Trip Weapon rule that makes sense.

[CountofUndolpho]

Having recently come across the changes to the use of weapons with trip etc in the FAQ - FAQ Page - first post under "Gear and Magic Items" and and the Blog Blog.

I find that I disagree with the new rules to such a degree that I'm going to have to homebrew a set instead. I use the Core Rule book at the moment though I dip into APG for occasional rules.

I'm working from the following premises:

A Trip can be made either armed or unarmed (Leg Sweep or such).

Trip Weapons should give a positive advantage to the attempt.

As per the present FAQ the only difference between tripping someone with a scythe and a punching dagger is you can drop the scythe if you fail the attempt by 10 or more. Whilst not expecting realism, the mental hijinks I have to go through to rationalise a dagger trip, are just too extreme; especially to make it as easy and as effective as a big hook on a handle.

I've thought about allowing all weapons but at non-proficient if non-trip; But - if you were to exclude daggers etc how would you do it - all light weapons? What about the hand axe or pick? You see the dilemma!

Does anyone have any play tested house rules for trip weapons? At present I'm leaning towards the original "only Trip weapons and unarmed can Trip" as being the easiest to play.

Cheers
The Count

[BigNorseWolf]

Only trip weapons can trip.

Unarmed strike is a trip weapon

Characters with improved trip are considered armed, but if they do not otherwise threaten squares around them they can only trip with their attacks of opportunity.

[CountofUndolpho]

Only problem with unarmed strike as a trip weapon - you can't drop it if you fail by 10 or more. The dropping the weapon rule only makes sense if it's only unarmed strike or trip weapons that you can use.

Otherwise it's definitely what I'm tending towards at the moment.

[ayronc]

I have to agree that I don't like the "catch-all" nature of the FAQ entry for this. Here is my "homebrew" version.

Trip Weapons

Normally Trip attempts are made without a weapon. Weapons which have the Trip quality, however, can be used when making a trip attempt and pass on their relevant bonuses to the CMB -- such as Weapon Focus, Magical Enhancements, Masterwork.

A Trip weapon can also be dropped in the event of a failed attempt which would normally see the attacker knocked prone -- a failure by 10 or more. The exception to this is Unarmed Strike which can be used as a Trip weapon for applying bonuses and enhancements, but may not be dropped to avoid being knocked prone.

[CountofUndolpho]

I can't come up with anyway of allowing other weapons to trip with a penalty and that makes sort of sense! Closest would be one hand weapons and up but it still grates.

I think it's easiest not to bother!

[ayronc]

As far as I'm concerned only weapons with Trip as a quality can be used when trying to trip.

If a longsword or dagger is being held while attempting a trip then the trip attempt is made with a leg or the off-hand (if there is one) etc and there is no benefit gained from the weapon being held (they're lucky to not be penalised...)