I don't like the way that it works out going back to the PF-style flurry, so I am going to change it back again, I think, to the way I originally had it.
Master Arminas
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For the truly exemplary, martial skill transcends the battlefield--it is a lifestyle, a doctrine, a state of mind. These warrior-artists search out methods of battle beyond swords and shields, finding within themselves weapons that are just as capable of crippling or killing as any blade. These monks (so called since they adhere to strict martial disciplines and ancient philosophies passed down through the generations since the mythical War between Law and Chaos) elevate their bodies to become weapons of war. Monks tread the path of discipline and self-enlightenment, and those with the will to endure that path discover within themselves not what they are, but what they are meant to be.
Role: This version of the monk class is, first and foremost, a skirmisher. Sharing the same BAB as the cleric and rogue, a monk character relies upon his incredible feats of agility and combat movement to handily cross the battlefield to where he is most needed. He can set up flanks for the rogue with ease, rush to a dying comrade and (in the same round) dimension door the unlucky hero to the cleric for healing. But he is no slouch in the combat arena. Although no match for a dedicated fighter in terms of his attack bonus, he is able (under the right conditions) to get as many as eight attacks, six of which he can make at his highest BAB. He can even make those six attacks (again, under ideal conditions) while moving. And when those attacks do connect, the monk can inflict some hefty damage, especially against foes that aligned with chaos.
But the monk can do still more, for he has a good selection of skills at his disposal, and his high Wisdom score allows him to serve as the party’s eyes and ears. Combined with Stealth, the monk makes for an excellent scout that can probe ahead of the party in the dark places of the world. His endurance and ability to sustain hardship is legendary, rivaled only by the toughest of barbarians and most skilled of rangers. The varied selection of skills and talents that the monk has at his disposal make a valued member of any adventuring party.
Alignment: Any lawful.
Hit Die: d8.
BAB: Medium
Good Saves: Fort; Reflex; and Will
Class Skills: Acrobatics (Dex); Climb (Str); Craft (Int); Diplomacy (Cha); Escape Artist (Dex); Knowledge (History) (Int); Knowledge (Religion) (Int); Perception (Wis); Perform (Cha); Profession (Wis), Ride (Dex); Sense Motive (Wis); Stealth (Dex); and Swim (Str).
Skill Ranks per Level: 4 + Int modifier.
Weapons and Armor Proficiency: A monk is proficient with all simple weapons, with the exception of the heavy crossbow, heavy mace, long spear, morning star, and spear. Monks are not proficient with any armor or shields. When wearing armor, using a shield, or carrying a medium or heavy load, a monk loses his AC bonus, as well as his fast movement and flurry of blows abilities.
AC Bonus (Ex): When unarmored and unencumbered, the monk adds his Wisdom bonus (if any) to his AC and his CMD. In addition, a monk gains a +1 bonus to AC and CMD at 4th level. This bonus increases by 1 for every four monk levels thereafter, up to a maximum of +5 at 20th level.
These bonuses to AC apply even against touch attacks or when the monk is flat-footed. He loses these bonuses when he is immobilized or helpless, when he wears any armor, when he uses a shield, or when he carries a medium or heavy load.
Bonus Feat: At 1st level, 2nd level, and every 4 levels gained as a monk thereafter, a monk may select a bonus feat. These feats must be taken from the following list: Combat Reflexes, Deflect Arrows, Dodge, Improved Grapple, Improved Sunder, and Weapon Focus.
At 6th level, the following feats are added to the list: Improved Bull Rush, Improved Disarm, Improved Trip, Ki Stand, Mobility, and Weapon Specialization.
At 10th level, the following feats are added to the list: Greater Weapon Focus, Improved Critical, Medusa’s Wrath, Snatch Arrows, and Spring Attack. A monk need not have any of the prerequisites normally required for these feats to select them.
Fast Movement (Ex/Su): A monk’s land speed is faster than the norm for his race by +10 feet. This benefit only applies when he is wearing no armor and is not carrying a medium or heavy load. This bonus stacks with any other bonuses to the monk’s land speed (such as the effects of an expeditious retreat spell, a haste spell, or any other effect that increases a monk’s speed). This ability is extraordinary.
At 4th level, when a monk gains access to his ki pool (see below), the character can achieve literally superhuman bursts of speed for limited periods of time. As a free action, a monk can spend 1 point of ki to increase his speed by +20 feet. This speed increase lasts for 1 round per monk class level and is a supernatural ability. At 6th level, and again every two levels gained thereafter, the monk's speed when using this ability increases by an additional +5 feet, to a maximum increase of +60 feet at 20th level.
