The LGBT Gamer Community Thread.


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So, if the ruling isn't stayed for appeal, March 9th is the date you can get marriage licenses in NE, no matter your preference of (consenting adult human) mate.

Project Manager

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Kryzbyn wrote:
Well, I can see him equating activist meaning "bypassing the will of the people", but in this case, the will of the people is unconstitutional, AND IT'S HIS JOB.

These people seem to forget that democracy was the problem to which the Constitution was designed as a solution.


Guy on the radio was saying that it's not discrimination because "I can't marry a dude either, so it's even."
Oh, well what fools are we, then. Ridiculous.


Kryzbyn wrote:

Guy on the radio was saying that it's not discrimination because "I can't marry a dude either, so it's even."

Oh, well what fools are we, then. Ridiculous.

I thought that utterly dumb pseudo-excuse was completely refuted already...


Well, if it hasn't it should be, because it has absolutely nothing to do with the issue.


California man files ballot measure to execute all homosexuals by firing squad.

This has so little chance of ever coming even remotely close to a law that I fell quite secure in laughing my head off.


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Drejk wrote:
Kryzbyn wrote:

Guy on the radio was saying that it's not discrimination because "I can't marry a dude either, so it's even."

Oh, well what fools are we, then. Ridiculous.
I thought that utterly dumb pseudo-excuse was completely refuted already...

It's the argument used in Loving v. Virginia too. Just in case anybody missed what happened to the segregationists.


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Kelsey Arwen MacAilbert wrote:

California man files ballot measure to execute all homosexuals by firing squad.

This has so little chance of ever coming even remotely close to a law that I fell quite secure in laughing my head off.

that someone even has the gall to present this as a ballot measure has literally made me lose my appetite.


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You know you're a bad seed when you suggest things the nazis felt they had to do in secret.


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Kelsey Arwen MacAilbert wrote:

California man files ballot measure to execute all homosexuals by firing squad.

This has so little chance of ever coming even remotely close to a law that I fell quite secure in laughing my head off.

I particularly like:
Quote:
e) This law is effective immediately and shall not be rendered ineffective or invalidated by any court, state or federal, until heard by a quorum of the Supreme Court of California consisting only of judges who are neither sodomites nor subject to disqualification hereunder.

Because putting "The Court can't overturn this law" in laws is so constitutional. :)

The part where, if you notify the state of a sodomite and they don't kill him within a year, you get to do it yourself, goes a bit far, I'd say.

Freehold DM wrote:
that someone even has the gall to present this as a ballot measure has literally made me lose my appetite.

It's a big country. There are bound to be a few crazy people with $200 and a bit of gall. (Actually the gall often goes along with the crazy.)


That's certainly crazy, all right, but as soon you state that the First Amendment is yours to ignore if God commands it, I don't think you need to worry about the comparative technicality of future jurisdictions somehow being bound by a sitting jurisdiction.


I want to add something to this thread (since I am a gay gamer) but I am SO weirded out by that firing squad thing I don't know how to react appropriately...

Liberty's Edge

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Mocking and derision works well.


I'm lucky enough to live in a country that isn't _as_ deeply homophobic as the US, so that's probably why it doesn't get to me that much, but I just think, like, I've seen and heard hundreds if not thousands of comments to that extent (or sometimes worse). Granted it's probably a few people on a lot of sites saying stuff like that, but still, I see it perhaps a half-dozen times a day when visiting less savory pages.

This was just one of those guys who had 200 bucks to waste.

If he gets more than a hundred signatures, that's a different thing.

Granted, if he happened to get a bullet in the head himself, I wouldn't cry myself to sleep over it. I'd probably go get a nice whisky :P


Gaberlunzie wrote:

I'm lucky enough to live in a country that isn't _as_ deeply homophobic as the US, so that's probably why it doesn't get to me that much, but I just think, like, I've seen and heard hundreds if not thousands of comments to that extent (or sometimes worse). Granted it's probably a few people on a lot of sites saying stuff like that, but still, I see it perhaps a half-dozen times a day when visiting less savory pages.

