How mighty the free will of the Crimean people !!!
They are pretty badass,yes.
Not as badass as abkhazians,though.Those have balls of adamantine.
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How mighty the free will of the Crimean people !!!They are pretty badass,yes.
Not as badass as abkhazians,though.
Those have balls of adamantine.
Then we should feel lucky that the Russian army intervened fast enough that those terrifying Crimeans did not have time to take up arms and go squash the pitiful neo-nazi US&EU-bought puppet government in Kiev.
Putin should get the Nobel Prize for Peace asap.
Well, they gave one to Obama who's administration drone strikes children, and, according to RT, is boycotting a UN conference on drones and human rights called by Pakistan, so I don't see why not.
Also, how is the gypsy deporting going in France, Citoyen Raven?
Formally, the Ukraine
Declared independence from USSR and claimed all assets on its territory.
Which is exactly the case with Crimea.Yes,Crimea,after declaring independence,joined with Russia,but that's secondary.
Nothing prevented Ukraine in 1989?from joining with Russia.
terrifying Crimeans did not have time to take up arms and go squash the pitiful neo-nazi US&EU-bought puppet government in Kiev.
I heard some interview with Crimean PM that said that Crimean SDF may do just that.
Of course,he said something about helping our ukrainian brothers.
Yeah, I can't find anything after September.
Oops. I missed that the "Socialists" allowed Dibrani to return.
Turns out Abby Martin ain't much of a rapper.
This just in:
THIS GUY was registered as ukraininan presidential candidate.
I kid you not.
Take that,green goblin and socialists!
I seem to recall watching Darth Vader running for something in that area of the world a couple of years ago. Probably also on RT.
Also, Live free or die!
Eh, bonus points for style, but it's an overall amateurish attempt.
At least he knows what "peace for the Empire"means)
Also,i have to add that registration as candidate requires something like...err...300k$?So he isn't some shmuck.
I wonder how long before cease and desist from Disney...
Oops. I missed that the "Socialists" allowed Dibrani to return.
I enjoy the line...
Hollande has promised that from now on local authorities will be prohibited from carrying out detentions of children during the school day.
It wasn't the detention of children he's opposed to. He just doesn't want other children to see it.
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This just in:
THIS GUY was registered as ukraininan presidential candidate.
I kid you not.
Take that,green goblin and socialists!
Hell I'd vote for him
Oh yeah, update on Crimea:
As it turned out 3/4 of Ukrainian military troops stationed in Crimea ended up joining the Russian military, in addition to both the legitimate commander of Ukrainian Navy AND even the coup regime's first replacement for him (!). That was with 2 other options, of resigning and living freely in Crimea, or moving to the Ukrainian mainland to serve the Ukraine military there. The commanders of the Ukrainian units in Crimea apparently defied orders by the coup Minister of Defense (Svoboda) to use weapons, the minister having to say: "Regrettably the commanders decided themselves on how to proceed". (Moon of Alabama translation of FAZ source in German)
Also, the Crimean Tatar's Mejlis/Parliament voted to embrace ethnic autonomy within the Russian Federation. This is in line with Russia's announced plans, which include special reserved representation for them within the Crimean government, Ukraine of course having never made any specific allowance for their ethnic rights, and in fact the coup regime is currently arresting people calling for "autonomy" in SE Ukraine.
Turning to Ukraine proper:
A pro-Russian rally was attacked by armed men while police stood by.
This story/video shows current coup goverment-backing MP and presidential candidate Oleh Lyashko assaulting and kidnapping a local government figure of Party of Regions, in line with mass attempts to remove anybody hostile to the coup regime from positions of power.
Here is a story on oligarch Boris Filatov, appointed by the coup regime to rule Dnipropetrovsk province, ranting how "This scum should be given promises, guarantees, and any concessions…And hung…They should be hung later", also stating (requires translation) that his problem with the coup regime passing a law removing official protection for Russian language was that the move was "premature". His perspective on Ukrainian fascism was interesting, having previously stated "I am proud of Bandera. He is my Hero. Particularly, as I see that people are ready to die under red-and-black flags", the last part indicating his true dedication (as opposed to siding with the forces exerting power).
Meanwhile, darling of NATO media Yulia Timoshenko caused some controversy with a leaked conversation revealing her calling for Russians (using derogatory ethnic term) to be shot and killed. German media especially didn't like that. To note, the conversation itself was in Russian language, which is pretty common for "Ukrainian nationalist" politicans to actually be more fluent in than Ukrainian, Timoshenko makes great effort to speak Ukrainian in public, but that is just for propaganda effect. Klitschko is also said to be more fluent in Russian than in Ukrainian, his German supposedly better than his Ukrainian.