The bonus speed granted to a monk through the use of this ability is a supernatural ability and is not considered to be an enhancement bonus.
Unarmed Strike (Ex): A monk gains Improved Unarmed Strike as a bonus feat. A monk’s unarmed attack may be made with his fists, elbows, knees, feet, or even his head. This means that a monk may make unarmed strikes with his hands full. There is no such thing as an off-hand attack for a monk striking unarmed. A monk may thus apply his full Strength bonus on damage rolls for all his unarmed strikes.
Usually a monk’s unarmed strikes deal lethal damage, but he can choose to deal nonlethal damage instead with no penalty on his attack roll. He has the same choice to deal lethal or nonlethal damage while grappling.
A monk deals more damage with his unarmed strikes than normal; from 1st-3rd level the damage is 1d6. This increases to 2d4 at 4th level. At 8th level, and every 4 monk levels gained thereafter, the damage increases by an additional 1d4, to a maximum of 6d4 at 20th level. The unarmed damage is for all monks, regardless of size. The techniques a monk learns do not alter the base damage of the class due to being either smaller or larger, although both Strength bonuses and penalties apply as normal.
Stunning Fist (Ex): The monk gains Stunning Fist as a bonus feat, even if he does not meet the prerequisites. At 4th level, and every 4 levels gained as a monk thereafter, the monk gains the ability to apply a new condition to the target of his Stunning Fist. This condition replaces stunning the target for 1 round, and a successful saving throw still negates the effect.
At 4th level, he can choose to make the target fatigued. At 8th level, he can make the target sickened for 1 minute. At 12th level, he can make the target staggered for 1d6+1 rounds. At 16th level, he can permanently blind or deafen the target. At 20th level, he can paralyze the target for 1d6+1 rounds. The monk must choose which condition will apply before the attack roll is made. These effects do not stack with themselves (a creature sickened by Stunning Fist cannot become nauseated if hit by Stunning Fist again), but additional hits do increase the duration.
A monk gains one use of this feat for every monk level he possesses, as described in the Stunning Fist feat.
Evasion (Ex): At 2nd level or higher, a monk can avoid damage from many area-effect attacks. If a monk makes a successful Reflex saving throw against an attack that normally deals half damage on a successful save, he instead takes no damage. Evasion can be used only if a monk is wearing no armor and is not carrying a medium or heavy load. A helpless monk does not gain the benefit of evasion.
Flurry of Blows (Ex): At 3rd level, a monk gains the ability to make a flurry of blows. When using unarmed strikes, simple melee weapons with which he is proficient, or darts a monk can make a flurry of blows attack. Flurry of blows can be added to either a standard attack or a full-attack; in either case, flurry of blows is not an action itself. When using this ability a monk may make one additional attack using any combination of unarmed strikes or weapons at his highest base attack bonus. However, this attack, as well as all others made by the monk in that round, suffers a penalty of -2 to hit.
At 8th level, the penalty on his attacks decreases to -1.
At 10th level, the monk gains a second bonus attack at his highest base attack bonus when making a flurry of blows attack.
At 13th level, the monk no longer suffers a penalty on attacks.
A monk applies his full Strength bonus to his damage rolls for all successful attacks made with a flurry of blows, whether the attacks are made with an off-hand or with a weapon wielded in both hands. A monk may freely substitute disarm, sunder, and trip combat maneuvers for unarmed attacks as part of a flurry of blows. A monk with natural weapons cannot use such weapons as part of a flurry of blows, nor can he make natural attacks in addition to his flurry of blows attacks.
Flurry of blows cannot be combined with two-weapon fighting (as per the feats) for additional attacks, even if the monk wields two weapons while making a flurry of blows attack. The penalties (if any) given above replace those normally associated with two-weapon fighting when the monk is making a flurry of blows attack only.
Maneuver Training (Ex): At 3rd level, a monk uses his monk level in place of his base attack bonus when calculating his Combat Maneuver Bonus and his Combat Maneuver Defense. Base attack bonuses granted from other classes are unaffected and are added normally.
Still Mind (Ex): A monk of 3rd level or higher gains a +2 bonus on saving throws against enchantment spells and effects. This bonus increases to +4 at 10th level and to +6 at 17th level.
