His response:
Probably an extremely good idea (and one that I was going to mention... But forgot). Also, send me the one you think you'll be calling from so I can thine add as a contact.
Oddly, he hasn't actually given me the number yet, but I'll wait a bit.
If I see a half-orc ninja and a swashbuckler in a funny hat waiting outside, I'll be sure to point them in the direction of the nearest flaky player.
:/
I more meant the game.
Alright, he's given me his number. Perhaps things will get easier from now on.
Removed a post.
Do not post personally-identifiable information (phone numbers, addresses, etc.) for yourself or anyone else.
Aw, geez. Sorry, I'm just really stupid. That's seriously inexcusable and I have no idea how it slipped by me.
Anyways, moving away from how moronic a kobold can be, I got this fun message from him just now:
Oh…….. PARENTS
(sobs)
They planned a "family outing" for tommorow… (sighs)
It is now the evening before game day, in case anybody's wondering if time zones might make this any more convenient.
I'm not denying that.
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Be the Buddha, my friend.
Simply stop expecting him to show up.
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Guys, I think we're seriously missing the bigger point of all of this.
Always busy? Flimsy excuses and no shows? Out of town unexpectedly for long periods of time?
KC's friend is Batman.
I normally would just work around his attendance, but it's hard to introduce four new characters (two new players and two replacements for dead PCs) when half of the remaining party never shows up. If he'd just show up for a week or so it wouldn't be a problem--the party would be synched up again and I'd be able to proceed. As is, introductions are awkward.
I normally would just work around his attendance, but it's hard to introduce four new characters (two new players and two replacements for dead PCs) when half of the remaining party never shows up. If he'd just show up for a week or so it wouldn't be a problem--the party would be synched up again and I'd be able to proceed. As is, introductions are awkward.
Based on this, I deduce that you have 6 total characters: 2 new players, 2 "replacement" characters for existing players, 1 dedicated player, and the problem player in question.
I think the solution to introducing these characters is that the 4 "new" characters are an adventuring party already; the 5th "reliable" character joins this party and they go adventuring. The "problem" character is now a spare wheel and need not be present every time.
As for this "problem" player, he has stated that doesn't like the current game; thus it appears that he creates excuses to not be present. It seems like it is time for the adult conversation. The one where you calmly present your observations (i.e the cheating, the negative comments on RP, the lack of regular attendance, all suggest that you do not want to play this game) and get his side of the story. Then come to an amenable solution. Such as he chooses to bow out for now until you switch back to high-level play or to another game he likes. Meanwhile you remain friends (if you so choose) and socialize outside of gaming.
Anyways, this was half rant, but I am looking for advice. How do I get this player to normalize? How do I get him to play the 'right' way? If neither is an option, how do I just keep him from making the game harder to run?
You cannot force him to do anything. If the amenable solution above does not work and he continues to be disruptive, then I'd recommend creating and instituting a "social contract" among the gamers that lay out the ground rules, probably to include:
1. Contacting the group ahead of time if you will be absent. True emergencies are the exception.
2. No hating on other people’s RP.
3. No cheating.
4. Three strikes and you are out. Being let back in requires approval of the group (with the host/GM having final say).
Ratify this among the group to get buy in from all the other players. Then let the rules take care of the problem. One way or another, the problem goes away.
That’s all I got. I’ve had my share of problem players in the past. If they are not dealt with, they will wreck the group (and possibly friendships). I’ve seen more than one gaming group dissolve in the past because of the actions of just one person.
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I normally would just work around his attendance, but it's hard to introduce four new characters (two new players and two replacements for dead PCs) when half of the remaining party never shows up. If he'd just show up for a week or so it wouldn't be a problem--the party would be synched up again and I'd be able to proceed. As is, introductions are awkward.
I think it will be easier to give you advice on how to proceed with introductions in the absence of the problem player. Rather than try and manually align the stars so that he comes to your table in his full and awful glory :-))
But we need some more info about your game and PCs ;-)
I normally would just work around his attendance, but it's hard to introduce four new characters (two new players and two replacements for dead PCs) when half of the remaining party never shows up. If he'd just show up for a week or so it wouldn't be a problem--the party would be synched up again and I'd be able to proceed. As is, introductions are awkward.