This was just one of those guys who had 200 bucks to waste.

If he gets more than a hundred signatures, that's a different thing.

Granted, if he happened to get a bullet in the head himself, I wouldn't cry myself to sleep over it. I'd probably go get a nice whisky :P

Honestly, I'd be shocked if he got less than a few thousand signatures - assuming he makes any effort. Some people will sign anything without reading it. Some really do agree, or will agree with the general concept of banning homosexuals without realizing the shooting part is involved.

There are something close to 40 million people in California. One in 10,000 gets you 4,000 signatures. Obviously he can't ask them all, but he can target places more likely to have bigots.
Luckily he needs 365000 signatures and he won't get anywhere near that.


thejeff wrote:
Honestly, I'd be shocked if he got less than a few thousand signatures - assuming he makes any effort. Some people will sign anything without reading it. Some really do agree, or will agree with the general concept of banning homosexuals without realizing the shooting part is involved.

Those are fair points.


Yea. I'm just not worried about this. It's funny, if anything.


Krensky wrote:
Mocking and derision works well.

Oh, then I TOTALLY know how to react to this. Whew!


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Kelsey Arwen McAlibert wrote:
California man files ballot measure to execute all homosexuals by firing squad.

Huh. That was an interesting read.

I seem to recall someone important once saying, "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone..."

And something else about "Judge not others lest you be judged yourself..."

And another suggestion to "Remove the log from your own eye before you remove the speck from someone else's..."

And that the greatest commandment is to love your neighbor.

And something else about putting away weapons drawn in his defense.

The fact that Mr. McLaughlin is advocating murder in the name of Christ indicates that he hasn't actually read this book he purports to be defending.

I think the guy needs to see a shrink.


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Haladir wrote:
Kelsey Arwen McAlibert wrote:
California man files ballot measure to execute all homosexuals by firing squad.

Huh. That was an interesting read.

I seem to recall someone important once saying, "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone..."

And something else about "Judge not others lest you be judged yourself..."

And another suggestion to "Remove the log from your own eye before you remove the speck from someone else's..."

And that the greatest commandment is to love your neighbor.

And something else about putting away weapons drawn in his defense.

The fact that Mr. McLaughlin is advocating murder in the name of Christ indicates that he hasn't actually read this book he purports to be defending.

I think the guy needs to see a shrink.

Selective reading of the Bible isn't exactly uncommon.

Nor limited to the Bible, for that matter.


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Nor is not even having opened the bible uncommon for the real loonies.

Shadow Lodge

Sissyl wrote:
Nor is not even having opened the bible uncommon for the real loonies.

Most of them have opened a bible. Just at the direction of a minister or preacher that is guiding them only to passages selected to prove a specific point. Kind of takes us full circle to the quote mining issue.

Silver Crusade RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 32

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Friendly reminder that homophobia, Christianity, and mental illness don't usually have any causal relation.

Advocating for violence against homosexuality as a Christian cause (and the characterization of homosexuality as a form of violence) is neither new nor related to being "crazy." If anything, this is a (currently more extreme) reflection of the dominant view in the west since, let's say, Dante Alighieri.


My roommate is kinda hilarious. He was very bright and happy today, and this conversation took place:

NSFW language, translated from Swedish so it may seem a bit stilted:

He: Oh you'll never guess what me and John (his lover, made up name) did today!
Me: What did you do?
He: We had sex at the police station!
Me: Uhh okay, glad you're enjoying yourself.
He: Yeah and I spit his sperm on the floor in disgust
Me: Huh? I thought you liked sperm?
He: Yeah it was disgust of the cops


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mechaPoet wrote:

Friendly reminder that homophobia, Christianity, and mental illness don't usually have any causal relation.

Advocating for violence against homosexuality as a Christian cause (and the characterization of homosexuality as a form of violence) is neither new nor related to being "crazy." If anything, this is a (currently more extreme) reflection of the dominant view in the west since, let's say, Dante Alighieri.