Ki Pool (Su): At 4th level, a monk begins to slowly access his internal ki, a supernatural energy that he can use to accomplish amazing feats. The monk gains a pool of ki points, equal to his monk level + his Wisdom modifier. By spending 1 point from his ki pool as a swift action, a monk can invoke any one of the following options: he can gain a +4 dodge bonus to AC for 1 round; he can gain a +4 insight bonus to his attacks for 1 round; he can gain a +4 insight bonus to his damage for 1 round; or he can gain one additional attack at his highest base attack bonus when he uses his flurry of blows ability (see above).
A monk gains additional powers that consume points from his ki pool as he gains levels. The ki pool is replenished each morning after 8 hours of rest or meditation; these hours do not need to be consecutive.
Ki Strike (Su): At 4th level, a monk can focus his ki into his unarmed strikes, making them the equivalent of enchanted weapons. When first gained, the monk gains a +1 enhancement bonus to hit and damage. At 8th level, and every 4 levels gained thereafter as a monk, this bonus increases by +1, to a maximum of +5 at 20th level. A monk’s unarmed strikes are considered magic weapons for the purpose of attacking incorporeal creatures and for overcoming damage reduction.
At 12th level, a monk’s unarmed strikes count as alchemical silver and cold iron weapons for the purposes of overcoming damage reduction.
At 16th level, a monk’s unarmed strikes count as adamantine for the purposes of overcoming damage reduction.
At 20th level, a monk’s unarmed strikes bypass any alignment based damage reduction.
Catfall (Su): At 4th level or higher, a monk can fall incredible distances without suffering damage. When falling, a monk always lands on his feet. In addition, he reduces the damage inflicted from a fall by 1d6 per monk level he possesses, to a maximum reduction of 20d6 at 20th level. Unlike magical spells (such as feather fall) with similar effects, a monk is not slowed during his descent, making this ability a favored method for higher level monks to rapidly descend great distances quickly.
Agility Training (Ex): At 5th level, a monk adds one-half his level (round down) to all Acrobatics and Climb skill checks. In addition, he always counts as having a running start when making jump checks using Acrobatics. By spending 1 point from his ki pool as a swift action, a monk can gain an additional +20 bonus on Acrobatics checks made to jump for 1 round.
Purity of Body (Ex): At 5th level, a monk gains immunity to all diseases, including supernatural and magical diseases (such as lycanthropy and mummy rot).
Servant of Order (Su): At 6th level, a monk deals an additional 1d6 points of damage with his unarmed strikes against chaotic-aligned creatures. This additional damage is not multiplied on a critical hit.
Speak with Animals (Ex): At 6th level, a monk can converse with any creature of the animal type, as per the spell speak with animals. Such conversations are limited by the animal’s intelligence (or lack thereof).
Wholeness of Body (Su): At 7th level or higher, a monk can heal his own wounds as a standard action. He can expend 1 point from his ki pool to heal a number of hit points of damage equal to 2d8 + his monk level + his Wisdom bonus (if any).
Spiritual Endurance (Ex): At 8th level, a monk's training and inner reserves of ki allow him to comfortably exist in environments and conditions that would quickly sap the strength from others. He is considered to be under the influence of an endure elements spell at all times, ignoring the extremes of heat and cold. In addition, he may go for a number of days equal to one-half his monk level without eating or drinking before beginning to suffer adverse effects. He requires only four hours of sleep per night, provided that he also meditates for at least four hours as well. While meditating, a monk remains fully aware of his surroundings and may make Perception checks without penalty.
Improved Evasion (Ex): At 9th level, a monk’s evasion ability improves. He still takes no damage on a successful Reflex saving throw against attacks, but henceforth he takes only half damage on a failed save. A helpless monk does not gain the benefit of improved evasion.
Duty Never Tires (Ex): At 10th level, a monk gains Endurance as a bonus feat. Furthermore, by spending 1 ki point as a swift action, he can ignore the effects of fatigue for 10 minutes per monk level.
Touch of Law (Su): At 10th level, a monk’s unarmed strikes are treated as lawful weapons for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction.
Diamond Body (Ex): At 11th level, a monk gains immunity to poisons of all kinds.
Abundant Step (Su): At 12th level or higher, a monk can slip magically between spaces, as if using the spell dimension door. Using this ability is a move action that consumes 2 points from his ki pool. His caster level for this effect is equal to his monk level. Unlike the normal use of dimension door, the monk may take any remaining actions in a round after using this ability. He may take up to one willing creature with him when he uses this ability.
