So, I've got some pretty nice options for this game and desperately need some advice. We rolled for stats, and so I have 13, 14, 15, 18, 13, 18 to put however I like in stats. All races from core and ARG are allowed.
Also, note you all get to play with max gold on this character, as well as 3 traits in total, one of which must be one for Anniversary Edition Rise of the Runelords.
So...that being said...thoughts?
Str 18
Dex 18
Con 15
Int 13
Wis 15
Cha 13
Human Ranger
Feats: Power Attack, Quick Draw
Traits: Indomitable Faith, Reactionary, campaign trait
Use a greatsword/falchion and a longbow at level 1. Upgrade to a +4 rating composite longbow ASAP.
Feat progression
2: Rapid Shot (bonus)
3: Cleave or Furious Focus
5: Deadly Aim
6: Manyshot
7: Vital Strike
9: Combat Reflexes
10: Improved Precise Shot
Pretty simple build, very versatile.
What would you suggest to use the max starting gold on, besides the greatsword/falchion & longbow?
A masterwork weapon costs 300 + base unless I'm missing a variant being used here, so that greatsword would be 350 gp.
ShadowyFox, have you looked at TreantMonk's Guide to the Ranger? It gives a pretty thorough treatment and I thought the explanations for why were good. That allows you to tweak for yourself while knowing what you are giving up in exchange.
Cheers!
Part of me really thinks that a dwarf could be a good deal of fun in this game, all considered. Not as many feats, obviously, but quite useful still.
You certainly have the stats for it. Your dex (or str) suffers a bit, but not so much that you'd really be in a bad place.
Then again... that speed penalty is a b!tch. :D
I was working up an axe-based dwarven switch hitter based on the guide I mentioned earlier. It's not going to be particularly optimal, but that does not mean it won't be fun. And when he connects on a critical, somebody's gonna know it!
True, but even with the suffering a little, I think it would make an interesting story.
AinvarG: I'd definitely be up for seeing that workup. I've got a fun idea in mind that will fit with the campaign.
Somehow, I knew you were going to ask. I set it aside a while back and don't think I every finished it. Hmmm... I'll see if I can locate it again.
Bear in mind, if I do find it, there was not a whole lot of polish, it was mostly taking the suggestions and swapping abilities because of the change of weapons.
That's fine. :) As long as I've got a good idea on how to put it together, I can definitely do it. Definitely more weapon options that way.
I'm thinking that he could have been going to a special training school (that his family had been going to for generations) to learn about the family business of undead killing (sort of the College of Van Hellsing, in my mind), his village was attacked by giants and decimated. That has changed his whole mindset and made him realize that there's quite a number of dangers now in the world. I'm thinking he came home for a visit and caught the last few minutes of his father's life.
His father told him what he heard of the next target and sent him off to protect. :) I always love characters with personal vendettas.
Here's the guide I'm basing my suggestion off of
Off to do some digging...
Hey, suggest whatever you'd like. :) I was originally thinking of starting with favored enemy (undead) and then moving to favored enemy (giants) as my second choice (and the one I increase), but I have no idea how to rationalize it.
OK, the notes I had have turned to vapor, but here's the gist.
Build an archery ranger to get the ranger's archery feats, but put almost all of your other investments into the melee side, specifically into a two-handed weapon. He suggests falchion with an emphasis on critical feats when they are available.
For dwarven flavor and options, I'm thinking dwarven waraxe for the primary melee weapon. Still go with the bow - the dwarven-typical crossbow is going to be slow and you probably won't want to spend a feat on Rapid Reload to correct it - and you can't get bonus damage from a crossbow like you can from a composite longbow.
STR 18
DEX 18
CON 14+2
INT 13
WIS 15+2
CHA 13-2
1st: Power Attack
2nd: Rapid Shot (Combat Style)
3rd: Quick Draw
5th: Deadly Aim
6th: Manyshot (Combat Style)
These are pretty much taken directly from Treantmonk's suggestions. I'm thinking I would start with dwarven waraxe + shield for the AC, but when that quick draw is being used because the bad guy has so accommodatingly stepped into range, you won't want to waste time with the shield - drop the bow, whip out the axe, and power attack him with your iterative attacks!
