|
So, I've determined that a Bonded Item isn't as good as a familiar (arguably, but that's a different thread.)
Now; for the choosing:
The Familiars that I'm trying to choose between (I'll note that I'm a Wizard in the Foresight Subschool):
Dodo- +4 on Initiative
Dwarf Caiman- +3 Stealth
Fox- +2 Reflex Saves
Pig- +3 Diplomacy
Skunk- +2 Fort (I already have a Familiar sheet made up for this one)
Squirrel- +3 Sleight of Hand (this would be cool as I have this: http://fantasypuppet.com/images/Dormouse1.jpg)
Thrush*- +3 Diplomacy
Toad- +3 HP
Toucan- +3 Diplomacy
Turtle- +1 to AC
*Can Speak
So which do you like most, and which should a Varisian traveling wizard who grew up traveling take as his familiar? Also, if any of these turn out to not be PFS legal, please let me know. Thanks guys!
So, the +4 Initiative is usually regarded to be the flat-out most powerful, though you need not choose it for that reason alone, and indeed the +4 initiative familiars are (intentionally?) impractical from a thematic standpoint. The fact that you are a diviner slightly lessens the need for initiative, but it's still probably the best from a sheer numbers perspective.
Any that grant a skill bonus are not worth considering unless you are taking other steps to be good at that skill. For example, don't take a raccoon unless you also take, say, a trait to make sleight of hand a class skill for you. Don't take a Toucan unless you also take Clever Wordplay trait, etc.
The +2 to saves are not bad mechanically; probably second to the initiative from a pure numbers standpoint.
For my personal favorite, I like the fox; the +2 reflex saves is a reasonably good bonus, and I really like foxes.
|
|
So, the +4 Initiative is usually regarded to be the flat-out most powerful, though you need not choose it for that reason alone, and indeed the +4 initiative familiars are (intentionally?) impractical from a thematic standpoint. The fact that you are a diviner slightly lessens the need for initiative, but it's still probably the best from a sheer numbers perspective.
Any that grant a skill bonus are not worth considering unless you are taking other steps to be good at that skill. For example, don't take a raccoon unless you also take, say, a trait to make sleight of hand a class skill for you. Don't take a Toucan unless you also take Clever Wordplay trait, etc.
The +2 to saves are not bad mechanically; probably second to the initiative from a pure numbers standpoint.
For my personal favorite, I like the fox; the +2 reflex saves is a reasonably good bonus, and I really like foxes.
Yes, Init is a crazy good boon. I was probably going to pick up a Dodo for that reason. That, and I love the idea of having a Dodo as a familiar.
Actually, due to your advice, I do have clever wordplay. :PYou would indeed be right about the skill bonuses not being great, except maybe diplomacy or stealth, which are both very good skills to have.
Is there an obvious advantage to having a talking familiar? There's a debate going on right now, but a general consensus says that familiars that can talk can wield wands.
The Clever Wordplay will be useful with or without the +3 from the familiar.
In PFS basic familiars can't wield wands. There is a specific list of familiars given in PFS that can wield wands, and I'm reasonably certain that none of the basic ones can. Which makes sense for balance reasons. Besides, the charisma of a raven would make it terrible at the Use Magic Device checks needed for wands. Lyrakien Azata, which is the Improved Familiar that your alignment will go for, definitely can, and has a high charisma besides.
Thus, the only advantage to a talking familiar is for roleplaying reasons, or to have it carry messages.
Note that eventually you'll need to put ranks into Use Magic Device, since the familiar uses YOUR ranks in skills, with their own ability modifiers.
|
|
The Clever Wordplay will be useful with or without the +3 from the familiar.
In PFS basic familiars can't wield wands. There is a specific list of familiars given in PFS that can wield wands, and I'm reasonably certain that none of the basic ones can. Which makes sense for balance reasons. Besides, the charisma of a raven would make it terrible at the Use Magic Device checks needed for wands. Lyrakien Azata, which is the Improved Familiar that your alignment will go for, definitely can, and has a high charisma besides.
Thus, the only advantage to a talking familiar is for roleplaying reasons, or to have it carry messages.
Note that eventually you'll need to put ranks into Use Magic Device, since the familiar uses YOUR ranks in skills, with their own ability modifiers.
Oh okay, so, like a Mephit or something can. Gotcha.
So... We can eliminate all the familiars that give cruddy bonuses to skills, like the Raven, Goat, etc.Let me make a quick edit...
