Use of pregen characters

[Xavier Goodewright]

Hello all,
Had a great time at Gencon played in a few of the modules. Came across an issue: me and some friends wanted to play the modules we played together. Unfortunately at the time my char was 4 one friend was 5 and our other buddy was 6 our higher lvl friend had to use a pregen in order to play with us. Not a big deal, but when something like that happen or when the only table available is at a different tier it would be nice to get a chronical sheet to apply to your character. I can understand the need to make sure the chars are within tier but provision should be made when you have to choose a pregen to play at that table.

Thanks

[Doug Doug]

I'm not sure if I understand the statement. It sounds like you guys are doing something against the rules the way your post reads. Before everyone jumps all over this, can you rephrase the statement and give us some more details? The way it reads is you and your friends played at GenCon together and then played one of the same scenarios again with some of the same characters. I'm probably reading something wrong. Thanks!

[Xavier Goodewright]

Doug Doug wrote:

I'm not sure if I understand the question. It sounds like you guys are doing something agaist the rules the way your post reads. Before everyone jumps all over this, can you rephrase the question and give us some more details? It would help identify the problem. Thanks!

Me and two friends played an event at Gencon. One of my friends' character was a higher level then the tier the table was being run at. I believe we we 4-5 and he is 6th. He was told that in order for him to play with us he would have to play a pregen char.

The question: if a person is required to play a pregen to fit the tier of the table because their char is too high lvl or (in my case at another event, to low) can that person receive the chronicle sheet for the adventure to apply to their char.

Thanks!

Edit: I think it was a 3-4 table because I was 3rd and one friend 5 and another 6th

[Doug Doug]

That sounds clearer. So here's the deal: The player "Chuck" has a 6th level PC. He may not play a Tier 1-5 scenario with that PC. That is what is referred to as "out of tier". Say all his friends are "within tier" (e.g. between levels 1-5). Chuck wants to play with his friends. He has two options. Option One, he can use a 4th level pre-gen and play for no credit in tier 4-5. Option Two, he can create a new 1st level PC and play to receive a Chronicle sheet for that character. So there is an option for Chuck to get credit.

The reason Chuck can't have any credit for playing the 4th level pre-gen is that pre-gens can't be advanced or altered. Pre-gens are throw-away characters meant to be used stictly for fun. There's a whole other conversation we could have about this, but the simplest answer is that if you want a Chronicle sheet then you need to make a new PC.

[Xavier Goodewright]

Doug Doug wrote:

That sounds clearer. So here's the deal: The player "Chuck" has a 6th level PC. He may not play a Tier 1-5 scenario with that PC. That is what is referred to as "out of tier". Say all his friends are "within tier" (e.g. between levels 1-5). Chuck wants to play with his friends. He has two options. Option One, he can use a 4th level pre-gen and play for no credit in tier 4-5. Option Two, he can create a new 1st level PC and play to receive a Chronicle sheet for that character. So there is an option for Chuck to get credit.

The reason Chuck can't have any credit for playing the 4th level pre-gen is that pre-gens can't be advanced or altered. Pre-gens are throw-away characters meant to be used stictly for fun. There's a whole other conversation we could have about this, but the simplest answer is that if you want a Chronicle sheet then you need to make a new PC.

Ok so what if the mod is a 1-7 and chuck Is in tier but the guy mustering is saying you can't play with your friends cause you are too high lvl so you have to play a pregen. Cause a 1st would be too LOW then. And is creating a char when an event has to be done within "x" amount of time a viable solution? I understand why you wouldn't want to give a chronicle sheet out but when I pay to play an adventure and I want to play it with my friends but am told I have to use a pregen because I'm to high/low and then penalized by not getting credit...

Btw I am just bringing this up because I saw alot of pregens used at Gencon. And what if I were new to the game? Why not let the guy use a pregen then after the game sit with the new person create a new 1st lvl an give him the chronicle for the tier appropriate to his new char. That way you encourage new people to play which is the goal right?

[Doug Doug]

The guy mustering Pathfinder Society tables at GenCon probably didn't know what he was talking about. I think he was kicked out of the Yu-gi-Oh! tournament and when he started standing on chairs people must have believed he was someone in authority.

Seriously, I can't attest to why you were told that at GenCon. If "Chuck" was 7th level and you & the others were 4th-5th level maybe he didn't want Chuck dragging your PCs up to the higher tiers and getting you all killed. I wasn't privy to the conversation so I don't want to make more assumptions than I already have.

