Player Character, Lich Balanced


Advice


My group started a new adventure (lvl 1) and my character really didn`t fit the flavor of the adventure so I am making a new one by DM`s approval. Now my group doesn`t have an arcane caster so I am thinking of making a wizard not sure the exact details yet, but im hoping to incorporate illusions and necromancy spells. What im hoping to accomplish at later levels is to become a lich, following of course all the normal procedures for doing so that the lich section in the bestiary discusses. Now this will not happen until at least level 11 and 100000s of gold pieces. My question is, will this template unbalance the game. I have not yet talked to my GM about this as he is rather new at GMing so I don't want to trouble him with something that I believe can be better solved on these forums. The reasoning that I think it probably will not be unbalanced is that I will not have magic equipment as I would be investing everything in achieving lichdom. The problem I think that might arise will be, being underpowered before being a lich because of lack of magic items, and being overpowered once a actually lich. Anyways any insight would be appreciated.


My advice is to not ask for a special snowflake from someone who is new to GMing. I would allow it if it were my game, but the I've at this for 27 years. Your GM most likely does not have the experience to handle balancing between PCs and adjusting encounters. Further, would your GM appreciate evil characters?


darkwarriorkarg wrote:
My advice is to not ask for a special snowflake from someone who is new to GMing. I would allow it if it were my game, but the I've at this for 27 years. Your GM most likely does not have the experience to handle balancing between PCs and adjusting encounters. Further, would your GM appreciate evil characters?

Thx for the quick reply, and my GM doesn`t care about evil characters. Also since there would be at least 10 more levels until it is even an option he might be able gain enough experience to work with it. I agree though with the balancing thing, I am not sure he will be able to balance it properly so I think I might make the character and keep him as normal and save the whole lich thing in my back pocket until I can judge if the GM could handle it.


Do you want to use the rules for Monster characters and have him count as a higher level character from that point on?

So what does the Lich gain:

CHA to Hit Points and Fort saves - Could get quite out of hand on a sorcerer. You cannot really dump Con though, since you have to survive till the early teens. Therefore I'd say this is really good but not broken.

Negative Energy to Touch- d8+1/2 level, hardly significant, though nice to have.

Paralyzing Touch - Permanent Paralysis with a scaling save is really strong. A bit too strong compared to your 5th and 6th level spells. Flesh to Stone has more Range and also takes out a target permanently, but it's only useable a few times per day. Might get a bit out of hand.

I would either shorten the duration to just a few rounds. Or just leave
the Touch attack out completely.

Int +2 Wis+2 Cha+2 - Nice, but the level adjustment would more than balance those out.

Fear Aura - Everyone looking at you gets feared on a failed save. This makes interacting with NPCs in normal towns nearly impossible. You need a way to suppress(maybe some transformation spells) this or a custom made Campaign/Setting to make a character with this ability playable IMO.

DR, energy immunities, Undead immunities - Pretty good to have. A lot of effects save or suck will have no effects against you at all. If fighting things like fellow Undead your immunity to all kinds of drain might will trivialize those encounters.

Rejuvenation - Your group should already have access to Resurrection spells, therefore this isn't that impressive. It also takes really long for you to respawn, which could have you miss entire adventures.

With a Level adjustment of +2, especially since this delays your spell-progression, I think this isn't overpowered.
What bothersome is the Fear Aura, since it hinders normal interactions with NPCs. The Paralyzing Touch is potentially abuseable due to being at will and permanent.

Dark Archive

There has been a few ways of bringing liches into a campaign, one of those ways is the Agent of the Grave PRC. Also in The Way of the Wicked Campaign they talk about having liches and vampires in the game. It is books 4 and 5 with book 5 having more about it. But my suggestion is the Agent of the Grave PRC as it gives a lot of the abilities in exchange for class levels and then at the end of it gives a possibility of becoming a lich, pretty much losing money and certain class features in exchange for the template.


Could always make a custom template that's more built for PCs or slowly gain it through homemade feats/arcane discoveries/archetype trade outs.

Silver Crusade

My ex-wife played a character from 1st level to high level, intending from the start to become a lich. I did the same. Considering the risks and difficulties, by the time your campaign has reached high level it will fit in quite naturally.

You need not ask anything of your GM right now. Just let it slip that this might be your PC's long term objective, and see how it rolls.

I don't suggest telling the other PCs about this goal of Lichdom. You probably want to use life-extension magic to stay alive until old-ish. If you start at first level then Lichdom is generally such a long term goal that it presents no problem to the GM.


Applying any template to a character is going to unbalance the campaign unless everyone gets the same template. Templates are by their nature unbalanced for player characters. They are designed for the GM to create interesting monsters. I would recommend retiring the character when he becomes a lich.

Having a goal like becoming a lich, or a god is a cool concept, but it does not really work as a playable character. The only way something like this is going to be balanced is if everyone in the campaign has the same or at least similar templates.


Mysterious Stranger wrote:
Applying any template to a character is going to unbalance the campaign unless everyone gets the same template. Templates are by their nature unbalanced for player characters.

It really depends on the template. Some templates are crazy powerful, some are just meh. LA on a caster just sucks, and a lot of abilities that factor into LA such as spell like abilities get weaker over time and make you really want to shout "Buy out please!". An LA that gives +2 intellect/charisma to a fighter isn't doing quiet as giving it to an arcane caster.


I3igAl wrote:

Do you want to use the rules for Monster characters and have him count as a higher level character from that point on?

I believe that would be the most fair thing to do so that the other characters are not underpowered.

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