Okay. I got rid of useless skills. I kept Diplomacy, and Stealth on there, though. I also kept the squirrel, because I wanna keep the option open for my AWESOME puppet. And yes, it does sit on my shoulder.
So, the +4 Initiative is usually regarded to be the flat-out most powerful, though you need not choose it for that reason alone, and indeed the +4 initiative familiars are (intentionally?) impractical from a thematic standpoint. The fact that you are a diviner slightly lessens the need for initiative, but it's still probably the best from a sheer numbers perspective.
Any that grant a skill bonus are not worth considering unless you are taking other steps to be good at that skill. For example, don't take a raccoon unless you also take, say, a trait to make sleight of hand a class skill for you. Don't take a Toucan unless you also take Clever Wordplay trait, etc.
The +2 to saves are not bad mechanically; probably second to the initiative from a pure numbers standpoint.
For my personal favorite, I like the fox; the +2 reflex saves is a reasonably good bonus, and I really like foxes.
+1 to everything said here, down to really liking foxes. Improved Familiars do get handy tricks (the 7th lvl ones anyhow), even if they can't use wands.
|
|
+1 to everything said here, down to really liking foxes. Improved Familiars do get handy tricks (the 7th lvl ones anyhow), even if they can't use wands.So, the +4 Initiative is usually regarded to be the flat-out most powerful, though you need not choose it for that reason alone, and indeed the +4 initiative familiars are (intentionally?) impractical from a thematic standpoint. The fact that you are a diviner slightly lessens the need for initiative, but it's still probably the best from a sheer numbers perspective.
Any that grant a skill bonus are not worth considering unless you are taking other steps to be good at that skill. For example, don't take a raccoon unless you also take, say, a trait to make sleight of hand a class skill for you. Don't take a Toucan unless you also take Clever Wordplay trait, etc.
The +2 to saves are not bad mechanically; probably second to the initiative from a pure numbers standpoint.
For my personal favorite, I like the fox; the +2 reflex saves is a reasonably good bonus, and I really like foxes.
Yeah, definitely getting Improved Familiar at lvl 7. If only I get make a homonculus (sob). Why Paizo? Why must you do dis?
It's my personal opinion that you're never going to be able to be good enough at Stealth to justify that skill, but others may disagree.
The turtle also isn't that great, since the AC bonus it grants is a natural one, it doesn't apply to touch AC. Additionally, you won't be able to keep your AC high enough as a wizard to make much of a difference.
If you really want to use your puppet, this is honestly what I would do. "This is my fox familiar. You don't think he looks like a fox? Well, he doesn't like the look of you, either?" =D You could do the same with the skunk. The +3 Sleight of Hand is, honestly, a waste of a bonus.
|
|
It's my personal opinion that you're never going to be able to be good enough at Stealth to justify that skill, but others may disagree.
The turtle also isn't that great, since the AC bonus it grants is a natural one, it doesn't apply to touch AC. Additionally, you won't be able to keep your AC high enough as a wizard to make much of a difference.
If you really want to use your puppet, this is honestly what I would do. "This is my fox familiar. You don't think he looks like a fox? Well, he doesn't like the look of you, either?" =D You could do the same with the skunk.
Oh, I don't need to use my squirrel, I just thought it would be silly and fun. I'll make one more edit then. Bye bye Mr. Caiman!
Nope. Dang. It's been an hour, I guess.
I'd eliminate the pig and the Toucan. Being able to speak may not be that important, but it's better than not being able to. Regarding the Diplomacy bonus in general: from a numbers standpoint, it is inferior to the other options. You should consider it if being Diplomatic is important to your character concept, but if it's not important to your character concept, then I would eliminate all three of those.
Personally, I'd eliminate the Toad, too. The +3 hp is a nice boon at 1st and 2nd level, but it falls behind the other benefits after that. Or, you can use it for level 1, then get rid of it when you hit level 2. (PFS lets you make changes to your character without penalty when you hit level 2, though if you make changes after that point you have to pay associated costs).
|
|
I'd eliminate the pig and the Toucan. Being able to speak may not be that important, but it's better than not being able to. Regarding the Diplomacy bonus in general: from a numbers standpoint, it is inferior to the other options. You should consider it if being Diplomatic is important to your character concept, but if it's not important to your character concept, then I would eliminate all three of those.
Personally, I'd eliminate the Toad, too. The +3 hp is a nice boon at 1st and 2nd level, but it falls behind the other benefits after that. Or, you can use it for level 1, then get rid of it when you hit level 2. (PFS lets you make changes to your character without penalty when you hit level 2, though if you make changes after that point you have to pay associated costs).
