Help with ship to ship combat and the spell Pyrotechnics GM's


Skull & Shackles

The Exchange

I am a GM and ran one ship to ship combat thus far. Well in that combat the sorcerer basically crippled the other ship by doing this.

He first shot a flaming bolt at the sails, then next round cast pyrotechnics blinding nearly all on top deck.

Now I love creative role playing, but this turned out to be very powerful. I ruled that half the crew was above decks as well as prominent figures. This resulted in them becoming blind. The ship started with a crew of 40 with half on deck that dropped to 20 then they became blinded. Basically until the crew was swapped out with those not above decks the ship was uncontolled. This crippled the ship for about 2 or 3 rounds.

This overall was very powerful. And even when the pc's boarded the enemy ship the npc's still had a round left on their blindness.

Like I said I like creative role playing but doing this crippled the ship (at least the way I ran it) and this was a second level spell.

Should I change the way I handled this and if so how?


All I can say is remember the range penalty for ranged weapons, max range increment and remember ammo breakage.

The Exchange

Yeah they took a -8 because of range but when the ac on sails are 5 it's still easy to hit.


I do not have the rules infront of me, do they allow a single mundane flaming bolt to disable the sails. A sucessful hit could hit and go through moving to fast to ignite the sails. Hit make a hole and possibly get tangled in the sails causing a small burn that may spread over several rounds. Also one bolt can hit one sail. So if the boat has multiple sails it might be slowed but not disabled.

Dark Archive

The issue here is not the flaming bolt (it won't really burn a sail and burning a single sail won't cripple the ship). The issue is the use of Pyrotechnics.

You do know that every single potential target is entitled to a Will Save (DC 16-17ish probably), is only effected if they have line of sight to the sail, and that you are technically supposed to roll 20 different Will Saves in this case, right?

It is the same sort of thing as using Fireball on twenty enemies. If you as the GM roll one Reflex Save, get a 6, and decide they all fail, well the Fireball is pretty overpowered.

Lastly, keep in mind that the majority of ships in the Skull & Shackles Adventure Path have noncombatent NPC crews. The ship in question didn't have 20 Fighters or even 20 Warriors on deck, did it? Because 1st Level Commoners tend to fail against everything, and this situation is only going to get worse. By the time the sorcerer is 10th level or so, he will have a half-dozen Spells that say 'target ship becomes uncrewed for 1d6 minutes'. You'll have to deal with that.

Shadow Lodge

The rules for fire on ships are in the players guide for Skull and Shackles. The bolt would hit the sails, do 3d8 damage or so (assuming a light ballista), and then the ship would get to make a save versus fire. If it failed that save then it would start taking 2d6 damage a round. It would take a long time to even burn half of the sails (the amount required to apply the "broken" status). So a single flaming bolt isn't going to cripple a ship.

The pyrotechnics thing is another matter. I probably would have ruled that maybe 1/4 to 1/2 of the crew had clear line of sight to the bolt. Then just dealt with their saves on a straight percentage basis. So if 10 people with +1 saves need to make a DC15 save that means that 7 of them failed. Losing 7 crew at once might still be a problem. It might drop the ship into the skeleton crew category meaning -10 on profession sailor checks to control the ship. But it isn't going to completely cripple them either.

Generally though, I observe that magic will quickly dominate ship to ship combat in this campaign unless the GM gets creative about countering it. Normal wooden ships crewed by 1st level commoners and experts are just sitting ducks against even 5-6th level characters.

Dark Archive

One of the things I've done to somewhat mitigate this is divide the many shipboard NPCs into four types. These types apply to both allies and enemies of the PCs:

Main Characters: These are creatures with the same Hit Dice as the PCs and often PC Class Levels. Usually 1-2 of the Officers on an enemy ship are this, plus the Captain is this, as well.

Officers: These are crew (friends or foes) with 2 less Hit Dice than the PCs. Usually 2-3 of these on an enemy ship, and the named allies of the PCs with PC Class Levels (Sandara Quinn, Ambrose Kroop, etc) are this as well.

Crew: These are 'regular' named pirates on any given ship. They tend to have 1/2 the PCs Hit Dice.

Swabs: These are almost universally 1 Hit Die Commoners, although Experts aren't unlikely either.

Basically, using this system you can keep the PCs inevitable flotilla of carnage in check, as well as create balanced encounters on the fly. Plus Spells no longer take out half the enemy crew that matters in one shot.


sabedoriaclark wrote:
I probably would have ruled that maybe 1/4 to 1/2 of the crew had clear line of sight to the bolt...

I had written up a very similar post earlier today, but it got eaten and I couldn't be bothered to rewrite it. Basically - I agree with everything sabedoriaclark has written.

The players found a creative way to give themselves a tactical advantage and should be rewarded. At the same time, however, it shouldn't be an auto-win.

I'll add - I would also do the duration by percentages as well. A quarter of those blinded will recover after 2 rounds, another quarter the next round and so on. So, at best, you're only going to get one round (6 seconds!) of time while the opponent's ship might be uncontrolled. Still, it'll take them a while longer than that to fully recover and they'll be taking penalties until everyone can see again.


you might want to mention that "on deck" does not mean within sight of sail and looking at it. For one thing other sails would be in the way. Called an "obstruction"

Second the "guy on deck" might be rather busy setting up his own catapult and not even glance at the spell. Yeah, Line of Sight by RAW...

Third, but that is only in the spirit of the original game, the spell used to affect only bonfire sized fires and bigger ones before, so in that tradition the bolt would not really be enough of a fire source. by RAW, it stands *sigh*

Fourth, have your sorcerer actually spot the small burning arrow somewhere in the rigging next time around before trying to affect it. Yes behind all the sails, spotting small burning dot on white sails is not all that easy. Take a look at deductiosn to perception-rolls^^
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That being said, magic on the high seas : far more deadly than anything that can be done with catapults and similar stuff.

My group has build themselves a magical contraption, strangely enough looking like a "cannon", they lovingly call "The Foghorn" and which projects a sonic attack over app 700'. Usually aimed to smash the rudder or blast the steering. Most civillian crews feel morally obliged to strike the colours, next thing... especially if the steering wheel and the helmsman are a fine mushy mixture all-over the quarterdeck

Friend's group have their wizard "Dimension Door" over, than use "Detonate" (in combination with Fire Shield), on "hard targets". Even worse when he does that in the hull of the ship, basically setting everything down there on fire, blowing out the hatches etc etc etc.. yeah, now the target is completely aflame, inside the hull. Good Luck.

High Magics : beating catapults every time. Simply enough for usually never requiring much of a roll-to-hit


At low levels, magics SHOULD trump ships if used right. Higher levels, expect the NPCs to do something about it. If you KNOW that your greatest weakness is fire, you're damn sure going to to something about it.

Magically reinforced hulls and rudders, fireproofed sails, and other anti-bombardment tactics should be used by higher level NPCs. If the PCs are preying on the weak, well, they SHOULD be easy to take out.

Also remember that turnabout is fair play; The PCs should be on the receiving end of such tactics too. They aren't the only raiders in the Fever Sea, after all!

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