RP problem player's PC making the necessary intros, then have him disappear until the player shows up again. (If and when that ever happens.)
Not to flippant about your situation, but I think you're making it more complicated than it is.
The other thing that occurs to me is that if he's almost never showing, it sounds like he's not actually very interested in the game. It could be a situation of he's not into the game, but doesn't want to say so because you're his friend and he doesn't want to hurt your feelings, and no one wants to kick him out of the game because he's their friend and they don't want to hurt his feelings.
So instead in the interests of not hurting everyone's feelings, everyone's frustrated and miserable. Way to go for regard for feelings.
Based on this, I deduce that you have 6 total characters: 2 new players, 2 "replacement" characters for existing players, 1 dedicated player, and the problem player in question.
Well, the second-to-last is stretching things a bit, but otherwise, yup.
I think the solution to introducing these characters is that the 4 "new" characters are an adventuring party already; the 5th "reliable" character joins this party and they go adventuring. The "problem" character is now a spare wheel and need not be present every time.
Sadly, not only are they in the middle of a rescue mission, two of the new characters have already joined the team. They haven't gotten very acquainted, and haven't yet met half the team, but they've joined. Otherwise, I'd definitely like this idea.
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Someone saying they like the game isn't the same as someone feeling they like the game and just saying they still want to play so as not to hurt anyone's feelings.
I can say I like Napoleonic historical fiction but not actually, you know, like it. I might just be saying it to impress someone or to seem cool. Or to keep my social standing with the other person.
I can say I like Napoleonic historical fiction but not actually, you know, like it. I might just be saying it to impress someone or to seem cool. Or to keep my social standing with the other person.
...or because you've just read Jonathan Strange and Mr Norrell and realized how awesome that novel actually is...
Wait, what?? Have you been poking around in my closet of Forbidden Reading Materials?!? What else have you seen, man--what else have you seen?!?
I'm DEFINITELY not poking around in the porn section of that closet, because then... ooh! Get a load of THAT! Is that even POSSIBLE? Oh, wait, sorry, what was I saying again?
It sounds like the closest thing there is to a solution that isn't "kick him out" is have a talk with him. To do that, I'm gonna have to get him in-person, I think, so it could be a while.
Thanks to everyone for the help.
I have a somewhat unreliable player. Of late, it's been getting problematic.
So let me get this right. You have a player that:
- Cheats- Doesn’t roleplay
- Makes fun of other players when they roleplay
- Doesn’t give you notice when he misses sessions
- Doesn’t appreciate your game or the hard work you do to prepare it
- Ignores communications with you
- Is a general pain in the azz
And you’re asking us if you should kick him? lol!
Look, whether he is friends with you or not, it’s time to lay down the law. Ignoring you and not giving advance warning of when he’s going to miss sessions is NOT cool. It’s disrespectful. So that has to stop.
Ask him if he really wants to play your game? Tell him it’s OK to hang out for a few hours. Maybe he’ll just answer that he’s just there to see his buds or whatever. Or stop coming.
If you want to continue having him around, just ignore the fact that his PC is there one moment and not another. Don't write any campaign specific material about him. Maybe make him a sidekick of someone else. Or have a good in-game reason why he might be in and out. Or not. It doesn’t really matter. Point is, don't waste any time making things fun for him.
Btw, I didn't read the rest of this thread, it's possible everything is already good.
Yes, you either need to have a talk or... let it drop. Seriously. How important is it that he's there? You've got a group of five players plus him? The typical party is 4 -- how vital is it, really, that he be present? So he misses the story -- he clearly doesn't care about it and it doesn't sound like he adds anything to the experience.
The only reason I see a need to let it bother you is if you do, in fact, need that sixth space to be filled for some reason, in which case he either needs to attend more or leave so you can recruit a new player.
If you don't need it to be filled... why not just let it drop? Assume he won't be there and, if he shows up, great. A sixth person isn't going to make much of a difference when you're already working with a group of five. But if you think it does, just add +1 or +2 to all the bad guys' rolls when he shows up and increase the xp a little. Doesn't have to be hugely complicated.
Not trying to excuse his behavior; it sounds quite poor. But, if you're not going to kick him (and I understand why if you're all friends or he's friends with the other players), then you've really only got two options: talk to him to try to find a compromise, or let it roll of your back.