To me, being a loonie is about having completely absurd views than any sort of mental health issues. I take mental illness very seriously, but there are honest opinions that make you go "bluh... Ummm... Guh...." when you hear them, and having some word for those people is useful. I also think you are wrong about Dante. It is probably a few thousand years older than him, and certainly did not start as a christian concept. Leviticus is just FULL of sweetness, sunshine and joy toward other people.

Silver Crusade RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 32

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Sissyl wrote:
mechaPoet wrote:

Friendly reminder that homophobia, Christianity, and mental illness don't usually have any causal relation.

Advocating for violence against homosexuality as a Christian cause (and the characterization of homosexuality as a form of violence) is neither new nor related to being "crazy." If anything, this is a (currently more extreme) reflection of the dominant view in the west since, let's say, Dante Alighieri.

To me, being a loonie is about having completely absurd views than any sort of mental health issues. I take mental illness very seriously, but there are honest opinions that make you go "bluh... Ummm... Guh...." when you hear them, and having some word for those people is useful. I also think you are wrong about Dante. It is probably a few thousand years older than him, and certainly did not start as a christian concept. Leviticus is just FULL of sweetness, sunshine and joy toward other people.

Yeah, I think I accidentally omitted an "at least" in there. But then, Leviticus wasn't exactly written in what is known as "the West."

But anyway, "loonie" reads to me as a word in the same vein as "crazy" or "mad" that acts as a shorthand for the absurdity you're describing. However, it gets there by way of misrepresenting, stigmatizing, and generalizing mental illness. But maybe I'm misreading that word? It has connotation of "the loonie bin" to me.

I do not doubt that you take mental illness seriously, but I think your language makes a dangerous comparison (for those who aren't heterosexual and neurotypical).


Ben Carson says that being gay is a choice.

In my opinion, he said lots of offensive things, lots of slightly unoffensive things, and a lot of uninformed things. But then again, I'm new to this community, so... yeah.

Anyways, nice to see you all again! :)


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It's nice to see candidates eliminated this early in the race.


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Kryzbyn wrote:
It's nice to see candidates eliminated this early in the race.

Saying bad things about gay people doesn't eliminate you from the Republican primaries. It's practically required.


Personally, I wouldn't use "loonie", shorthand for lunatic, to refer to someone who is mentally ill. Delirious, psychotic, manic, mentally ill, and so on, but never loonie. I guess there is something to be said for using the common parlance, though. However, as soon as someone holds a complete bizarrely stupid opinion, they are quickly called insane, probably because people get comfort in the thought that the idiot opinion people are Something Else. Thus, any word used for them is quickly used as a synonym for mentally ill people, making it not-trivial to refer to them.

People with moronic ideas are most often perfectly sane. The error is not there.


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As a culture, we need to agree on a word that is recognized to mean "A person who holds ideas and advocates positions that are utterly divorced from reality, but is not necessarily mentally ill per se" that doesn't have the baggage, or can be separated from any remaining baggage, related to the oppression of mentally ill and neuro-atypical people.


I understand that some mammals can choose to breath. No, seriously, like dolphins, I think. They can choose to breath or not to breath. And some dolphins, I heard about, in captivity will choose not to breath and die. So they can choose to breath or die.

So, I suppose, like that, being gay could, maybe, be called a choice?


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Also, on a more "gaming" note:

I recently bought the D&D 5e Player's Handbook, and in the beginning of the Character Generation section, it contains a special shout-out to the LGBT community. Although it never actually mentions the word "transgender," it describes quite that in the "Visualizing Your Character" section, and even flat out says "Your character's sexual orientation is for you to decide."

This made me very happy.

Silver Crusade RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 32

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Actually, speaking of gender and sexuality choice, I read another interesting article recently on the matter:

No One Is Born Gay (Or Straight)


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thejeff wrote:
Kryzbyn wrote:
It's nice to see candidates eliminated this early in the race.

