Questions on Eternal Youth and Immortality

[HappyDaze]

Alchemists can take Eternal Youth at level 20. Wizards can take Immortality at level 20. Both have the same game effects. Unlike Timeless Body, these effects retroactively remove aging penalties that were in place prior to gaining the ability. However, is a character with Eternal Youth or Immortality still subject to dying from maximum age (such as a character with Timeless Body would be)? Also, do these effects adjust the character's apparent age? If a alchemist or wizard gains this ability while in old age, the body is physically rejuvenated, but does it appear to be so?

[Kierato]

I would say that eternal youth does restore your apparent age (based on it's name), but not immortality. But as a DM, I would let the player decide.
It does not say you die when your time is up, so I would say no to this. literature is rife (rife I say!) with alchemists and wizards hundreds of years old.

[Sean K Reynolds]

HappyDaze wrote:

However, is a character with Eternal Youth or Immortality still subject to dying from maximum age (such as a character with Timeless Body would be)?

I don't think you fully understand the meaning of the words "immortal" and "eternal." :)

[LazarX]

Sean K Reynolds wrote:

HappyDaze wrote:

However, is a character with Eternal Youth or Immortality still subject to dying from maximum age (such as a character with Timeless Body would be)?

I don't think you fully understand the meaning of the words "immortal" and "eternal." :)

The OP is used to the fact that up to now every class feature that promised unaging or immortality had a "your time is up" clause to it. Including ones like the Alienist who learned the secrets of immortality from his Cthulic masters but would be snatched away by creatures from beyond "when his time is up".

[DeathQuaker]

Well, Eternal Youth might have a Death Becomes Her sort of clause...

[HappyDaze]

Sean K Reynolds wrote:

HappyDaze wrote:

However, is a character with Eternal Youth or Immortality still subject to dying from maximum age (such as a character with Timeless Body would be)?

I don't think you fully understand the meaning of the words "immortal" and "eternal." :)

Well, considering that "timeless" still requires one to keep track of total lifespan, I don't think that things are as clear as you suggest.

[Sean K Reynolds]

HappyDaze wrote:

Sean K Reynolds wrote:

HappyDaze wrote:

However, is a character with Eternal Youth or Immortality still subject to dying from maximum age (such as a character with Timeless Body would be)?

I don't think you fully understand the meaning of the words "immortal" and "eternal." :)

Well, considering that "timeless" still requires one to keep track of total lifespan, I don't think that things are as clear as you suggest.

And considering that the "timeless body" ability specifically says you still reach a point when you die from a maximum age, and the immortality and eternal youth discoveries do not, I do think it is as clear as I suggest. :)

[James Sutter]

Sean K Reynolds wrote:

HappyDaze wrote:

Sean K Reynolds wrote:

HappyDaze wrote:

However, is a character with Eternal Youth or Immortality still subject to dying from maximum age (such as a character with Timeless Body would be)?

I don't think you fully understand the meaning of the words "immortal" and "eternal." :)

Well, considering that "timeless" still requires one to keep track of total lifespan, I don't think that things are as clear as you suggest.

And considering that the "timeless body" ability specifically says you still reach a point when you die from a maximum age, and the immortality and eternal youth discoveries do not, I do think it is as clear as I suggest. :)

Sean is filled with snark. Forgive him--he spends too much time with stat blocks and cats.

[Tiny Coffee Golem]

A certain level of snark is what keeps this community amusing and I'm excited to be a part of it.

[HappyDaze]

James Sutter wrote:

Sean K Reynolds wrote:

HappyDaze wrote:

Sean K Reynolds wrote:

HappyDaze wrote:

However, is a character with Eternal Youth or Immortality still subject to dying from maximum age (such as a character with Timeless Body would be)?

I don't think you fully understand the meaning of the words "immortal" and "eternal." :)

Well, considering that "timeless" still requires one to keep track of total lifespan, I don't think that things are as clear as you suggest.

And considering that the "timeless body" ability specifically says you still reach a point when you die from a maximum age, and the immortality and eternal youth discoveries do not, I do think it is as clear as I suggest. :)

Sean is filled with snark. Forgive him--he spends too much time with stat blocks and cats.

I'm not so sold on forgiving him for such behavior at the request of another (though I do appreciate your attempt). I'll just ignore him from here on.

[Nemitri]

You don't want to live forever, trust me...

5 Reasons immortality would be worse than death.

[Abraham spalding]

Nemitri wrote:

You don't want to live forever, trust me...

5 Reasons immortality would be worse than death.

One day of rum every 10 years in the course of forever is still a lot of rum.

[Artanthos]

Nemitri wrote:

You don't want to live forever, trust me...

5 Reasons immortality would be worse than death.

I prefer the form of immortality in The Days of Solomen Gursky

Simply replace nanotechnology with magic and most of your stated reasons start to dissappear.

[list]

Evolution: Both wizards and alchemist have the ability to reshape living creatures. In the case of the alchemist, this is an explicit class ability.

Nobody can ever find out: Seriously, any wizard that can achieve immortality can alter appearance and identity at will. And forget about scrying for him, he does not want to be found you'll need to start burning wish spells just to get a clue.

Mental Aging: Probably the most difficult to deal with. The framework of existing magic does allow for the manipulation and storage of memory and skills. A wizard faced with an exceptionally long lifespan would certainly have to time to refine these abilities if necessary.

Time speeds up: This is more an issue of perspective. Maybe you'll be able to deal with it, maybe you won't. Some people have difficulty dealing with life at 20, others are still enjoying life at 80. With the right perspective (and possibly a great deal of time spent soul searching) maybe you'll find a framework that keeps your mind health. If not, you can always use solutions from #3 to mitigate the weight of the years.

You'll eventually get trapped somewhere: Neither Eternal Youth nor Immortality are true eteral life, both state the alchemist / wizard can still be killed. Given that, a wizard that has immortality is also going to have a web of contingency spells and access interplanetary teleportation and even planer travel, there are always options.

[HappyDaze]

Artanthos wrote:

Mental Aging: Probably the most difficult to deal with. The framework of existing magic does allow for the manipulation and storage of memory and skills. A wizard faced with an exceptionally long lifespan would certainly have to time to refine these abilities if necessary.

This is simply not an issue in Pathfinder. Creatures get greater mental capacity as they age (see the aging modifiers). Realism be damned since were talking about an entirely fantasy world.