The only reason I'm this reluctant to kick Problem Player is that the same player who was upset by the last kicking is good friends with him. I worry I'd lose two players if I kicked one, at which point we'd be left with a completely fresh party of adventurers and all the previous adventures would feel like a waste of time.
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The only reason I'm this reluctant to kick Problem Player is that the same player who was upset by the last kicking is good friends with him. I worry I'd lose two players if I kicked one, at which point we'd be left with a completely fresh party of adventurers and all the previous adventures would feel like a waste of time.
If he leaves because you kicked a problem player, you don't need him anyway. Nothing that you have fun doing is a waste of time. Nothing.
The only reason I'm this reluctant to kick Problem Player is that the same player who was upset by the last kicking is good friends with him. I worry I'd lose two players if I kicked one, at which point we'd be left with a completely fresh party of adventurers and all the previous adventures would feel like a waste of time.
Then talk to that player. If you are worried about how they are going to react, then that's the person you need to talk to. Tell them what you've told us; surely they'll see where you're coming from.
Here are a couple of the fixes that work for us:
That's great advice. I think we've come from the same place, gaming wise. I've listed your post for future reference.
On #1. That's exactly what I do. For some reason when "everyone" had to attend, I had poor attendance and we could only game every 2-3 months. Now that "your attendance is optional", almost every can attend every 3-5 weeks. It makes no sense but it's true.
On #2, haven't had that for years, but I've had it in the past. Arguing with the GM is a big one here, a little is fine, a lot is not.
On #3. Works with #1. I have 7 players and at any session I'm missing 1-2 of them. It means if someone is missing, game days still continue.
On #4. Absolutely. Sometimes you have to lay down the law. But... hopefully you're a reasonable person.
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Here are a couple of the fixes that work for us:
1. The social contract is that people come whenever they can and when it will be fun for them. Period. No pressure, no arm-twisting, no do-or-die. If a PC isn't there one session he/she magically vanishes. If the PC is back the next session -- poof, she/he is back in. (I subtract hit points, spells, etc. to balance game-play.) This dings the continuity a bit, sure. But the pay-off in lack of stress and funkiness is HUGE. In my experience, once things relax and get really fun, people start coming more often. That said, though, especially at particular times of life, other things are going to take priority. New relationships, jobs, classes, parents - don't try to get in the way of that stuff with your Runelords campaign. By running our table this way we literally have more players than we know what to do with on any given week.
One of the all-time greatest house rules I ever read here on the forums was "the Kenny Method": if a player misses a session, their PC is brutally killed by the first trap, monster, or hazard the party encounters. When the player returns next session, their character rejoins the party and the other players are forbidden from ever mentioning the death.
I wish I could remember who to credit for that.
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Here are a couple of the fixes that work for us:
1. The social contract is that people come whenever they can and when it will be fun for them. Period. No pressure, no arm-twisting, no do-or-die. If a PC isn't there one session he/she magically vanishes. If the PC is back the next session -- poof, she/he is back in. (I subtract hit points, spells, etc. to balance game-play.) This dings the continuity a bit, sure. But the pay-off in lack of stress and funkiness is HUGE. In my experience, once things relax and get really fun, people start coming more often. That said, though, especially at particular times of life, other things are going to take priority. New relationships, jobs, classes, parents - don't try to get in the way of that stuff with your Runelords campaign. By running our table this way we literally have more players than we know what to do with on any given week.
One of the all-time greatest house rules I ever read here on the forums was "the Kenny Method": if a player misses a session, their PC is brutally killed by the first trap, monster, or hazard the party encounters. When the player returns next session, their character rejoins the party and the other players are forbidden from ever mentioning the death.
I wish I could remember who to credit for that.
Whoever thought of that should get a medal. Implementing it in my game post haste!
Alright, I'm gonna have a talk with him this Sunday (or on Skype text chat if he doesn't show). I'll see if there's a reason he hasn't discussed for his nonattendance. Unless he can assure me convincingly that his attendance will pick up, I'll be reducing his role to that of a Guest Star.
Yeah, I'm pretty sure I am, but I'll give this a try. :P