Obviously wanting to smooth negotiations with their friends in Kiev to enable them to sign up to EU agreements, the EU has now dropped their standard requirement for protection of sexual minorities. Svoboda doesn't like gays.
British officials seem to be making themselves busy warning against "Russian oligarchisation", meanwhile their friends in Kiev seem to keep busy appointing oligarchs to ministries and governerships, with the leading "Maidan" presidential candidates all being oligarchs as well. The British officals also warned that Serbia and parts of Bosnia being excessively "pro-Russian" may prevent their EU membership... What a great message to send to people in SE Ukraine who want to have a good relationship with Russia. Of course, this is the EU that refused the Ukrainian government's request to have 3-way discussions with Ukraine and Russia to find an approach that allowed Ukraine to have productive ties with both sides.
Here is an in-depth story on how neo-con political groups conspired to organize the on-screen resignation of an RT anchor. What's most embarassing is that Abby Martin, of course originally hailed as a hero of morality, is now treated by them as an enemy.
Also, HERE and HERE are two English SUBTITLED videos showing a speech and other actions by Ukrainian nationalists... Straight from the horse's mouth, and all.
Beyond Ukraine, but as a topic previously mentioned here, here is what's going on in Georgia:
Despite US pressure to not do so, the current government is seeking to interview former President Saakashvili over various felony offences (such as unjust imprisonment), which Saakashvili is apparently refusing to cooperate with (even refusing to testify remotely via Skype). I would assume the next step is an Interpol warrant, the question being whether the US will serve it if Saakashvili returns to the US... Which probably comes down to whether he is more useful as an anti-Russian figurehead, or more of a liability as, well, Saakashvili. The US pressure on Georgian government can't make them any more amenable to US policy though, and Saakashvili's response may very well prompt them to take off the gloves and prosecute Saakashvili himself. I don't believe the US has explained why they oppose the prosecution of Saakashvili era crimes, yet do not speak out against official and un-official "lustration" (barring from official position) of non-Maidan-friendly government employees in coup regime Ukraine, most of which are not even accused of any specific crime... Not going to hold my breath for that explanation.
Meanwhile, darling of NATO media Yulia Timoshenko caused some controversy with a leaked conversation revealing her calling for Russians (using derogatory ethnic term) to be shot and killed.
With nuclear weapons,no less.
At least Darth has understandable reasons to hate separatists.He's in-character!
Quandary wrote:
Meanwhile, darling of NATO media Yulia Timoshenko caused some controversy with a leaked conversation revealing her calling for Russians (using derogatory ethnic term) to be shot and killed.
All Russians or just the ones that were, you know, invading? Because that's kinda what you normally do to people that are invading your country.
just the ones that were, you know, invading?
Where's the fun in that?
All Russians or just the ones that were, you know, invading? Because that's kinda what you normally do to people that are invading your country.Quandary wrote:
Meanwhile, darling of NATO media Yulia Timoshenko caused some controversy with a leaked conversation revealing her calling for Russians (using derogatory ethnic term) to be shot and killed.
When you use an ethnic slur, it's kind of loaded towards the ethnic group, isn't it? When you're also in government with neonazis that doesn't help.
I mean, if a Israel invaded Egypt and the Egypt prime minister said "we should nuclear bomb all jews in egypt", that kinda implied it wasn't just directed at israelis, right? Compared to saying "we should nuclear bomb all israelis in egypt"?
I mean, it's one thing to be anti russian military in what the Ukraine regime considers a part of Ukraine, and another to willy nilly disregard someone who's allied with nazis saying they should nuclear bomb all people an ethnic group.
When you use an ethnic slur, it's kind of loaded towards the ethnic group, isn't it?
From my understanding of that message,and i'm native russian-speaker,either all russians must be nuked,or all ukrainian russians.
I,honestly,don't know what's worse.And that woman runs for presidency?
Yeah, I was under the impression that she was threatening the Crimean Russians, but I mostly get my news from Kremlin-funded propaganda.
Did you hear about the Ukraine Colonel who didn't join them. He revealed quite a bit about the "incentives" the Russians gave to the Ukraine troops to turn.
Basically, torture them for five days...and then if they haven't turned after five days of torture, they are free to go.
Not hard to get a LOT of people to join you if the alternatives is to torture them.
Did you hear about the Ukraine Colonel who didn't join them. He revealed quite a bit about the "incentives" the Russians gave to the Ukraine troops to turn.
