Weapon Enhancements how do they work?

[Momo Kimura]

I'm not to familiar with it as I never really needed more than to the equivalent of a +1 Flaming Longsword.

Like could I have the equivalent of +10 worth in magic enhancements on say a dagger that is a +2 Adamantine Thawing (+1), Quenching (+1), Neutralizing (+1), Grounding (+1), Impervious (+1), Anchoring (+2), Ghost Touch (+1), or is that incorrect in terms of the weapon enhancement formula that is used?

[KainPen]

I can't confirm if all the numbers are correct but yes you can a +1 weapon with +9 of bonus types, +2 weapon with up to +8 extra bonus, or a +5 weapon with +5 extra bonus. that is the way it works. but note a lot of +1 and +2 ablitys require standard action to activate so they could take a while to fully activate.

+5 weapon with +5 bonus is the best way to go for a +10 weapon. less time to activate and it goes through all DR expect epic and number/-

Also note the caster level of a +5 weapon with +5 bonus more then likely going to be higher then the weapon in your example, thus giving it a Higher save and HP and hardness.

Example +5 admantium dagger would have a save of +9, hardness of 30 and hp of 53

while the on in you example would have save of +7 dues to anchoring having a level 10 caster level higher caster level then the + on the weapon. hardness of 24 and hp of 23.

[DM_Blake]

Lol, Kain, I'm pretty good with creating items and even I was confused by half of what you said... Momo seems to be at a fairly entry-level spot with this question, so let's leave it at the simple answer (which you gave) that Yes, you can have up to +10 worth of Enhancement Bonus PLUS magical properties, with the only restriction being that you must have at least +1 (required before you can add any of the other stuff) and cannot have more than +5 Enhancement bonus.

[KainPen]

oh I was including the weapon saves, in case item in unattended or if you fail the reflex save with a 1. Pointing out Sundering hardness and Hp increased per enchantment + increase of item. Since it does not increase for for stuff like flaming and what not. I was also pointing out that the save for such item is based on the strongest caster level out of all the bonus. =) such as vorpal is 18th caster level requirement highest you can get on a weapon. Formal for the save is 1/2 the caster level +2 so that would +11 for a vorpal weapon. The weapon as a whole would have a much higher save then to prevent being destroyed.

Had it come up in a game recently two guys fail there saves on a friendly fireball with rolls of a 1 and archer lost his +5 shocking bow, and barb/fighter lost his +5 mithral full plate. Friendly fire isn't lol

[DM_Blake]

KainPen wrote:

Had it come up in a game recently two guys fail there saves on a friendly fireball with rolls of a 1 and archer lost his +5 shocking bow, and barb/fighter lost his +5 mithral full plate. Friendly fire isn't lol

Since we're derailing...

"Energy attacks deal half damage to most objects. Divide the damage by 2 before applying the object's hardness."

Neither wood nor metal is especially vulnerable to fire, so no bonus damage.

Mithral full plate had to have a hardness of 15 and 40 HP as a base, with the +5 raising those numbers to 25 and 90!. What kind of fireballs are you dealing with? A maximized empowered Delayed Blast Fireball would top out at 135 damage. Divide by 2 = 68 damage. Subtract 25 leaves you with 43 damage, not even enough to get a broken condition, let alone destroy it.

Now, the bow would only have hardness 15 and 55 HP, which means that same maximized empowered Delayed Blast Fireball would do 53 damage to it, definitely broken (-2 to hit and damage), not quite destroyed, but very close.

In any case, Make Whole is a simple 2nd level spell that could restore those items, so I hope you meant they were only temporarily "lost".

[KainPen]

yes in normal rules that is correct about half damage but the rules also state this is subject to change by dm and as deem certain materials to ignore hardness and and be vulnerable to certain energy types. Metal and wood where both deem vulnerable to fire and it was a maximized empowered fire ball. We had per-made a chart for materials vs energy types for this reason. The guys told the sorcerer to lob the fire ball on them it as one of them had evasion and the other had the hit points to take the damage. they both rolled a one and then both end up rolling their most power full magic items that fell under vulnerability. then they failed the save for the items as well. very unlucky day for those two. they could not make whole on the items either because you have to be 2 times the caster level of the item the cleric was not level 30 for either case. AS the caster level for + weapons and are 3 times the + meaning +5 armor and weapons have caster level of 15. = no fix

[jadelyon]

KainPen wrote:

yes in normal rules that is correct about half damage but the rules also state this is subject to change by dm and as deem certain materials to ignore hardness and and be vulnerable to certain energy types. Metal and wood where both deem vulnerable to fire and it was a maximized empowered fire ball. We had per-made a chart for materials vs energy types for this reason. The guys told the sorcerer to lob the fire ball on them it as one of them had evasion and the other had the hit points to take the damage. they both rolled a one and then both end up rolling their most power full magic items that fell under vulnerability. then they failed the save for the items as well. very unlucky day for those two. they could not make whole on the items either because you have to be 2 times the caster level of the item the cleric was not level 30 for either case. AS the caster level for + weapons and are 3 times the + meaning +5 armor and weapons have caster level of 15. = no fix

I don't want to live in a world where +5 weapons and armor can be obliterated by a fireball. =)

[KainPen]

jadelyon wrote:

KainPen wrote:

yes in normal rules that is correct about half damage but the rules also state this is subject to change by dm and as deem certain materials to ignore hardness and and be vulnerable to certain energy types. Metal and wood where both deem vulnerable to fire and it was a maximized empowered fire ball. We had per-made a chart for materials vs energy types for this reason. The guys told the sorcerer to lob the fire ball on them it as one of them had evasion and the other had the hit points to take the damage. they both rolled a one and then both end up rolling their most power full magic items that fell under vulnerability. then they failed the save for the items as well. very unlucky day for those two. they could not make whole on the items either because you have to be 2 times the caster level of the item the cleric was not level 30 for either case. AS the caster level for + weapons and are 3 times the + meaning +5 armor and weapons have caster level of 15. = no fix

I don't want to live in a world where +5 weapons and armor can be obliterated by a fireball. =)

lol you don't have to you can always play at another Gms table. =) This was actual very common to have magic item distroyed by fireball in earlyer editions. You just found more and replaced them as they Destroyed. Since there was no buying to selling of magic items really you end up throwing half the ones your found away. The fact that you can by them now make it even easier.

[Momo Kimura]

I can only picture an adventurer saying something like:
"God! All I can find is a bunch of these worthless +1 Flaming Swords."

[KainPen]

lol it ends up being that way anyway even if you can sell them. I ran 2nd darkness and after the 30th or 40th +1 rapier the the the pcs where like when are we going to find something we could actual use that we don't have to sell. I find players prefer to find stuff they can use becasue they don't have to buy it. I could have just turned all those rapiers in to flat gold and it would have had the same effect.

It happend often in old adventures, you had +3 weapon and 2 +1 weapon as back up. and would leave the rest. it was not worth the encumbrance. Flame Tounge sword where a lot strong in old edtions also. a Flame sword was more then just +1 it like a multiable bane weapon with fire. the + increased based on what you where fighting so you would hang on to one of those if you found it and leave that +1 one shortsword right next to it behind.