Unfettered Speech (Ex): At 12th level, a monk can converse with any creature of the plant type, as per the spell speak with plants. Such conversations are limited by the plant’s intelligence (or lack thereof). A monk can also converse with any creature of the magical beast type that has an Intelligence score of 1 or 2 (for the purpose of this ability, treat magical beasts as though they are animals and refer to the spell speak with animals).
Diamond Soul (Ex): At 13th level, a monk gains spell resistance equal to his current monk level +11. In order to affect the monk with a spell, a spellcaster must get a result on a caster level check (1d20 + caster level) that equals or exceeds the monk’s spell resistance.
Champion of Order (Su): At 14th level, a monk deals an additional 1d6 points of damage with his unarmed strikes against chaotic-aligned creatures. This stacks with the bonus damage granted by the servant of order ability, for a total of +2d6 bonus damage. This additional damage is not multiplied on a critical hit.
Quivering Palm (Su): Starting at 15th level, a monk can set up vibrations within the body of another creature that can thereafter be fatal if the monk so desires. He can use this quivering palm attack once per day, and he must announce his intent before making his attack roll. Creatures immune to critical hits cannot be affected. Otherwise, if the monk strikes successfully and the target takes damage from the blow, the quivering palm attack succeeds. Thereafter, the monk can try to slay the victim at any later time, as long as the attempt is made within a number of days equal to his monk level. To make such an attempt, the monk merely wills the target to die (a free action), and unless the target makes a Fortitude saving throw (DC 10 + ½ the monk’s level + the monk’s Wisdom modifier) it dies. If the saving throw is successful, the target instead takes twice the damage of the monk's unarmed strike (as if the monk had threatened and then confirmed a critical hit) and the quivering palm attack ends; the target may still die if he suffers enough damage from this attack to reduce him to negative hit points equal to his Constitution score. A monk can have no more than one quivering palm in effect at one time. If a monk uses quivering palm while another is still in effect, the previous effect is negated. This ability is a death effect.
Adamantine Touch (Su): At 16th level, a monk’s unarmed strikes are treated as adamantine weapons for bypassing hardness.
Timeless Body (Ex): At 17th level, a monk no longer takes penalties to his ability scores to his physical ability scores for aging and cannot be magically aged. Any such penalties that he has already taken, however, remain in place. The initial roll made by the DM for the character’s maximum age (according to race) is discarded, and a new maximum age calculated. The random dice are maximized. For example, a human monk who reaches 17th level will live to a ripe old age of 110 years, while an elf monk could see 750 years. Age bonuses to the monk’s mental ability scores still accrue, and the monk still dies of old age when his time is up. This ability is not the same as immortality, and the monk can always die before his time due to violence.
Tongues (Ex): At 17th level, a monk can converse with any creature, as per the spell tongues. To communicate, a creature must be within 30 feet of the monk and both the monk and creature must have line-of-sight to each other.
Stalwart Soul (Ex): At 18th level, a monk no longer suffers any penalties for being fatigued (he still remains fatigued, however, for purposes of exhaustion). If the monk becomes exhausted, he may spend 2 ki points as a swift action to ignore the effects of exhaustion for 1 minute per monk level.
Empty Body (Su): At 19th level, a monk gains the ability to assume an ethereal state for 1 minute as though using the spell etherealness. Using this ability is a move action that consumes 3 points from his ki pool. This ability only affects the monk and cannot be used to make other creatures ethereal.
Perfect Self: At 20th level, a monk transcends his mortal limitations. He gains blindsight in a 30-foot radius. He gains immunity versus mind-affecting spells, spell-like abilities, and other effects (this replaces and does not stack with the still mind ability), as well as being the recipient of constant nondetection and undetectable alignment effects (as per the spells). Additionally, the monk gains damage reduction 10/chaotic, which allows him to ignore the first 10 points of damage from any attack made by a nonchaotic weapon or by any natural attack made by a creature that doesn’t have similar damage reduction. Whenever a monk who has attained perfect self confirms a critical strike with an unarmed attack against a chaotic-aligned creature, he deals an additional 1d10 points of damage.
The few monks who reach this level of achievement often retire from adventuring to explore what they are becoming. Only those with the strongest of ties to their companions and their homelands remain, but even these will eventually simply vanish one night, never to return.
Ex-Monks: A monk who becomes nonlawful cannot gain new levels as a monk but retains all monk abilities.