I smell Kiev-sponsored propaganda,honestly.
Okay,let's say you torture,for example,SAM operator for five days and he agrees to join.You really will give him the most dangerous(and pricy) SAM system in the world?
And if not,what's the point?
I'm pretty sure russians used mad dollarz.Simpler,and more effective.
Not direct bribery,mind you,but russian trooper at same paygrade can easily make 3-4-5x as ukrainian.
Money was one of the items listed I believe among other "incentives" that start off pretty nice, and then devolve into basically what people would call torture when they didn't turn.
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So you believe that 4300 Ukrainian troops were kidnapped for 5 days and tortured (but didn't submit, so the Russians gave up and released them),
and the some of the 3/4's remaining troops were held for some amount of time and tortured as well?
The Kiev coup regime itself claims only 4-6 commanders were held for a few days after the final base was taken over, NOT the mass of troops.
Actual press reports based on Kiev's own statements...
I can't find anything linking Colonel Mamchuk, commander of the last Ukrainian Marine base, with "torture".
But OK. Knock yourself out. Was Admiral Berezovsky also tortured in order to make him defect?
Was anti-mafia/anti-corruption prosecutor Natalya Poklonskaya also tortured to make her defect?
Why do Russian torturers give up so easily/quickly (5 days) compared to the US and it's allies?
Did you mention Russian troops ripping Ukrainian babies out of incubators? (Gulf War 1 propaganda lie) How many babies refused to defect?
BTW, notice the coincidental reappearance of the 3/4 figure (troops 'defecting' to Russia), which is also the constitutional requirement to impeach a president?
Which of course was unattained by coup parliament, which only mustered 328 votes rather than the required 338 - per pro-Maidan Kiev Post,
in addition to not following procedure in other aspects, e.g. consulting the Constitutional Court.
Does a bunny die every time the actual legal requirements for impeachment is mentioned? "3/4". Whoops.
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BTW, what is with the imperial tendency to put into quotes ("incentives") anything that seems not sufficiently denunciatory towards designated enemies, despite the word being utterly standard usage for the actual reality being referenced? I believe "scare quotes" is the term for this. It's not like doing so convinces anybody of anything. It's more like a sign to signify conformity and obedience to other imperial loyalists, a sign that nothing is being allowed to escape the dictated narrative. In this case, this is nothing unusual, the US hires foreign soldiers with the offer of higher pay (and citizenship, which anybody in Crime can get without joining Russian military), France has it's Foreign Legion, etc. What is so strange about cold, hard cash?
EDIT: I think somebody did comment on the professionalism of Russian troops in pulling off the Crimean operation without killing anybody. Certainly a sign that the professionalization of Russian military has had good results.
Did you hear about the Ukraine Colonel who didn't join them. He revealed quite a bit about the "incentives" the Russians gave to the Ukraine troops to turn.I smell Kiev-sponsored propaganda,honestly.
Okay,let's say you torture,for example,SAM operator for five days and he agrees to join.
You really will give him the most dangerous(and pricy) SAM system in the world?
And if not,what's the point?
I'm pretty sure russians used mad dollarz.Simpler,and more effective.
Not direct bribery,mind you,but russian trooper at same paygrade can easily make 3-4-5x as ukrainian.
He's discussing his immature, irrational fantasy. Please don't distract from the topic with your irritating details.
He's discussing his immature, irrational fantasy. Please don't distract from the topic with your irritating details.Did you hear about the Ukraine Colonel who didn't join them. He revealed quite a bit about the "incentives" the Russians gave to the Ukraine troops to turn.I smell Kiev-sponsored propaganda,honestly.
Okay,let's say you torture,for example,SAM operator for five days and he agrees to join.
You really will give him the most dangerous(and pricy) SAM system in the world?
And if not,what's the point?
I'm pretty sure russians used mad dollarz.Simpler,and more effective.
Not direct bribery,mind you,but russian trooper at same paygrade can easily make 3-4-5x as ukrainian.
So I take it that the Russian media hid the fact about those who escaped what the Russians were doing to the Ukraine troops.
We don't know what happened to the majority that turned. It could have been the money, it may have been something else.
Those guys that switched sides to the Russians, they didn't speak about it.
HOWEVER...those who stood their ground, then got taken over...we have several accounts of what happened there.
Yes, it does seem like torture was involved after they turned down the initial advances.
The most famous of them was the Colonel who refused to simply turn over his command, then got his command invaded and then refused the advances and hence was basically tortured to try to convince him.
