A creature with Grab can grapple at a -20 penalty; if it succeeds then it does not gain the grappled condition. Grapple rules state that when grappled, non-adjacent creatures are moved to adjacent spaces. Can the controlling creature (the one without the grappled condition) then move or 5 ft. step away from the grappled creature, assuming it stays within the controller's reach? Nothing I am seeing currently suggests that it breaks the grapple, though I presume whenever the controller makes a successful grapple check the creatures would be moved adjacent again.
These are potentially useful tactics for White-Haired Witches, who gain a psuedo-Grab, without the -20 on grapple.
I'd appreciate some feedback on this. Thanks!
No. If you want to move a creature while you are grappling it, you must succeed at a grapple check to "move".
Just because you don't gain the grappled condition doesn't mean you aren't still in a grapple.
Thanks, but to clarify:
1) I had understood that a creature like a Roc can Flyby, Attack+Grab at a -20, and then continue on its way with a grappled creature, for instance. This is not correct? The Roc does not gain the grappled condition in that instance and so has no restrictions on movement.
2) The witch question is not about moving the opponent, but moving away from the opponent. You do not have the grappled condition and have no restrictions on movement. My question was: Does movement away from the grappled creature end the grapple?
Ah, I get what you're asking now. Its... not covered well in the rules.
I would interpret that anything which makes the creatures no longer adjacent to each other ends the grapple.
If you successfully grapple a creature that is not adjacent to you, move that creature to an adjacent open space (if no space is available, your grapple fails).
Grab does not give you any special ability to drag the creature along with you, so if you move away, the creature is no longer adjacent and therefore the grapple has failed. Alternately, if you want to move the creature, when you make your grapple check (at -20) you can chose the move action, to move the creature with you.
Ah, I get what you're asking now. Its... not covered well in the rules.
No kidding. I had the idea yesterday and have been looking since then.
Returning to the Grab question, it seems like your interpretation is nearly identical to normal grapple rules, you just take a massive penalty in order to continue to threaten. I suppose this is why absolutely no one uses Grab in that capacity in any game ever.
Basically. The other way you could run it is you get full movement assuming you succeed on the grapple check. I'd say ask the GM to make a call on it, and run it that way consistently.