Thought I would link this to the thread: Strictures and Morals.
This is the in-character code of the Order of the Ebon Rose monastic order in my campaigns. Founded by Arminas tar Valantil, the Order lives by these strictures, which serves as a guide and code to their conduct.
Hope that you enjoy them!
Master Arminas
Dotting. Will Comment Later.
Revised Pathfinder Monk
I don't find this version of the monk to be a big improvement.
The following things need to be changed about the monk imo.
1) There aren't enough options: I want options, like the Oracle or Barbarian have. Archetypes should contain the basic features of the archetype, but beyond that I want a lot of options. Every monk shouldn't be able to flurry (some should hit slow and hard), fall long distances, have increased unarmed damage, have fast movement, or have Evasion. (Almost everything should be an option).
2) Monk Abilities: Non-monks shouldn't be able to get feats like Stunning Fist and Deflect Arrows, they should be part of the options you pick when you make a monk.
3) Bonus Feats: At levels 1-2, there should be more bonus feats to select from, and the bonus feats should be better and keep up with other classes (like Fighters). For example, at levels 1-2 Improved Trip / Bullrush / Disarm should be available. At level 6+, Greater Trip / Bullrush / Disarm should be available.
Until the bonus feats are fixed, monks will always be behind the curve compared to other classes, even though they're supposed to be masters of these maneuvers!
4) Ki: Should be earlier, like the ninja. To me, this is a core part of the class. And ki should not be available if you wear armor either.
5) Magic Items: The pricing for monk magic items is higher compared to the cost for other classes. For example, Bracers of Armor +1 should have the same cost as magic armor +1. It's bad enough that you lose your neck slot (can't have Amulet of Natural Armor), but the cost of an Amulet of Fists is also very inappropriate considering it's exactly like a magical weapon (5000g compared to 2000g, it's twice as much!).
Although this has no effect in a home campaign, this has an effect on organized play.
There are other things, but your new monk is pretty much like the base monk and doesn't address any of my issues I have with the class.
like quite a lot of what you've done, but I dislike a few things to. Why did you give monks the ability to talk with animals or plants?
Back to speak with animals/speak with plants again! lol. Check the posts on Pages 1 and 2 for a complete discussion of SwA/SwP. But, in short, ShadowCatX, the monk class--as written for Pathfinder and 3.5--has Tongue of the Sun and Moon late in the class development (17th level). Whereas the original AD&D monk only possessed speak with animals (at low levels, around 4th or 5th if I remembering correctly). When the article on monks (He's Got a Lot to Kick About) appeared in Dragon magazine (was it #53?), that monk retained the speak with animals and also added speak with plants at a higher level.
What I tried to do was to blend these various versions of the monk together; to make the class a fusion of the best of the original monk and the more recent class models from Wizards and Paizo. While keeping the 17th level Tongues ability, the earlier Speak with Animals and then Speak with Plants (actually Unfettered Speech in my version above, which includes magical beasts) thus represents a progression of being able to speak with other beings rather than a 17th level monk suddenly being able to communicate with everything.
Hope that answers your question.
Master Arminas
I don't find this version of the monk to be a big improvement.
The following things need to be changed about the monk imo.
1) There aren't enough options: I want options, like the Oracle or Barbarian have. Archetypes should contain the basic features of the archetype, but beyond that I want a lot of options. Every monk shouldn't be able to flurry (some should hit slow and hard), fall long distances, have increased unarmed damage, have fast movement, or have Evasion. (Almost everything should be an option).
And many people feel the same as you. I don't. I believe that the monk class should be a highly structured class, and while I understand that can make some folks unhappy, I just have to say if you want options play a fighter. Or a rogue. Or a ninja. But if you play a monk, it stands to reason that you should be a monk.
2) Monk Abilities: Non-monks shouldn't be able to get feats like Stunning Fist and Deflect Arrows, they should be part of the options you pick when you make a monk.
Nothing I can do about this. They are general feats available to everyone in Pathfinder.
3) Bonus Feats: At levels 1-2, there should be more bonus feats to select from, and the bonus feats should be better and keep up with other classes (like Fighters). For example, at levels 1-2 Improved Trip / Bullrush / Disarm should be available. At level 6+, Greater Trip / Bullrush / Disarm should be available.
Until the bonus feats are fixed, monks will always be behind the curve compared to other classes, even though they're supposed to be masters of these maneuvers!
