, I can think of a LOT worse things than also having access to Opportune Parry & Riposte, so...
Yeah - Swashbuckler is tailor made for 1 level dipping. Without the dip the only weapon which can be used for dex to hit & damage is the aldori dueling sword.
I think that as a full class Daring Cavalier is actually a superior 20 level class for the dex combatant - but the Swashbuckler is better for dipping.
Edit: Arguably a heavy shield with the shield-trained trait & weapon versatility can get dex to hit & damage. :P I don't think that I'd use or allow it - but there's a RAW argument to be made.
Chbgraphicarts, I like it but not the way I think I am going. Definitely trying to maximize a once hit a round character, probably with vital strike (which is why I want to get my weapon dice up) but also there is a chance this will be a Mythic character for WotR.
Lead Blades is the spell version of Impact.
Enlarge makes you and your weapons Large.
Impact treats your weapons as Huge.
BUT, Lead Blades and Impact don't stack, both because Impact is derived from Lead Blades, and because they both say "treat as Size Category +1".
Enlarge Person and Righteous Might actually MAKE you bigger, and your gear along with you.
Are you saying this is a reason why Lead Blades and Sacred Weapon don't stack?
If so, I don't think that argument holds up, because the wording in Sacred Weapon doesn't use that same phrasing AND doesn't say anything about size increases for the weapon at all.
Its just a flat "the weapon damage is based on his level and not the weapon type".
... or did I miss your point entirely? (it happens)
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Yeah - Swashbuckler is tailor made for 1 level dipping. Without the dip the only weapon which can be used for dex to hit & damage is the aldori dueling sword.I think that as a full class Daring Cavalier is actually a superior 20 level class for the dex combatant - but the Swashbuckler is better for dipping.
I actually like a four level dip for the whirling dervish swashbuckler. You trade easy panache regeneration for dex to damage with ALL swashbuckler's finesse weapons.
I really need to make my Dex based Basher with a morning star, but it would also make a great entry for a Dex based Samarai using TWF with two wakizashis.
I guess it'd look a little more like this:
Deity Achaekek (Sawtooth Sabre)
Race Two-Weapon Fighting
CL1 Swsh1 Weapon Finesse
CL2 Warp1 Weapon Focus (Sawtooth Sabre)
CL3 Warp2 Slashing Grace (Sawtooth Sabre)
CL4 Warp3 Double Slice
CL5 Warp4 Dual Enhancement
CL6 Warp5
CL7 Warp6 Improved Two-Weapon Fighting, ???, ???
Lead Blades is the spell version of Impact.
Enlarge makes you and your weapons Large.
Impact treats your weapons as Huge.
BUT, Lead Blades and Impact don't stack, both because Impact is derived from Lead Blades, and because they both say "treat as Size Category +1".
Enlarge Person and Righteous Might actually MAKE you bigger, and your gear along with you.
Are you saying this is a reason why Lead Blades and Sacred Weapon don't stack?
If so, I don't think that argument holds up, because the wording in Sacred Weapon doesn't use that same phrasing AND doesn't say anything about size increases for the weapon at all.
Its just a flat "the weapon damage is based on his level and not the weapon type".
... or did I miss your point entirely? (it happens)
Yeah, you completely missed my point. Like, "other side of the world" missed it.
Sacred Weapon replaces the weapon's normal damage with Sacred Weapon's, unless the normal weapon's damage is greater.
Enlarge Person turns you and your weapons Large, so you use the Large column of the Sacred Weapon to determine its damage now.
Lead Blades treats your weapons as one larger than your current physical size.
So a Large lv12 Warpriest with Lead Blades active deals 1d10>>>2d8>>>3d8 damage
However, Lead Blades and Impact DON'T stack because they do the same thing.
LOL. Yep. That happens. Thanks for clarifying for me. :)
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But sacred weapon lets you use the damage dice of the weapon or the sacred weapon damage, whichever is greater.
If you have a rapier (d6) with lead blades (d8), and you have sacred weapon (d8), you still just have a d8 either way.