Saying bad things about gay people doesn't eliminate you from the Republican primaries. It's practically required.

Seeing as how I'm a Republican voter, it will matter for my vote.


Kryzbyn wrote:
thejeff wrote:
Kryzbyn wrote:
It's nice to see candidates eliminated this early in the race.
Saying bad things about gay people doesn't eliminate you from the Republican primaries. It's practically required.
Seeing as how I'm a Republican voter, it will matter for my vote.

Good luck.


mechaPoet wrote:

Actually, speaking of gender and sexuality choice, I read another interesting article recently on the matter:

No One Is Born Gay (Or Straight)

Wow. That was a good read.


thejeff wrote:
Kryzbyn wrote:
thejeff wrote:
Kryzbyn wrote:
It's nice to see candidates eliminated this early in the race.
Saying bad things about gay people doesn't eliminate you from the Republican primaries. It's practically required.
Seeing as how I'm a Republican voter, it will matter for my vote.
Good luck.

Good luck not voting for Ben Carson? Or remaining Republican with my point of view?


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Kryzbyn wrote:
thejeff wrote:
Kryzbyn wrote:
thejeff wrote:
Kryzbyn wrote:
It's nice to see candidates eliminated this early in the race.
Saying bad things about gay people doesn't eliminate you from the Republican primaries. It's practically required.
Seeing as how I'm a Republican voter, it will matter for my vote.
Good luck.
Good luck not voting for Ben Carson? Or remaining Republican with my point of view?

Having a Republican to vote for. At least in the presidential race.

Unless you're voting in early primary states, your chance of being able to vote for Carson, even if you wanted to, is very small.


I will not try to excuse that man as being 'crazy', because insanity likely has little to do with his decision and more to his gross intolerance for opposing views, as well as an appalling lack of Biblical doctrine.

It is people like that man that have held back society for thousands of years, because they just cannot accept that their religion tells them to love others, as opposed to the popular 'love others if they aren't this or this'. As a Christian myself, it is appalling that some people use religion as an excuse to act out their own hatreds, clearly ignoring passages that preach peace, love, and acceptance.

But that's how human society works, I suppose. Being a 'semi-bi guy', as I call myself since I am a male attracted to both females and MtFs, with lots of 'alternate orientation' friends living in the South, it is unfortunately quite commonplace to see this sort of attitude.

It amazes me that with all the legitimate evil going on in the world, people can take the time to target others who have alternate sexual orientations. People often ignore things like forced sex trafficking, rape, and murder and then turn around and say "Look, a homosexual/bisexual/ect! Where's my torch and pitchfork?!".


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Ehhh... How would someone who's attracted exclusively to women be bi?

Not to dictate what others call their sexuality, but it sounds really weird.

Contributor

mechaPoet wrote:

Actually, speaking of gender and sexuality choice, I read another interesting article recently on the matter:

No One Is Born Gay (Or Straight)

That article's grasp of the current scientific consensus is laughable. Study after study supports it being innate and fixed at or prior to birth.


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mechaPoet wrote:

Actually, speaking of gender and sexuality choice, I read another interesting article recently on the matter:

No One Is Born Gay (Or Straight)

This makes no attempt to actually support the thesis presented in the title. It attempts to critique the "born gay" position by accusing it of being a political rather than scientific position, and does not even address the studies that statistically link being gay with certain gene loci, birth order, and so forth.

It has two separate 'reasons' both labeled 'the science is wrong' but doesn't actually demonstrate that. It talks about a few studies with questionable methodology, and ignores the existence of many others. It mentions Simon LeVay, one of the preeminent researchers of the biological basis for sexual orientation, only in the context of a 1991 study finding a correlation between homosexual orientation and the size of the hypothalamus. Any writing that attempts to address this issue yet ignores his 2011 book Gay, Straight, and the Reason Why: The Science of Sexual Orientation is not credible, in my opinion.