I did expand the allowed bonus feats and included some feats that are fighter only. Don't forget, the monk has another 10-11 feats that he can use to get the Greater Maneuver chains. And please don't say that isn't fair because the monk has to take Combat Expertise as a prerequisite! It just means you can't dump Int, which is a good thing.
4) Ki: Should be earlier, like the ninja. To me, this is a core part of the class. And ki should not be available if you wear armor either.
Gets it at the same level as the Pathfinder monk. And my class gets more ki points (1 point per level + Wisdom modifier instead of 1/2 point per level + Wisdom modifier). Well, if you are wearing armor as a monk you are already screwing yourself, losing class AC bonus (which includes Wisdom to AC and your bonuses to CMD), fast movement, and flurry of blows.
5) Magic Items: The pricing for monk magic items is higher compared to the cost for other classes. For example, Bracers of Armor +1 should have the same cost as magic armor +1. It's bad enough that you lose your neck slot (can't have Amulet of Natural Armor), but the cost of an Amulet of Fists is also very inappropriate considering it's exactly like a magical weapon (5000g compared to 2000g, it's twice as much!).
Although this has no effect in a home campaign, this has an effect on organized play.
There are other things, but your new monk is pretty much like the base monk and doesn't address any of my issues I have with the class.
Did you even read the final version (top of Page 3)? I specifically refer to ki strike:
Ki Strike (Su): At 4th level, a monk can focus his ki into his unarmed strikes, making them the equivalent of enchanted weapons. When first gained, the monk gains a +1 enhancement bonus to hit and damage. At 8th level, and every 4 levels gained thereafter as a monk, this bonus increases by +1, to a maximum of +5 at 20th level. A monk’s unarmed strikes are considered magic weapons for the purpose of attacking incorporeal creatures and for overcoming damage reduction.
At 12th level, a monk’s unarmed strikes count as alchemical silver and cold iron weapons for the purposes of overcoming damage reduction.
At 16th level, a monk’s unarmed strikes count as adamantine for the purposes of overcoming damage reduction.
At 20th level, a monk’s unarmed strikes bypass any alignment based damage reduction.
Hmmmm? Looks like you will not be needing that pricey amulet of mighty fists after all. So, with this monk you can wear that amulet of natural armor. And last time I checked, bracers of armor are priced identically to magical armor. Sorry that you don't like this version, but perhaps you need to actually read and not just skim. That is only a suggestion, friend.
Master Arminas
I like it.
I really like it.
Extra props for hardwiring the rules of overcoming DR via a "+" weapon for the people who are unaware of that rule.
My only problem is the fistfulls, nay, BAGFULLS of d4's that you'll be throwing around. With an electronic dice roller, this is easy, but in the midst of game it's "chuka, chuka, chuka, CRUNGLE!"
If I might make a suggestion...
With flurry :
Flurry of Blows (Ex): At 3rd level, a monk gains the ability to make a flurry of blows. When using unarmed strikes the monk can make a flurry of blows attack. Flurry of blows can be added to either a standard attack or a full-attack; in either case, flurry of blows is not an action itself. When using this ability a monk may make one additional attack using any combination of unarmed strikes at his highest base attack bonus. However, this attack, as well as all others made by the monk in that round, suffers a penalty of -2 to hit.
At 8th level, the penalty on his attacks decreases to -1.
At 10th level, the monk gains a second bonus attack at his highest base attack bonus when making a flurry of blows attack.
At 13th level, the monk no longer suffers a penalty on attacks.
A monk applies his full Strength bonus to his damage rolls for all successful attacks made with a flurry of blows, and the monk is not considered to have an off-hand for these attacks. A monk may freely substitute disarm, sunder, and trip combat maneuvers for unarmed attacks as part of a flurry of blows. A monk with natural weapons cannot use such weapons cannot make natural attacks in addition to his flurry of blows attacks.
Flurry of blows cannot be combined with two-weapon fighting (as per the feats) for additional attacks, even if the monk wields two weapons while making a flurry of blows attack. The penalties (if any) given above replace those normally associated with two-weapon fighting when the monk is making a flurry of blows attack only.
