Human fighter 9.
Build is something like 16 16 12 13 10 10 with a 20 point buy (I think). These feats:
1 power attack
h combat expertise
1 improved trip
2 improved drag
3 riptide attack
4 combat reflexes
5 weapon focus (some reach weapon?)
6 felling smash
7 greater trip
8 greater drag
9 vital strike
Enemy moves up to me. I AoO1 and trip him. This makes him provoke again, so I hit him normally for some damage with AoO2 (Is he prone at this point?). Riptide Attack now lets me drag from the initial AoO1 (Does this still work if I hit and tripped him at reach?). The enemy spends his last action to stand back up, provoking AoO3, and so I hit him for damage again (he is prone for this one, and so I can't re-trip him right now?).
On my turn I use Power Attack and hit the enemy for damage with a Vital Strike (attack action). This activates Felling Strike, and so I spend a Swift action to trip. The trip makes him provoke from me again and so I hit him for damage, AND the trip activates Riptide Attack, so I get to drag him as well (which provokes from my allies). I spend my move action to back up.
In this ideal situation where I rolled nothing but successes, does this work as written? See also my questions in parentheses.
(As a note, I don't consider this to be a very good build... but it's interesting!)
I'm fascinated by the progression, but can you explain the significance that the Drag action has? I don't really understand what the swift action drag is accomplishing for you.
The point of the drag is for situational placement as well as to make them provoke from your allies (once you have Greater Drag).
I'm sure you can do more with it though. The concept isn't fully formed yet.
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The answer is no, it doesn't work.
Being tripped doesn't provoke an AoO so AoO2 never happens.
AoO3 requires the target to try to stand up so it depends on that (most times you just attack while prone and eat the to to-hit penalty).
Finally, Felling Smash & Riptide Attack both require you to spend a swift action to Trip/Drag so you can only do one of those per round.
Ah, I somehow didn't see the swift action listed for Riptide. Thanks for that one. Half of the stuff is now invalidated.
But... you're wrong about tripping provoking with this build. Check the text for Greater Trip. It's kinda the point of the feat.
What about this question: If I use an attack action to trip when 10 ft away with a reach weapon, can I use Riptide Attack? Drag normally requires your target to be adjacent to you.
You can. They just need to be from different actions that the enemy is taking. AND you need to have combat reflexes. I assume that your AoOs refresh at the end of your turn like your Swift/Immediate action does.
At the moment we're basically looking at this:
Enemy moves up to me. I AoO1 and trip him. This makes him provoke again, so I hit him normally for some damage with AoO2*. The enemy spends his last action to stand back up, provoking AoO3, and so I hit him for damage again. Or he lays there, unable to attack me from 10 ft away.
Supposing the enemy stood back up, I spend an attack action or a full-attack on my turn to make a trip attempt (or two if necessary). I get AoO4 from the trip and I use that attack to hit him normally. I then activate Riptide Attack** and drag the enemy, which will give an AoO to any of my allies who are adjacent to the enemy, and should be used to set up flanking if possible. At this point I either finish my full-attack or I spend my move action. I end my turn and refresh my AoOs and swift/immediate actions.
*: The AoO from Greater Trip happens while he's still standing, right?
**: Would Riptide happen before or after my AoO4, or would I get to choose?
I don't believe you can take multiple, same round, attacks on the same enemy(tho I could be wrong).
That is not correct. What you're thinking of is the rules that the same action cannot provoke more than one AoO per round. So, for example, if I move through multiple threatened squares, that's still only one AoO. But if I move through a threatened square, then try and cast a spell, that would trigger two AoOs.
So *that* part of Castarr's build works correctly.
*: The AoO from Greater Trip happens while he's still standing, right?
No, because Greater Trip triggers an AoO "after a successful trip attempt". After a successful attempt, the target is prone.
**: Would Riptide happen before or after my AoO4, or would I get to choose?
I believe the Greater Trip's AoO interrupts your Riptide ability. (As the former is a reaction, and the latter is a swift action.) Thus AoO4, followed by drag. Though I could see a different GM ruling differently and I wouldn't put up a fuss.
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Actually drag says nothing about the target needing to be adjacent, it just requires a melee attack which a reach weapon does.
(I missed the greater trip in the feat tree).
As for the rest you CAN technically do this but you'll be limiting yourself to only taking a standard action after you trip your target. (you are still limited to your normal allowed move each round and with a full attack that's just a 5 foot step).
Also any target with a decent acrobatics score can avoid AoO1 & AoO4 with a skill check vs your CMD. AND any target that is flying/levitating is immune to everything you are doing. Since flight becomes extremely common about the level you start using vital strike the trick becomes situational at best.
But other than that, yes the trick does work just not very well.
"Whenever you successfully trip an opponent, that opponent provokes attacks of opportunity." -From the PFSRD
Since it doesn't say "after," I would assume that the AoO works as a normal AoO and interrupts the action. For the same reason that you can't re-trip a target as they are standing up (because the AoO happens while getting up and so they're still prone) I'd guess that they would be standing for the Greater Trip AoO.
The AoO interrupts it, yes, but AoOs by definition always interrupt other actions. It's in the description of AoOs in the combat section. Riptide would still happen though after the AoO resolves, right?
yes the trick does work just not very well.
Yeah... I never claimed it was a good build, I was just wondering what some other people thought of how the idea actually works out and what would actually happen with it. Thanks :)