Spell DC calculation

[Maulium]

The save of a spell is:
10+half the caster level+spell level+modifier?

or a'm I wrong?

[Jeraa]

Maulium wrote:

The save of a spell is:

10+half the caster level+spell level+modifier?

or a'm I wrong?

You are wrong. The caster level has nothing to do with it. The DC is only:

10 + spell level + ability modifier.

[Vixeryz]

well- that blows. So your spell DC will never increase with level yet you will run into NPCs that have a spell DC of 25 for their 1st level spells.
How do they do it? In a game of every increasing base saves- How does a player compete?

[Marthian]

Increased Ability Modifier
Spell Focus and Greater Spell Focus
Elemental Focus

And of course:
Debuffs, Debuffs, and well... More Debuffs!

[Ciaran Barnes]

You use 10 + 1/2 level + mod for a bunch of spell-like abilities. Which NPC has a 25 DC for their first level spell?

[mplindustries]

Ciaran Barnes wrote:

Which NPC has a 25 DC for their first level spell?

You know, that NPC with a 38 in their casting stat...

I'm pretty sure he's referring to a supernatural or spell like ability with that DC, not a spell.

[Midnight_Angel]

Ciaran Barnes wrote:

Which NPC has a 25 DC for their first level spell?

Actually, I have one right here, in an official AP.

Let's see... Casting stat 36, spell focus, greater spell focus... yup, DC26 on the NPC's favored level 1 spells.

Granted, it's a pretty high-level NPC, but still...

[spalding]

Midnight_Angel wrote:

Ciaran Barnes wrote:

Which NPC has a 25 DC for their first level spell?

Actually, I have one right here, in an official AP.

Let's see... Casting stat 36, spell focus, greater spell focus... yup, DC26 on the NPC's favored level 1 spells.

Granted, it's a pretty high-level NPC, but still...

A DC 26 at level 16~20? That's nothing. Consider that you have a +12 or +6 base on your save at that point and probably a +5 cloak of resistance, +2 from stat that's a +19 or +13 right there and we haven't even stretched to trying to have good saves by being a dwarf or a paladin or some such.

Honestly save throw bonuses scale up just as quickly (at some levels faster) than DCs do.

If you search the beta testing archives for posts by me in the magic section you'll find where we broke down all the math and showed that the high end and low end of save throw DC's for all levels increase at the same rate leaving you at about a 55% chance of successfully saving as a human fighter (the character with the worse saves in the game) against the best spell DC a wizard could offer in core at the time.

Now granted new abilities have come in to raise DCs... but then again new abilities have also came in to raise save throws too.