Weapon Flurry (Ex) : At fourth level, and every four additional levels beyond a Monk may select one melee or ranged weapon which he is proficient with (The monk must be able to reload ammunition as a free action to flurry with a ranged weapon) and he may make a Flurry with that weapon. The monk uses either his unarmed attack damage, or the weapon's normal damage, whichever he prefers. If he uses his unarmed attack damage, he uses his unarmed attack critical threat range as well. The monk may flurry with a weapon in each hand, and the weapon gains the monk's normal strength modifier to damage for all hits. A monk may select a specific type of natural attack (claws, bite, etc) to flurry with as if it were a weapon, using the above rules.
ThatEvilGuy: Glad you enjoyed it! Hahahahah. Yes, the old bag full of d4's; I remember it well from my first edition days (when I was introduced to a monk). You only need six though, just roll for each attack that hits (if every thing hits AND you spent a point of ki AND you got the extra attacks from Medusa's Wrath, that is only 48d4+40+(8xStr mod) after all).
GREAT GHU! That's a lot of dice! (Just kidding).
MDT, that is definately interesting, and I might do something very similar with a weapon-monk archetype for this revision. Kudo's, though for it is VERY NICE.
Master Arminas
Play an unarmed fighter, call it a monk. Voila, everything's fixed.
Not really. A fighter won't have many of the special abilities a monk should have. One of key attributes that defines a monk is that they don't wear armor. A fighter without armor compared to a monk is at a great disadvantage. And I'm sorry you don't like my POV, I was responding to the OP, not you, rude person.
And many people feel the same as you. I don't. I believe that the monk class should be a highly structured class, and while I understand that can make some folks unhappy, I just have to say if you want options play a fighter. Or a rogue. Or a ninja. But if you play a monk, it stands to reason that you should be a monk
Well, you see, a monk means many things to many people. Sure, the classic monk is the typical "kung fu" monk, but it doesn't represent the other very different types of monks.
Here's a silly example. Kung Fu Panda. He certainly wasn't the stereotype, but he was still a monk. There are a lot of different types of monks in fiction, but I'm not going to list them all. That's where options (or perhaps archetypes) come in.
You prefer to tweak where I'd rather Paizo do a rewrite.
I did expand the allowed bonus feats and included some feats that are fighter only. Don't forget, the monk has another 10-11 feats that he can use to get the Greater Maneuver chains. And please don't say that isn't fair because the monk has to take Combat Expertise as a prerequisite! It just means you can't dump Int, which is a good thing.
Monks are supposed to be good at maneuvers, despite their intelligence, yet the way the bonus feats are structured, if they want to be good at maneuvers, they will never use their bonus feats to do so.
I find that in fiction and movies, not all monks are smart, yet many of them are masters of maneuvers, so making them have a high Int to do so clashes with classical depictions imo.
In addition, it's somewhat helpful for monks to have an average Int, because Monks are already very demanding on several stats already.
No I didn't read everyone else comments or the fact you made the monk's hand magical weapons. That's a powerful buff.
Good points, Jason S. I would just like to respond to the concept of maneuver master. With the maneuver training ability, showing here:
Maneuver Training (Ex): At 3rd level, a monk uses his monk level in place of his base attack bonus when calculating his Combat Maneuver Bonus and his Combat Maneuver Defense. Base attack bonuses granted from other classes are unaffected and are added normally.
A monk has the same BAB as a fighter, paladin, barbarian, or ranger when using combat maneuvers. Improved Bull Rush, Improved Disarm, Improved Grapple, Improved Sunder, and Improved Trip are all on the monk bonus list. The only ones they don't get are Improved Feint and Improved Overrun. So the monk doesn't need the prerequsites for those. Each of them give a +2 to perform the maneuver and defend against that maneuver.
Greater ususally gives another +2 as well. Just having a 2-point difference is not bad for a class that is not a pure martial class. Yes, you have to have a 13 Int to get Greater Disarm and Greater Trip, but Str 13 and Power Attack qualifies for Greater Bull Rush and Greater Sunder. A straight monk meets the qualifications for Greater Grapple as is.
Sure, those classes will probably have a higher Strength modifier than the monk; of course you could always go with a high-Dex build and use Agile Maneuvers. I wouldn't recommend it, but you could. And don't forget, if you are using a weapon that is able to perform that maneuver, you can add weapon focus, greater weapon focus, and your enhancement bonus to the CMB and CMD for that maneuver. Your body is a weapon (unarmed strike) with which you can Bull Rush, Disarm, Grapple, Overrun, Sunder, and Trip.
So, if you take Weapon Focus (unarmed) and Greater Weapon Focus (unarmed), you've got the same bonus as if you had the Greater Maneuver Feat. The enhancement bonus on your unarmed strikes also adds to your total. AND you can STILL take the Greater Maneuver feat.
