Fixing up an 11th level bard

[Ayanzo]

So when I first started playing pathfinder, I came in as a 6th level Bard. Being new I simply picked what I thought looked cool and sounded useful so my character is heavily Un optimized.

St 16
Dex 15
Con 14
Int 14
Wis 12
Cha 20

He's taken the daredevil archetype and used a whip and rapier. Not terribly effective at either.

Spell list
1st
Chord of Shards
Comprehend languages
Saving finale
Expedia retreat
Grease
Vanish

2nd
glitter dust
Mirror image
Invisibility
Heroism
Cure moderate wounds

3rd
Jesters jaunt
Good Hope
Blink
Arcane concordance

4th
Cure critical wounds
Wall of sound
Heroic Finale

Feats
Skill focus U m d
Dodge
Mobility
Spring attack
Improved initiative
Toughness
Discordant voice

It's quite the mix and I tried to fix it as I learned during play, but it is what it is. I can however augment with Masterpieces...

I was thinking about taking Triple time for comprehend languages, and Vindictive Soliloquy for wall of sound since we have a wand of frost. I'm assuming I could get 30s of singing possibly before combat to avoid the 5 round cost.

The only performances being sing 10 and strings 10 (ranks).

Being a daredevil, many core bard abilities are swapped out so it's somewhat limiting since it's pretty hard to hit anything at our current C.R. with only a +11 making Spring a near waste.

Now that I've joined several other campaigns with more thoughtful characters, trying to perform surgery on this one is difficult.

I don't want to retire him and the absence of dimension door is a world rule involving teleportation. And the world is very low magic item so all those magical goodies have to be found.

[Atarlost]

You really desperately need retraining to get out of your archetype. There are official retraining rules in Ultimate Campaign.

Your spell choices are pretty good. For low magic the feats might not be terrible either: low magic means no AC for PCs, but full AC for monsters so trading full attacks is a bad deal. I'd ditch skill focus for arcane strike if it were an option.

There's really no way to get around the lack of inspire courage, though. You need that to hit well and in a low magic game even your martial friends could use the help, much less other semi-martials.

If stats can be tweaked your charisma is excessive, especially with that spell list. You'd do better with more strength instead.

[Deadmanwalking]

Honestly, swap him out from Daredevil to core Bard, scrap Skill Focus for Power Attack, see if you can drop something for Arcane Strike, and swap out some third level spell (or use the Human Favored Class bonus) to get Haste if nobody in the party has it. Do this and add a few ranks of Perform (Dance) for his third Versatile Performance, and...he's not that bad.

It's really mostly a few Feat choices and the Daredevil Archetype (which is just bad) that are holding you back. Though a Strength belt would help as well.

Will he be optimal after that? No, but he'll be miles closer.

[Ayanzo]

That's the problem.. retraining is near impossible due to the chain of events in motion. Most towns are rubble or small due to a region wide invasion. There's also a world clock on cataclysmic events you know: the "I'd love to but... gotta save the world here"

We are however mythic T2

Marshal, decisive strike, focus
Extra order, advance
Feat dual path arch mage wild arcana.

On a phone here, forgive my crappyness.

From what I see, my options look like masterpieces and preparing for 12th level. Possibly changing my style of play which currently is pure support and half cleric who just happens to hold a weapon..

We have a dragon disciple paladin (sorc), a pure sorceror, as well as a druid and rogue. Haste is covered by the sorceror.

[Atarlost]

Deadmanwalking wrote:

Honestly, swap him out from Daredevil to core Bard, scrap Skill Focus for Power Attack, see if you can drop something for Arcane Strike, and swap out some third level spell (or use the Human Favored Class bonus) to get Haste if nobody in the party has it. Do this and add a few ranks of Perform (Dance) for his third Versatile Performance, and...he's not that bad.

It's really mostly a few Feat choices and the Daredevil Archetype (which is just bad) that are holding you back. Though a Strength belt would help as well.

Will he be optimal after that? No, but he'll be miles closer.

In a low magic campaign I'd say arcane strike is higher priority than power attack. Not having a level appropriate magic weapon or stat belt is going to hurt your accuracy enough to make power attack not such a good deal.

And without retraining there is nothing that can be done for this character. You're stuck playing a non-performing bard as a caster because you took an archetype that throws away your combat effectiveness. It's better than nothing, but there's no path forward. You're going to continue losing ground in both combat and casting until you're useless in the former and barely worth a cohort in the latter.

[Corlindale]

Mythic Arcane Strike is really, really good. That could help a bit with your damage in melee (hint: Bane is your go-to enchantment of choice in almost all cases - unless perhaps DR/alignment is involved or you're fighting a mix of enemies, then Holy (or equivalent) could be better).

+2 to hit and +2d6+2 damage on every attack is nothing to sneeze at.

You might also want to look at mythic versions of many of the traditional bard buff spells, so you can at least act as a force multiplier even though you lack individual optimization. For example, Mythic Heroism is pretty cool (+4 to almost everything!) and lasts a long time.

[FireberdGNOME]

You are a novice, no? Ask the GM for a Mulligan. You don't wanna change much, the *character* will be the same, just not hamstrung by a mediocre archetype :) Also, if it's something that helps the Party, most GMs/Groups will like that :)

[modicasolis]

Most of the Bard archetypes are not worth what you lose.

I'd say, go Core Bard, get rid of Toughness and Skill Focus, take Power Attack and Arcane Strike, and get a reach weapon (preferably a Fauchard with the Heirloom Weapon Trait). Take Furious Focus somewhere in there if you want to ensure you're always hitting.

Spell choices are good. Strength is a bit low. But change those things and you'll be far more worthwhile in combat and out of combat with Versatile Performance.

[Ayanzo]

I just got word, I can drop my archetype, but not retrain my feats or move my attributes around. I guess that helps somewhat.