How does acrobatics+ crane style reduce the to hit penalty to 1? Crane style only reduces it to -2 and acrobatics doesn't reduce it at all, it just increases your AC bonus.
|
You know, as written, I don't know if Crane Style helps with melee touch spells.
Crane Wing says that it can 'deflect one melee attack per round that would normally hit you.' It goes on to say 'an attack so deflected deals no damage to you.'
RAW, Crane Wing negates the damage from one attack per round. If that attack does things other than damage - like, say, initiates a grapple or discharges a ghoul touch spell, I don't see that Crane Wing helps you.
How does acrobatics+ crane style reduce the to hit penalty to 1? Crane style only reduces it to -2 and acrobatics doesn't reduce it at all, it just increases your AC bonus.
You need all crane style feats. Crane riposte reduces the penalty to -1, thence -1/+4.
This is Varrel. A hexcrafter, he is about to reach 5th level and I'm strongly considering picking up crane style. He should be able to soak the fighting defensively penalty cause he has Arcane Accuracy.
I like the theme of the feats, just not sure if it's worth it compared.to extra Arcana....
I could go
5- Imp Unarmed Strike, Dodge
7-Crane Style
9- Crane Wing
11- Crane Riposte
Vs
5- Wpn Fcs: Scimitar, Extra Arcana- Hex arcana (flight)
7- Imp Familiar (Psycopomp)
9- Hex Arcana: Cackle, Power Attack
11- Wpn Spl or Lunge
Psycopomp are not that great compared to the other Improved familiar. They get speak with dead witch is not as awesome as Commune. Cassisian are by fare the strongest, if you can bare their attitude. Otherwise, Lyrakien or Paracletus makes better companion. Especially the paracletus, who gives you some bonus who stays relevant even when you become of high level. They are both also 10 times more cool then a masked parrot. Especially the lady with the harp.
On the crane wing on a magus, you have already a crapton of defensive option from your spells, like empowered Mirror Image for the lolz, and magus are short in feat given the fact that they have a broad range of option in witch to invest, like spells, straight combat, and manuvers, and even some crafting like scrolls. So i think you are better avoiding it.
Well I forgot about the bonus from snake style. 20 Wisdom is in my experience too high for level 10 (or any level). In order to have a viable monk, you have to absolutely max out STR and put your money in boosting STR. With PB 20 or lower you probably can go no higher than starting WIS 14. By lvl 10 you could have a +4 boost item on Wis (I assumed +2), making your WIS 18.
"20 at the very least" I can not agree too.
And another feat for skill focus? Why not just take crane style? Make a qinggong monk with barkskin and you reach AC 30+ (fighting def) easy at lvl 10. Buffed you hit 40 easy-peasy (whereas the snake style AC does not profit from buffs).
Snake style is just the worse choice.
Have to disagree with you about Snake style being the worse choice. Snake Style AC of mid 30s or higher by level 10 also applies to touch attacks and no need to fight defensively. It also lets you turn your unarmed attacks into piercing damage if required. IMHO, a pretty good feat overall.
Have to disagree with you about Snake style being the worse choice. Snake Style AC of mid 30s or higher by level 10 also applies to touch attacks and no need to fight defensively. It also lets you turn your unarmed attacks into piercing damage if required. IMHO, a pretty good feat overall.
The snake style AC applies to only one attack and has a heavy cost to max out.
Any monk will have a touch AC that is nearly as high as his regular one anyway.
Also: fighting defensively costs the crane style monk nearly nothing: just -1 to attack, and you get +4 AC for that. Thats a huge bonus.
The thing that snake style really has going for it is the AoO against any attack that misses.
Psycopomp are not that great compared to the other Improved familiar. They get speak with dead witch is not as awesome as Commune. Cassisian are by fare the strongest, if you can bare their attitude. Otherwise, Lyrakien or Paracletus makes better companion. Especially the paracletus, who gives you some bonus who stays relevant even when you become of high level. They are both also 10 times more cool then a masked parrot. Especially the lady with the harp.
