RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32
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I've acquired a PFS boon that will let me build one kitsune PC. At first I was going to be a sorcerer, but having enchantment DCs in the stratosphere without breaking a sweat seemed too easy. Plus, I just feel like I want my kitsune to be more physical, with tools and weapons strapped over his clothes. None of this bathrobe-wearing straight-caster nonsense. I could always use a human or aasimar or something for that.
So I was thinking, perhaps a dashing Archaeologist (bard archetype) could be fun, and still reasonably effective?
Stats probably something like this:
STR 10 (12-2)
DEX 18 (16+2)
CON 14
INT 10
WIS 10
CHA 15 (13+2, bump at 4th)
My first feat would of course be Weapon Finesse, probably using a rapier as my main weapon (upgraded to a +1 agile rapier at the earliest opportunity - probably somewhere around 6th level). Second feat would be Lingering Performance, so I would essentially always be getting my Luck bonuses during combat - which actually gives me the same to-hit as a full-BAB class up until 9th level, albeit with a later entry into iterative attacks.
I get a rogue talent at 4th level, which I'm not totally sure on yet, but could be Combat Trick to grab Arcane Strike to help my damage output - less miserable pre-agile, and more awesome thereafter.
Since I'm not Dervish Dancing, I can actually use a buckler, which means I have enough slots to keep a very respectable AC while I'm busy stabbing people (especially once I nab a mithral breastplate, penalty-free if I take the Armor Expert trait).
I feel like this could be pretty solid for PFS play, although I would have to suffer through some low-damage early levels. But I'd be well-rounded enough that I wouldn't just be twiddling my thumbs, and after about 6th level I'm dealing 1d6+10 damage with an 18-20 crit range.
Whaddya think, solid? Or am I way off base?
I would have to suffer through some low-damage early levels.
Since when do you care about doing damage? It's like I don't even know you any more...
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RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32
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Sounds like a pretty decent build to me. The finesse route seems like a good way to go, considering your light armor and your evasion. Between high dex, high base reflex and near-constant Luck you'll be practically immune to area damage eventually.
Hehe, hadn't really thought about that, but you're right, that's pretty cool.
Regarding Arcane Strike you should be a little careful. It's a decent feat, but note that it has anti-synergy with Archaeologist's Luck and Lingering Performance (if you need to (re)activate AL every third turn, you'll only be using AS 2/3 of the time).
Fair point. On the other hand, it's still scaling damage with no real drawbacks. Any alternative suggestions?
Also remember that you're still an excellent party buffer despite the loss of IC. Make sure you take full advantage of your excellent buff spells (with your low cha you aren't going to use many offensive spells anyway).
Gallant Inspiration is rather fantastic, and it's actually *better* for someone who doesn't get Inspire Courage. It also has anti-synergy with Arcane Strike, however. Staples like Haste and Good Hope are of course also worthwhile. Between Good Hope and Luck you'll be stacking some pretty nice damage and save bonuses.
Wow, those are some nice spells. I've never really played a bard before, so I wasn't aware of how good some of these buff spells are. Thanks!
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RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32
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I am not crazy about having Weapon Finesse at level 1. ... It's just not worth the loss of feats for the extra +1 to attack with a light weapon.
Um, what? How are you getting a mere +1 out of it? Even compared to your example stat set, it's +2 from the get-go, and more as my DEX goes up. Whatever you're trying to say here, I didn't follow, so feel free to clarify.
I would recommend something like this:
STR 14 (16-2)
DEX 16 (14+2)
CON 12
INT 12
WIS 7
CHA 16 (14+2)You won't hit as often, but you will do more damage when you do, especially since you'll get 21 rounds of luck instead of 7.
I'll only have to deal with the lack of Lingering Performance until 3rd level, and I'm not even starting this guy until I hit at least 2nd from GM credit alone, so I don't mind if I have to go through 2 or 3 sessions with only a few rounds of Luck.
If you use a rapier or scimitar, you'll be able to make it keen at level 6-ish instead of agile.
I have to tack on quite a few damage bonuses before keen becomes better than agile (especially when the latter comes with more successful hits). Haven't done the math to see where exactly the line is, but it's a bit on the high side.
The intelligence bonus is also key if you really want your bardic knowledge and loremaster capabilities to really be useful.
I'm not planning on focusing on those abilities.
Once you get your key bard abilities (around 6-8), I might recommend taking a couple of levels of Dragon Disciple to gain natural armor and a bonus to your strength score, as well as two claws and a bite several rounds a day. You lose a level of spellcasting, but I think the bonuses you gain doing it would be worth it.
A powerful idea, but waaaaaay off-concept for this guy. Thanks anyway, though. :)
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And you also keep inspire courage. :)Why would I want Inspire Courage when I can have Archaeologist's Luck?
There are upsides and downsides to both for sure.
Archaeologist's Luck is a swift action, so you can use it whenever you like - although as you pick up spells and abilities you'll be juggling your swift actions (as has been discussed above). You also get the bonus to more things (saving throws and skills) so that it might be more flexible in certain situations.