If you haven't heard of the Colonel, I would imagine your Russian press has done a good job at hiding most of the other things in Ukraine that occurred which they do not want people hearing about.
After five days he was finally released (at the time he had no idea if it would go on indefinitely, but eventually he was released) and apparently after he's freed, his family is not being harassed either. He's gone to find housing while they wait as all Ukraine troops were ordered out, but it appears they will be allowed to let their families stay until they can get appropriate measures to afford the comfort of those families.
Not just Russian media I cant find any mention of it in the reular media as well (Which I find odd since considering the current retoric I would think something like this would be in all the headlines.)
link to world post, part of huffington post
Note 1. The article does not say torture but says 5 days of sustained questioning.
Note 2. Not network news but there appears to be a lot of articles regarding it. This is probably a piece where the networks have trouble verifying and are not going to run with it as there is no pressure to when they have the Obamacare deadline and flight 370 to cover. Just a thought.
If you haven't heard of the Colonel, I would imagine your Russian press has done a good job at hiding most of the other things in Ukraine that occurred which they do not want people hearing about.
I do not read russian press.Really.I also don't own TV.the only kinda-russian mass media i sometimes watch is RT.Because they good at trolling.
And of course i heard about that base and that colonel.Of course,i heard completely different story.For the starters,there was two days of questioning,not five of torture.
If you haven't heard of the Colonel, I would imagine your Russian press has done a good job at hiding most of the other things in Ukraine that occurred which they do not want people hearing about.I do not read russian press.Really.I also don't own TV.the only kinda-russian mass media i sometimes watch is RT.Because they good at trolling.
And of course i heard about that base and that colonel.Of course,i heard completely different story.For the starters,there was two days of questioning,not five of torture.
Unless you are the American CIA (which seem to ignore the lists and make their own definitions) things like sleep deprivation is counted among the international torture lists.
Sleep deprivation
The victim is prevented from sleeping for several days. Measures used to achieve this include tying the victim up in a painful position, constant lighting, noise, and especially beatings, kicks and other types of punishment if the victim attempts to lie down.
Sleep deprivation is regarded as torture under international law and is branded as such by the United Nations. Sleep deprivation may sound quite harmless in comparison to other methods of torture; however, ongoing sleep deprivation is an extraordinarily cruel form of torture which leads to a breakdown of the nervous system and to other serious physical and psychological damage.
http://www.ishr.org/Methods-of-torture-in-the-People-s-Republic-of-China.10 47.0.html
Sleep deprivation for two days sounds really,really horrible.
Can human survive that without permanent emotional scarring?
Sleep deprivation for two days sounds really,really horrible.
Can human survive that without permanent emotional scarring?
When i had a toothache i did 5 days or so on roughly 15 minutes of sleep (and that took doing something pharmacists warn you against). I was a little messed up for a few days but i'm fine now *twitch twitch twitch*
Let's be clear about something: Russia isn't nice. The russian military isn't nice. I don't doubt for a second that they'd torture practically anyone if they thought they could get away with and profit from it.
However, torturing commanders to switch sides seems really, really stupid. First you're antagonizing them towards you on an extreme level. Then you're actively working to destroy their psyche, likely to result in severe PTSD, at least if the torture is brutal enough to convert someone in five days. And then you're handing them control over extremely expensive and dangerous equipment, allow them to order people around, and expect them to do better as friendly commanders than your actual friendly commanders? That is beyond stupid.
Russia is a really bad place and the russian military is a really bad institution, but they are not stupid. In fact they seem quite smart, and professional, seeing as how they've pulled of this operation with minor casualties and without the support from unmanned drones that the US uses in their invasions.
So why on earth would they torture a commander for five days to get them to switch sides? What would be the point? Sure, could be great PR, but the other commanders that switched sides seems to be in action, so it's unlikely they were convinced through torture.
Torture may get you answers or obedience, but it does not in any way shape or form give something akin to loyalty.
I don't think that's necessarily true. Looking at to how large a degree Crimea was pro-russian before, it's not unlikely some of the military commanders there were also pro-russian; they may even have had contact with the russians before the russians moved into the area.
It may very well be possible that they switched sides basically as soon as they got the chance, taking the chance to go join russia instead of the neonazi-ruled Ukraine. Now, I might have missed a lot of info, but I don't think just by default that any commander who belonged to the crimean armed forces would be unreliable.
Having military that is led by locals DO have its benefits - it's much more likely to gain support from the local populace, know the area well etc.