I was thinking about eliminating those two anyways, so I got rid of them.
I also got rid of toad, which I thought was a strong contender. Oh well.I also added Hedgehog because it gives a will bonus.
And then there were 5...
Ah, Hedgehog! I knew one was missing.
Beyond here, it really comes down to personal preference. Mechanically, initiative is strongest, followed by saves, followed by Diplomacy. But there's no more I can point at and say "get rid of that".
|
|
Ah, Hedgehog! I knew one was missing.
Beyond here, it really comes down to personal preference. Mechanically, initiative is strongest, followed by saves, followed by Diplomacy. But there's no more I can point at and say "get rid of that".
Gotcha. Allright. Now it's down to favorite animals and the animals stats.
|
|
Just my $0.02, having played with familiars .... Diplomacy IS an often used skill check in PFS. Behind Perception, diplomacy is the most used skill, so keep that in mind. And a talking familiar is handy for delivering messages.
However, a squirrel sock puppet would be something to behold ....
Oh, Zealot is much more than a sock puppet... He's amazing.
Anyway, yeah...It's come down to the Skunk, who has a little more offensive abilities,
The Thrush, which has a pretty good buff and some spying/distracting capabilities, as well as the ability to talk.
And the Fox, who has a lot of skills and really good stats, but a not as necessary +2 reflex save bonus.
I currently have +1 Fort, +2 Reflex, and +2 Will
I have a 5 in diplomacy, because I made it into a INT skill using Clever Wordplay Trait
There are going to be a lot of DCs in steps of 5 for PFS. So, DC 15, DC 20, etc. In most cases, you can take 10, so you can succeed on the DC 15 easily. If you want to succeed on the DC 20s, though, you'll want to get the Thrush. Then, by the time you hit level 3, you'll have a +10 modifier to Diplomacy, allowing you to hit the DC 20s by taking 10. By the time you hit level 7, and lose the thrush since you're taking Improved Familiar, you can have enough ranks in Diplomacy to keep your bonus at at least +10.
|
|
Someone just brought something up on the Wizard Build thread I have going:
I'm a Sczarni. By that standard, Sleight of Hand is pretty good considering secondary winning conditions. I'll also see if any familiar gives you bluff, but I don't remember any. Is this a valid argument, or does it still stink when it comes to familiar choice?
|
|
There are going to be a lot of DCs in steps of 5 for PFS. So, DC 15, DC 20, etc. In most cases, you can take 10, so you can succeed on the DC 15 easily. If you want to succeed on the DC 20s, though, you'll want to get the Thrush. Then, by the time you hit level 3, you'll have a +10 modifier to Diplomacy, allowing you to hit the DC 20s by taking 10. By the time you hit level 7, and lose the thrush since you're taking Improved Familiar, you can have enough ranks in Diplomacy to keep your bonus at at least +10.
And I think that would be pretty good as a Sczarni. I need to be a smooth-talker.
Did you see the Student of Philosophy trait I linked before?
|
|
Did you see the Student of Philosophy trait I linked before?
lol. Yeah. Changing it right now, in fact.
|
|
Think your choices come down to just 2 of them.
Skunk: +2 Fort
PFS really likes the Fort Saves. As in Swarms that poison, Creatures (ghouls)or tunnels (sewers) that stink, and rogues that use poison. All require Fort Saves.Dodo: +4 on Initiative
Initiative is always good. A diviner specially abilities doesn't really get good till the higher levels. Which from the sound of things, you're looking at grabbing a Improved Familiar around then.
So the Dodo would give you that +4 Init till then, when your class abilities would pick up the slack when you change it out for something else.
You do have a point. I'm not picking up Dodo though, because they are pretty lousy as actual animals go, they're just a good buff.
I might just stick with my skunk, because I know first hand how insane Fort roles can be.The last option that it really comes down to, though, is a Thrush. Those little guys give me a much needed Diplomacy bonus, as my CHA is 10. I do get bonuses in certain situations, but diplomacy could be useful. Not to mention the stealing and spying potential a thrush carries- very useful to a Sczarni.
Ultimately I would probably go with the Thrush; not because it's the "best", but I think you'll find it the most fun.
|
|
Yep. I think the Thrush would be best. All right!
Thanks for all of your help. I'm gonna go print off a character sheet and get my stuffed mourning dove off my shelf. (Sure, it's a mourning dove and not a thrush, but they look somewhat similar in stuffed animal form)
really though, I have a HORRID time trying to make up my mind on things like this, so it was a big help.