So if I have the math right off the top of my head, at sixth level, you are sending up to four arrows at downrange for 1d8+8 each and when the bad guy decides to get in your face about it, it's a free action to switch to power attack him for 1d10+12. The scary thing is this is not the optimized race and weapon choice because I think those are still pretty reasonable.
I hope that helps!
Yeah, I was not even looking at the animal companion. I do think the guide I'm working from was all based on core rules, so there may be some new toys - like boon companion - that should be considered.
The dwarf Switch hitter is fun, I've done him before.
Str:18
Dex:18
Con:17
Int:13
Wis:15
Car:12
After racial bonuses
Feats
1. power attack
2. rapid shot
3. power attack
5: quick draw
6: many shot
7: point blank shot
8: I took a level in fighter at 8 for a armor proficiency because I scored some mithril full plate. Precise shot.
I used the dwarven war ax, and had a quickdraw light shield for when I needed more AC, when I didn't I 2 handed the war ax.
I took the cheetah as my animal companion, because the trip was great.
Why do you list power attack twice? Why do you need point blank shot and precise shot?
And what would people suggest with favored enemy progression. I was thinking starting with undead and then progressing into giant, but I don't know how or when.
Well that's what the spoiler tags are for ;)
Giant is a good choice, you could justify it as learning to hunt them down for destroying your village.
Is the undead too big of a stretch as first choice? I'm thinking that his family was a renowned bunch of undead hunters (as dwarves are quite resistant to many nasty things undead can do), but now that his family and his village are gone...well, things may change.
Fe 1 - Human. Useful in 4/6 AP modules.
FE 2- Giant. Advance it immediately to +4...also used for the rest of the AP.
FE 3 - Undead is a good choice. Advance Giants.
Fe 4 at 15th - Probably evil outsider. Advance Giants.
Fe 5 at 20th - Your choice of Dragon or Aberration. Advance Giants, just so your Instant Enemy is +10 when desired.
If you're a Dwarf, switch one of the Traits for Glory of the Old. The bonus to all saves is substantial.
Note that if you get a Dwarven Thrower hammer you can be a switch hitter without switching weapons!
==Aelryinth
Super quick mock up for a first level Dwarf Ranger. Use as you will.
Ragnok
Dwarf Ranger 1
CG Medium Humanoid (dwarf)
Init +6; Senses darkvision 60 ft.; Perception +7
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Defense
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AC 19, touch 14, flat-footed 15 (+4 armor, +1 shield, +4 Dex)
hp 13 (1d10+3)
Fort +4, Ref +6, Will +3; +2 vs. poison, spells, and spell-like abilities
Defensive Abilities defensive training
--------------------
Offense
--------------------
Speed 20 ft.
Melee Light Shield Bash +5 (1d3+4/x2) and
. . Dagger +5 (1d4+4/19-20/x2) and
. . Dwarven waraxe +5 (1d10+4/x3) and
. . Unarmed strike +5 (1d3+4/x2)
Ranged Shortbow, Comp. (Str +0) +5 (1d6/x3)
Special Attacks favored enemy (undead +2), hatred
Ranger Spells Prepared (CL 0):
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Statistics
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Str 18, Dex 18, Con 15, Int 13, Wis 16, Cha 13
Base Atk +1; CMB +5; CMD 19 (19 vs. Bull Rush, 19 vs. Trip)
Feats Power Attack -1/+2
Traits Adopted, Giant Slayer, Reactionary, World Traveler (Knowledge [local])
Skills Acrobatics +0 (-4 jump), Appraise +1 (+3 to determine the price of nonmagic items with precious metals or gemstones), Bluff +1 (+3 vs. undead), Climb +4, Escape Artist +0, Fly +0, Knowledge (geography) +5 (+7 vs. undead), Knowledge (local) +6 (+8 vs. undead), Knowledge (nature) +5 (+7 vs. undead), Perception +7 (+9 vs. undead, +9 to notice unusual stonework, such as traps and hidden doors in stone walls or floors), Ride +0, Sense Motive +3 (+5 vs. undead), Stealth +0, Survival +7 (+9 vs. undead, +8 to track), Swim +4
Languages Common, Dwarven, Giant
SQ greed, hardy, slow and steady, stability, stonecunning +2, track, wild empathy
Other Gear Chain shirt, Light steel quickdraw shield, Dagger, Dwarven waraxe, Shortbow, Comp. (Str +0), Ranger's kit, 27 GP
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TRACKED RESOURCES
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Dagger - 0/1
--------------------
Special Abilities
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Darkvision (60 feet) You can see in the dark (black and white vision only).