This writer seems to hold the social constructionist view of science: i.e. that whatever results science seems to produce are just reflecting the current social biases about gender, sex, and so forth. While social bias is a factor, you can't just assert this about all research because correcting for social bias is a thing that researchers specifically try to do, so you have to critique individual studies and explain why they failed to sufficiently correct for social bias. If no sexual orientation research recognized the potential for bias, then you could make a sweeping critique, but that's not the case. Scientists know bias exists, and have ways that we think help prevent bias from skewing the results.

There's also a fallacy whose name I can't remember, so I'll call it the "You know who else did X? HITLER!" fallacy.

Quote:
This research will report that women are innately more sexually fluid than men, capable of being turned-on by almost anything and everything (hmmm…. other than in Lisa Diamond’s research, where have I seen that idea before? Ah yes, heterosexual pornography.)

I think the fallacy should be pretty obvious here. Tainting an idea with association with pornography doesn't actually serve to provide evidence against the idea.

I don't have time or energy to go through this point-by-point, but really -- there is a lot of evidence to indicate that we do NOT choose our orientations, and special pleading, handwaving, cherry-picking problematic research, and a golf-bag's worth of logical fallacies doesn't do anything to demonstrate otherwise.


Paladin of Baha-who? wrote:

...

There's also a fallacy whose name I can't remember, so I'll call it the "You know who else did X? HITLER!" fallacy. ...

If that isn't the name of the fallacy, it should be!


Todd Stewart wrote:
mechaPoet wrote:

Actually, speaking of gender and sexuality choice, I read another interesting article recently on the matter:

No One Is Born Gay (Or Straight)

That article's grasp of the current scientific consensus is laughable. Study after study supports it being innate and fixed at or prior to birth.

"But science is wrong!" is a common cry from some sectors.

Contributor

BigNorseWolf wrote:
Todd Stewart wrote:
mechaPoet wrote:

Actually, speaking of gender and sexuality choice, I read another interesting article recently on the matter:

No One Is Born Gay (Or Straight)

That article's grasp of the current scientific consensus is laughable. Study after study supports it being innate and fixed at or prior to birth.
"But science is wrong!" is a common cry from some sectors.

The same clique of thought of social influence is everything that allowed for Lysenko to flourish. It must gall them to find that empirical data shows for biological influence or outright determination in higher behavior across the animal kingdom. When an ideology runs up against falsifying evidence it dies, but in the meantime it draws out the most stubborn, ignorant defenders be it this, anti-vaxers, segregationists, misogynists, etc.


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True enough, Gaberlunzie! That's what I say, but some people, even those who are trans, suggest that I am bisexual. It's rather bizarre, but I suppose it has a lot to do with the attitudes around where I live, I suppose. Even those who are MtFs seem to view those attracted to them as bi, whether male or female. It's probably just a 'Sawnthern thang' lol.

Liberty's Edge

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Todd Stewart wrote:
The same clique of thought of social influence is everything that allowed for Lysenko to flourish. It must gall them to find that empirical data shows for biological influence or outright determination in higher behavior across the animal kingdom. When an ideology runs up against falsifying evidence it dies, but in the meantime it draws out the most stubborn, ignorant defenders be it this, anti-vaxers, segregationists, misogynists, etc.

True, but some good can come out of even the most bugshit anti-scince like Lysenko.

Look at the cute siberian fox kits!

Contributor

Krensky wrote:
Todd Stewart wrote:
The same clique of thought of social influence is everything that allowed for Lysenko to flourish. It must gall them to find that empirical data shows for biological influence or outright determination in higher behavior across the animal kingdom. When an ideology runs up against falsifying evidence it dies, but in the meantime it draws out the most stubborn, ignorant defenders be it this, anti-vaxers, segregationists, misogynists, etc.

True, but some good can come out of even the most bugshit anti-scince like Lysenko.

Look the cute siberian fox kits!

Belyaev and Trut did some fantastic genetics work on domestication and neotony. Belyaev was also seriously opposed to lysenkoism, which was a genuine risk to his career and life in the Stalinist era.

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