I don't think that's necessarily true. Looking at to how large a degree Crimea was pro-russian before, it's not unlikely some of the military commanders there were also pro-russian; they may even have had contact with the russians before the russians moved into the area.
It may very well be possible that they switched sides basically as soon as they got the chance, taking the chance to go join russia instead of the neonazi-ruled Ukraine. Now, I might have missed a lot of info, but I don't think just by default that any commander who belonged to the crimean armed forces would be unreliable.
Having military that is led by locals DO have its benefits - it's much more likely to gain support from the local populace, know the area well etc.
The Ukraine military is much like other militarys, the military personnel in one area are not necessarily from that area.
That such a large number of Ukraine citizens who are not neccesarily from the Ukraine are actually defecting?
I think the bigger question to ask...putting it in a US perspective is if Texas decides to join Mexico. Then all the personnel, a majority who are from every place in the US BUT Texas, decide to join in with the cause of Texas and join Mexico too.
Why would they do that?
It would look great for Mexico to be able to say...hey, this is so great that all the US military in Texas is joining us...but it would seem a little odd. There would be other factors. Perhaps it would be something as little as money. We don't know, they haven't said (perhaps part of the contract is they aren't allowed to talk about why they turned sides).
We just have the words of those that did not turn and their experiences.
Commander didn't say he was only sleep deprived for two days, it was implied it was for the duration...which would be at least four nights...maybe five. That's in addition to other tactics (in regards to the questioning and how he was questioned/interrogated) that were used.
At the time he had no idea what they were going to do with him, luckily they probably thought it was a bad idea to start killing off the prisoners or keeping them for an extended period (afterall, MANY of those in the Ukraine military were actually friends with those in the Russian military before it all began. They even worked side by side!).
I don't think that's necessarily true. Looking at to how large a degree Crimea was pro-russian before, it's not unlikely some of the military commanders there were also pro-russian; they may even have had contact with the russians before the russians moved into the area.
It may very well be possible that they switched sides basically as soon as they got the chance, taking the chance to go join russia instead of the neonazi-ruled Ukraine. Now, I might have missed a lot of info, but I don't think just by default that any commander who belonged to the crimean armed forces would be unreliable.
Having military that is led by locals DO have its benefits - it's much more likely to gain support from the local populace, know the area well etc.
It's not a maybe, they DID have contact with the Russians before. They worked side by side.
That doesn't mean they all wanted to live in Russia or Crimea for the rest of their lives...
Some married those from Crimea, others had family, but many were from other parts of the Ukraine. It makes no sense for them to suddenly switch sides for no reason.
Scary thoughts.
Indications are being spread that Russia may be planning to do a full scale invasion within a week's time, give or take a few days.
If that happens, besides the fact that all fears about Russia's expansionism will be confirmed, is how the West will respond.
If it doesn't, I'm not sure if ANY nation on that edge of the border will ever be able to rest easily.
But if the West does respond (focusing on NATO) it could easily lead to a VERY bad war.
I just hope if it happens, it will be peaceful, but I heavily doubt that Western Ukraine will be as peaceful as Crimea or elsewhere.
Hopefully something happens to lessen the passions going on right now and dissolve the angst of the situation.
Indications are being spread that Russia may be planning to do a full scale invasion within a week's time, give or take a few days.
Those are being spread for,like,a month.
What's the point of the full-scale invasion,again?
Indications are being spread that Russia may be planning to do a full scale invasion within a week's time, give or take a few days.
Those are being spread for,like,a month.
What's the point of the full-scale invasion,again?
If you have the ukraine and crimea than "only" keeping crimea becomes the compromise position.
If you have the ukraine and crimea than "only" keeping crimea becomes the compromise position.
Indications are being spread that Russia may be planning to do a full scale invasion within a week's time, give or take a few days.
Those are being spread for,like,a month.
What's the point of the full-scale invasion,again?
But you don't HAVE ukraine.You only shown what everybody know:Russia can succesfully invade it.Invasion is easy.
Whole point of Crimea was about willingness to join.You do not have that in southeast.Yet.
If you have the ukraine and crimea than "only" keeping crimea becomes the compromise position.
Indications are being spread that Russia may be planning to do a full scale invasion within a week's time, give or take a few days.
Those are being spread for,like,a month.
What's the point of the full-scale invasion,again?But you don't HAVE ukraine.You only shown what everybody know:Russia can succesfully invade it.Invasion is easy.
Whole point of Crimea was about willingness to join.You do not have that in southeast.Yet.
Lets see what the russian run ballot box shows after the russian invasion. I'm betting it will be good news for russia!