You have to be 10th level before your sacred weapon does more than a rapier with lead blades (d10).
Enlarge or Righteous Might will increase the whole thing one step, but Lead Blades doesn't stack on top of sacred weapon. They are two separate totals that you get to choose between based on which is bigger.
Nope. You would have the choice of the rapier's base damage enlarged, or your sacred weapon damage enlarged. There is already a handy chart for large or small sacred weapon damage.
chbgraphicarts, if you're going to suggest a warpriest that starts off with a one level dip in swashbuckler, I'd seriously consider going Sacred Fist (but still wearing armour) rather than standard Warpriest. Flurry saves you having to get the TWF chain, having to buy two weapons, and lets you have a light shield instead. No Sacred Weapon won't have any effect until Warpriest 10, and in the meantime, you'll have considerably more money and AC.
TGMaxMaxer, Lead Blades absolutely stacks with sacred weapon; they're doing two entirely different things.
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Nope. You would have the choice of the rapier's base damage enlarged, or your sacred weapon damage enlarged. There is already a handy chart for large or small sacred weapon damage.But sacred weapon lets you use the damage dice of the weapon or the sacred weapon damage, whichever is greater.
If you have a rapier (d6) with lead blades (d8), and you have sacred weapon (d8), you still just have a d8 either way.
You have to be 10th level before your sacred weapon does more than a rapier with lead blades (d10).
Enlarge or Righteous Might will increase the whole thing one step, but Lead Blades doesn't stack on top of sacred weapon. They are two separate totals that you get to choose between based on which is bigger.
I'm not saying anyone is right or wrong as I don't know the correct answer, but this is misrepresenting the table. The table is titled "Small or Large Warpriest Sacred Weapon Damage". It's based off of the size of the warpriest, not the size of the weapon.
Whether or not lead blades goes into effect before or after sacred weapon I have no idea.
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I'm not saying anyone is right or wrong as I don't know the correct answer, but this is misrepresenting the table. The table is titled "Small or Large Warpriest Sacred Weapon Damage". It's based off of the size of the warpriest, not the size of the weapon.Whether or not lead blades goes into effect before or after sacred weapon I have no idea.
It's the same as a monk. The monk unarmed damage chart for small or large monks is based on the size of the monk, but if you have an impact amulet of mighty fists, you are still using the large chart.
Likewise, if Hunter 1/Brawler 5 had cast lead blades while wearing a cestus, the damage would be 1d8 (1d6 Brawler -4 UAS damage enlarged), not 1d6(1d4 Cestus damage enlarged).
I'm not saying anyone is right or wrong as I don't know the correct answer, but this is misrepresenting the table. The table is titled "Small or Large Warpriest Sacred Weapon Damage". It's based off of the size of the warpriest, not the size of the weapon.Whether or not lead blades goes into effect before or after sacred weapon I have no idea.
It's the same as a monk. The monk unarmed damage chart for small or large monks is based on the size of the monk, but if you have an impact amulet of mighty fists, you are still using the large chart.
Likewise, if Hunter 1/Brawler 5 had cast lead blades while wearing a cestus, the damage would be 1d8 (1d6 Brawler -4 UAS damage enlarged), not 1d6(1d4 Cestus damage enlarged).
Is there an FAQ on this somewhere?
For Warpriest of Ragathiel, this is how I got my "fake" Lead Blades.
first 3 levels, grab the Weapon of the Chosen Feat Chain.
At 3rd level, buy myself a Large Bastard Sword.
tada! I'm doing Large Bastard Sword Damage. I am rolling at a -2 to hit but I get to roll 2D20 and take the high dice. My weapon also counts as good and I get a fake blind fighting feat.
Now I just need potions of Enlarge.
I'm going for all of that plus Lead Blades plus Vital Strike. >:D
8d8 FTW!
Me: (digs around in my dice bag, pulling out as many d8's as I can ... looks at player to my left) "Hey, you got any d8's ... I need a few more on my turn."