Inspire Courage will eventually scale up to be a faster activation but in the meantime will be slower to activate. However that also makes it easier to use in tandem with other swift action abilities. In addition, you're playing in PFS - this means you're likely to have 5 other people at the table. Bardic performances scale exponentially in effectiveness with larger parties, because everyone is getting the boost! You can also use it more often per day as Archaeologist's Luck never scales in usage (it's always 4 + Cha mod rounds, not 4 + Cha + 2/level).
Of course it's also a matter of flavour, too. Like I mentioned - Bard/Rogue vs. Bard/Fighter concepts.
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RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32
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The swift-action juggle is a legitimate point, but I imagine it'll end up being not too big of a deal. Compared to spending most of my career needing to spend my first turn just buffing and setting up, the tradeoff seems negligible. And it's not like I need a swift action every round that I want to have Luck going; it's a free action to maintain, or no action for 2 rounds with Lingering Performance.
You're right about Inspire Courage scaling in power with party size, but the second you demonstrate you can buff the party, the assumptions and expectations come flying at you. ;)
And I am indeed going for more of a rogue-like character than a fighter-like character.
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One thing I would not really recommend is taking your Wis to 7 or really creating a dump stat of any sort. That's -2 to all saves on Will, forever.
So if you are looking for Dex and Cha. I'd consider something like this.
Str. 12 (-2=10) so you stay at 10
Dex. 14 (+2=16)
Con. 14
Int. 12
Wis. 11
Cha. 14 (+2=16)
This gives you a chance to up your Wis at 4 to 12 and get +1, or the alternative is 13 int and 10 wis which gives you the +1 at lvl. 4 to int. Both good in my opinion. (I prefer the Int as it does give you some points to play with.)
Now if you are really looking to get that Dex. to 18, a +2 Dex belt is 4,000gp and an Ioun stone +2 Dex is 8,000gp, which will get your Dex to 20, both easily doable at around lvl. 4-5.
That's my 2cp.
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RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32
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So pretty much just a slight re-jiggering of stats? No glaring flaws I'm overlooking?
I'll definitely consider your suggested tweaks. Numbers can always be played around with a bit more.
I guess if I plan out what skills I actually want, I could determine exactly what INT is needed...
Now if you are really looking to get that Dex. to 18, a +2 Dex belt is 4,000gp and an Ioun stone +2 Dex is 8,000gp, which will get your Dex to 20, both easily doable at around lvl. 4-5.
Just FYI, the belt and ioun stone both give enhancement bonuses, so they don't stack.
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Just FYI, the belt and ioun stone both give enhancement bonuses, so they don't stack.
Than you, was not aware of that. Still a Dex +2 belt can be upped to Dex +4 belt, for another 12,000gp. So you go with +2 Dex belt at first, 4,000gp and another 12,000 for a +4 Dex belt. Which does get you to 20 Dex, if that's the primary stat you want to up.
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The question is at level 5 will you miss the +10 skill points and the +2 to all knowledge checks or will you miss the 12,000gp? And at that level would you be willing to pay 1,200gp per skill point?
As a cleric who wants knowledge myself, I often have to make the choice which skills do I invest my measly base 2 skill points into. So often enough, I wish I had the +1 skill point. Also, since Int is the base for most knowledges, you are really giving up +2 skill point for each knowledge because of your Int bonus and not just the 10 extra skill points.
So, let us say, you have Planar Knowledge and each level you put in 1 point. At level 5, you have a +5. With the extra Int your skill is +7 and you have two other knowledges at +7.
How could this be that important you may ask. The group who played Day of the Demon game, one slot before us, was much lower in level but they did the (6-7) scenario, too. And they breezed through the scenario because they didn't have to go through that 150hp 8 attack Golem. And you know how they did it? My buddy Shaun was at the table and he rolled a 20+ with his skills and got the password for the house at the beginning of the scenario and the Golem never fought them. So, some knowledges can be be very vital. (I thought I was going to tear my hair out, when I heard that after the scenario was over.) :D
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RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32
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Yeah, sounds like my next step is to determine what skills I want to keep trained, and therefore how many skill points per level I want. Also, a +2 DEX belt and a +2 INT ioun stone is cheaper than a +4 DEX belt. Similarly, a +2 DEX belt and either a +2 INT headband or an expansion of a +2 CHA headband to +2 CHA/INT would also be cheaper than a +4 DEX belt. So the number of skills I want will definitely make a difference.
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The other thing that might be a consideration is that a +2 Int headband has to be tied to (1) knowledge. So a +2 Int of Planar Knowledge or +2 Int Knowledge (local) and that the only place that specific Knowledge can be applied. So a lvl. 5 character who gets the +2 Int headband has to choose which knowledges he isn't using all game long, since this will give him bonus skill points in that knowledge when he gets it.
So, for example, if you took Knowledge Planar +1 and at lvl. 5 you got the Int +2 head band and you choose Planar as the knowledge you'd prefer, your investment of +1 is nullified in that knowledge to only +5, since the knowledge you have and the head band don't stack.