Personally when a player walks up with a 1st level pre-gen and wants to play I offer him/her a Chronicle at the end of the scenario as long as they promise that by the time they sit down to play again they'll have an actual character made. That's not anywhere in the rules and I'm sure my peers here on the boards will take me to task for this practice. However, I am firm if you play a pre-gen other than 1st level you're playing for fun only.

[Xavier Goodewright]

Ok now try this example:

What if you are by yourself, your 7th level. The only table available to play (and you have a ticket for it) is a tier 1 because every one of the higher tiers are full. Do you turn me away? The option there is to play a pregen or create a new char. Is that fair? I don't think so. Where as an alternative is to play the pregen and get the credit on your 7th lvl. That seems fair.

[yoda8myhead]

Xavier Goodewright wrote:

Ok now try this example:

What if you are by yourself, your 7th level. The only table available to play (and you have a ticket for it) is a tier 1 because every one of the higher tiers are full. Do you turn me away? The option there is to play a pregen or create a new char. Is that fair? I don't think so. Where as an alternative is to play the pregen and get the credit on your 7th lvl. That seems fair.

That leaves the option for people to game the system and never play their own PC while leveling them up without risk of death. If you have a lvl 7 PC and the scenario offered is Tier 1-7, you play with whatever party that ends up making, even if everyone else is lvl 1 and you throw off the challange rating. It's not ideal, but it is what it is. You could also create a new 1st level PC to play in the lowest subtier and save your 7th level for a later scenario where s/he could play a more appropriately scaled scenario.

[DarkWhite]

Xavier Goodewright wrote:

Ok now try this example:

What if you are by yourself, your 7th level. The only table available to play (and you have a ticket for it) is a tier 1 because every one of the higher tiers are full. Do you turn me away? The option there is to play a pregen or create a new char. Is that fair? I don't think so. Where as an alternative is to play the pregen and get the credit on your 7th lvl. That seems fair.

If you (or your friend) have a 7th level character, you've obviously been playing Pathfinder Society for a while, and know how things work.

I understand players wanting to advance their primary character, but reality is, there won't always be enough players of your level to form a table each session, or the tables of your level may already be full.

I can't stress enough, and I include a footnote on every event page I write for an upcoming convention, that it's in the very best interests of players with higher level characters to bring a back-up low-level character so they always have a character appropriate for any level of play.

Pre-gen characters are available for players new to the game, or those that arrive unprepared, so players can get into the game quickly and not hold up the start of the game for everyone else. Only bringing a 7th level character to an event you may need to play at a lower level table is definitely arriving unprepared.

Secondary characters give you the opportunity of playing something you may not have tried before. Have a look through the Advanced Players Guide, for example.

High level play is rewarding, but don't dismiss opportunities for low-level play too. It's a great way to introduce new players (particularly friends) into the game.

Cheers,
DarkWhite

[DarkWhite]

Doug Doug wrote:

Personally when a player walks up with a 1st level pre-gen and wants to play I offer him/her a Chronicle at the end of the scenario as long as they promise that by the time they sit down to play again they'll have an actual character made. That's not anywhere in the rules and I'm sure my peers here on the boards will take me to task for this practice.

Doug Doug, you'll get no argument from me.

I encourage new players to start with a pre-gen, and file the serial numbers off - eg, give it a new name, swap out a feat, weapon or spell, to personalise it, make it their own.

If you're looking for a wider choice than Ezren, Merisiel, Seoni or Valeros, have a look through these created by Shisumo, one race for every class:

• Pathfinder Society Pregens for Pathfinder RPG
• Pathfinder Society Pregens for the Advanced Player's Guide

First-level pre-gens are a great way to get quickly into the game, and gain that credit for your first session. Once you've played a few sessions, and you've leveled the character up a level or two, you start making your own feat, weapon, spell choices, and it ceases being a pre-gen, it takes on a personality all your own.

As mentioned in the APG rebuild thread, Living Arcanis allowed characters to totally rebuild their character at any time before reaching 3rd level for this very reason. Most players don't, but it's a very handy allowance for new players who might feel they've been saddled with poor character choices made before they really understood the game.

Cheers,
DarkWhite

[Zizazat]

DarkWhite wrote:

I can't stress enough, and I include a footnote on every event page I write for an upcoming convention, that it's in the very best interests of players with higher level characters to bring a back-up low-level character so they always have a character appropriate for any level of play.

This.