Defensive Training +4 Gain a dodge bonus to AC vs monsters of the Giant subtype.
Favored Enemy (Undead +2) (Ex) +2 to rolls vs Favored Enemy (Undead).
Giant Slayer +1 Bluff, Perception, Sense Motive, attack and damage against giants.
Greed +2 to Appraise checks to determine the price of nonmagical goods that contain precious metals or gemstones.
Hardy +2 Gain a racial bonus to saves vs Poison, Spells and Spell-Like effects.
Hatred +1 Gain a racial bonus to attacks vs Goblinoids/Orcs.
Power Attack -1/+2 You can subtract from your attack roll to add to your damage.
Slow and Steady Your base speed is never modified by encumbrance.
Stability +4 Gain bonus to CMD vs bull rush/trip while standing on ground.
Stonecunning +2 +2 bonus to Perception vs unusual stonework. Free check within 10 feet.
Track +1 Add the listed bonus to survival checks made to track.
Wild Empathy +2 (Ex) Improve the attitude of an animal, as if using Diplomacy.
Gear and upgrades over time will be up to you.
Giants would be my second favored enemy and probably get most of the boosts. I just started playing this Adventure but Dwarf for race and Giants as enemies have been mentioned alot.
Switch hitter or Sword and Shield fighter are good choices.
Feats
1.PA
2.Rapid Shot(Ranger)
3.Steel Soul or Deadly Aim or Furious Focus
5.Boon Companion
6.Many Shot(Ranger)
Another fun and flavorful idea would be a Thunder and Fang Shoanti Ranger (or Barbarian). I would go with a human since it requires a bunch of feats to get up and running.
Fe 1 - Human. Useful in 4/6 AP modules.
FE 2- Giant. Advance it immediately to +4...also used for the rest of the AP.
FE 3 - Undead is a good choice. Advance Giants.
Fe 4 at 15th - Probably evil outsider. Advance Giants.
Fe 5 at 20th - Your choice of Dragon or Aberration. Advance Giants, just so your Instant Enemy is +10 when desired.If you're a Dwarf, switch one of the Traits for Glory of the Old. The bonus to all saves is substantial.
Note that if you get a Dwarven Thrower hammer you can be a switch hitter without switching weapons!
==Aelryinth
Good call on Glory of the old and the Dwarven Thrower. Get the Hammer enchanted as returning.
@ Aelryinth: Why Human first instead of undead? I like that weapon a lot. Definitely going to be the plan, for me.
@ ezrider23: As far as that composite shortbow, what does that +0 mean?
The number of undead you fight in the first AP is insignificant. You do end up fighting some humans.
In the second module you also end up fighting humans...and some undead.
In the third module, you fight some humans. And then a metric arseload of Giants. A +1 Giant-Slayer by the 3rd AP is your DREAM WEAPON!!!
In the 4th one...you fight some humans. And some undead.
In the 5th one, it's all giants.
In the 6th one, you fight some Azlanti humans, lots of giants, some undead, dragon, evil outsiders, aberrations, monstrous humanoids, magical beasts, la la la...