On the crane wing on a magus, you have already a crapton of defensive option from your spells, like empowered Mirror Image for the lolz, and magus are short in feat given the fact that they have a broad range of option in witch to invest, like spells, straight combat, and manuvers, and even some crafting like scrolls. So i think you are better avoiding it.
I thought long and hard about the others you mention, but the Nosoi got the nod because:
Invisibility at WillCan use wands
Can be a Raven (current familiar is a Raven)
The Cassians aura is ok for the aura but easy too target the big flying helmet.
The boy/angel form could use wands but no at Will Invis.
Have to disagree with you about Snake style being the worse choice. Snake Style AC of mid 30s or higher by level 10 also applies to touch attacks and no need to fight defensively. It also lets you turn your unarmed attacks into piercing damage if required. IMHO, a pretty good feat overall.
The snake style AC applies to only one attack and has a heavy cost to max out.
The thing that snake style really has going for it is the AoO against any attack that misses.
Not that heavy, I don't think, it really depends on the character you're selecting it for - my Human Zen Archer has feats to spare and a Wisdom that's out of this world.
Also keep in mind, for the melee-minded - Snake Style gives a SECOND attack as an immediate action if the first AoO hits.
Not that heavy, I don't think, it really depends on the character you're selecting it for - my Human Zen Archer has feats to spare and a Wisdom that's out of this world.
Well, a three feat melee feat chain is kind of wasted on an dedicated archer build - but that may be just my opinion.
Okay, newish question:
Do Crane Wing and In Harm's Way work together? Can you intercept an attack made toward someone else and then deflect it?
Nope. In harm's way say you take the damage. If you don't take the damage then you are not using the feat.
Fighting defensively means that you need to attack. Not a great difference, but it's one.
Nope. In harm's way say you take the damage. If you don't take the damage then you are not using the feat.
That's what I said, but I wouldn't mind some corroborating opinions.
The argument is that the Crane let's you avoid damage from an attack that would normally hit you; In Harm's Way sort of says that, but not explicitly.
I will also add that if you have to use a feat in order to force yourself to get hit then that would nullify the "would normally hit you" phrase.
It is hard to argue that an attack against another person would normally hit you. If the phrase said "nullify an attack that would normally hit your AC" that would be different.
"one melee weapon attack"
Tail slap = natural attack, not melee weapon
Harm touch attack = touch attack, not melee weapon
Nat. 20 Vorpal = well, ya got me there
If someone has a natural attack, they are considered armed, as such, it is a weapon.
Any spell that makes a melee attack are weapons, touch attacks and rays, for instance, benefit from Weapon Finesse and Weapon Focus and rays benefit from Improved Critical (ray).
Also, the point with the colossal dragon is the absurdity of the attack. A creature that is so large, that it drops turds larger than you, smacks you with a weapon, and you simply auto-deflect it? Doesn't really make sense. Picture a Rune Giant, a Gargantuan creature. Now picture it wielding a Warhammer. The Warhammer is also going to be Gargantuan. The head of the Warhammer is going to be larger than your body. But you deflected it.
[Edit] Totally got ninja'd.
You know what else is absurd? Getting hit by a colossal dragon and not being turned into paste. Such is the price of playing an imaginary fantasy game. Sometimes, it takes some creative narrating to describe a mechanical benefit.
I don't think this feat is overpowered in the least. There are an absurd amount of offensive options in this game. The feat investment is speaking volumes about what the character wishes to accomplish with their character. Let them have their fun. I'm too tired to quote but someone above mentioned that players tend to plan based on what their dm throws at them. Encounter versatility is key. If the character with Crane Wing is dominating ask yourself how many of the following you have included in your encounters lately
Ambushes
Ranged Weapon users - Wat?! Were dey at in bestary? (Commonly avoided by DMs who don't prepare encounters but rather randomly flip open the book. If planning isn't your thing then say hello to the NPC Codex)
Magic Users
Multiple Opponents
Invisible characters
Feinting
Grappling
Tripping (Make them choose between getting up and fighting defensively)
As others have stated, sometimes fighting defensively isn't an option.