I'm simply making the judgment call that you'll be fighting more humans then undead in the early books. At level 10, take Undead and you're fine...but by then you can Instant Enemy a tough foe and it won't really matter.
If you go the other way it won't hurt you. Just a word...the Skinsaw mod, you're only fighting 1-2 undead, but all the skinsaw cultists are human.
In the fourth, one of the lords of the sanctum is undead, and has a couple undead servants. Several of the other lords and their servants are human.
Etc etc.
A Giant-Slaying Dwarven Thrower of Returning (Ghost Touch!) would be awesome in this adventure!
==Aelryinth
Sounds dang good to me. I'm definitely taking the advice to heart.
That's a shame. You were doing pretty good designing your character without a playlist for the whole AP...
Yah, a spoiler warning would have been nice.. not everyone has played the AP.
He's still not going to have his FE bonuses for most of the fights. C'mon, your primary enemy in the first adventure is goblins...it defined all of Pathfinder, and gave us the Goblin song!
And then you don't fight goblins for the next 16+ levels. Unlike, say, the Regent series, where you're running into high level hobgobs and Oni (Goblins) right up until the last book.
Undead and human both work at level 1. You can flip a coin and he'll find use for both of them because of the 2nd book. If you consider snuffing ghouls faster more important then wiping a human spellcaster, then by all means, take Undead. You WILL want it at 10th, however.
heck, I'll reverse myself. Take undead at level 1. You'll be hopping and ready to put it to use. Take human at 10th and crack some damned Azlanti skulls.
But you really, really had most definitely better take Giants and pump it at 5th. Rarrgh! And save every penny for a Giant Slayer, even if you have to make it yourself...
==Aelryinth
I'm thinking, instead of Adopted, I'll take Child of the Temple to show the school he went to. And that way, I can later get the knowledge (local) and not be too concerned.
I agree with Aelryinth on just about every point. First thing you duke it out with are Goblins but really no need for a FE bonus. My Wizard got his ass handed to him by two surprise smacks by undead so... the rest is pretty standard fare for PF. Humans/undead/evil outsiders and Dragons. Go to choices in one order or another for Rangers.
Every bit of advice i've sought out about the adventure has said Dwarves for the ranger and Giants as FE. Besides, it's not like it would be a stretch for the DM to give some feedback. No need for the OP to be fumbling around in the dark when some suggestions can solve this problem.
Spoilers could have worked also. ;p
The +0 for the Composite Short-Bow is the Strength Rate. You can't afford one at first so i didn't buy one. But if you go the Dwarven Thrower there is really no need.
I really like knowledge: local but thats a personal opinion so whatever works for you go for it. The adopted trait fit with the fluff of the Giant slayer trait. Village/family being wiped out. Other good campaign traits would be ones that give you a Sandpoint contact.
I ended up with going with the Adopted route, because it makes dang good sense. :) The only thing I changed from the suggestions was going longbow at this point instead of the composite. Undead is the first choice, then it'll be giants, then humans, and then after that...well, we'll just see how things go. :) But yeah, spoilers would have been ok, but I'd forget everything soon enough.
I ended up with going with the Adopted route, because it makes dang good sense. :) The only thing I changed from the suggestions was going longbow at this point instead of the composite. Undead is the first choice, then it'll be giants, then humans, and then after that...well, we'll just see how things go. :) But yeah, spoilers would have been ok, but I'd forget everything soon enough.
What will the rest of the party be? I would suggest a Thassilonian Scholar of some sort, Bard or Wizard. Another tough martial as i've heard the later combats can be pretty tough. Maybe a Paladin or Inquisitor or Melee Cleric (another Dwarf Perhaps). I'm not really familiar with all the PF classes so other could probably help here.
So far, it looks like a ranged pally, a really cool concept of a drunken brawler/brutal pugilist barbarian, there's several wizards and sorcerers are applying. I think another bit of the challenge is coming down to who's going to fill out, since I think there's also either an inquisitor or a fighter. So far, I'm the only dwarf submitted. :(