Really, I don't think there is as much distance between what my monk can do and what you want it do as you think there is.
Master Arminas
I love it. I'm going to critique a few things, throw some ideas around, and see what you think. I'm going to quote your entire thing, and ask you questions. I'm going to break my response into multiple responses, to help with an otherwise huge document. :)
Also, because of the way formatting works, I'm going to be reformatting (adding back in bold and italics and stuff) after-the-fact, because I can't just respond to the whole thing, sadly. Sorry if I get something wrong.
Hokay!
For the truly exemplary, martial skill transcends the battlefield--it is a lifestyle, a doctrine, a state of mind. These warrior-artists search out methods of battle beyond swords and shields, finding within themselves weapons that are just as capable of crippling or killing as any blade. These monks (so called since they adhere to strict martial disciplines and ancient philosophies passed down through the generations since the mythical War between Law and Chaos) elevate their bodies to become weapons of war. Monks tread the path of discipline and self-enlightenment, and those with the will to endure that path discover within themselves not what they are, but what they are meant to be.
Role: This version of the monk class is, first and foremost, a skirmisher. Sharing the same BAB as the cleric and rogue, a monk character relies upon his incredible feats of agility and combat movement to handily cross the battlefield to where he is most needed. He can set up flanks for the rogue with ease, rush to a dying comrade and (in the same round) dimension door the unlucky hero to the cleric for healing. But he is no slouch in the combat arena. Although no match for a dedicated fighter in terms of his attack bonus, he is able (under the right conditions) to get as many as eight attacks, six of which he can make at his highest BAB. He can even make those six attacks (again, under ideal conditions) while moving. And when those attacks do connect, the monk can inflict some hefty damage, especially against foes that aligned with chaos.
But the monk can do still more, for he has a good selection of skills at his disposal, and his high Wisdom score allows him to serve as the party’s eyes and ears. Combined with Stealth, the monk makes for an excellent scout that can probe ahead of the party in the dark places of the world. His endurance and ability to sustain hardship is legendary, rivaled only by the toughest of barbarians and most skilled of rangers. The varied selection of skills and talents that the monk has at his disposal make a valued member of any adventuring party.[b]Alignment[b]: Any lawful.
[b]Hit Die[b]: d8.
[b]BAB[b]: Medium
[b]Good Saves[b]: Fort; Reflex; and Will
All great so far. One of the things I think that you nailed about the monk is it's style. They've been painted as everything from a defensive workhorse (which they sort of are), to a melee specialist (which, again, they sort of are), to a stealth master (which, again, they sort of are), but really, what they've always wanted to be, as-written, is a skirmisher. I think this really works with that. While you acknowledge the other "roles" as well, you clarify their secondary nature, and that's good, too. Everything else is traditional, so that's nice.
Please note, I'm not asking you to change your master copy, yet. I'm dialoguing first!
Class Skills: Acrobatics (Dex); Climb (Str); Craft (Int); Diplomacy (Cha); Escape Artist (Dex); Knowledge (History) (Int); Knowledge (Religion) (Int); Perception (Wis); Perform (Cha); Profession (Wis), Ride (Dex); Sense Motive (Wis); Stealth (Dex); and Swim (Str).
Skill Ranks per Level: 4 + Int modifier.
Alright, I like the skills. They're great. I understand the desire to avoid granting too many skills, so I'm not sure what's the best thing. A few other nitpicks/questions, though:
* I know it was discussed earlier, but I'm not certain that intimidate really should have been taken off the list. While few heroes (at least monk heroes) use intimidate often (there've been a few times), there's many a martial arts flick I've seen when villainous monks use it to cower their foes into submission.
* Knowledge (Arcana) and Knowledge (Geography) are not on the list, though the former was, and the latter makes perfect sense for either the classic sojourning monk wandering the land or a monk guarding lore and libraries. I'm not really off-put by the lack of either, however I thought I'd mention it and ask your opinions and feedback. Knowledge (nobility), knowledge (local), knowledge (nature), and knowledge (planes), too, would have a strong precedent, though I don't think dungeoneering would do much for them. Engineering seems solid only since it was blended with architecture, and monasteries often have distinctive styles, however since it's no longer included, I'd suggest leaving it out (as you have).
* Ride - I'm not really certain why this is here, aside from their ability to talk to animals, and for certain things like the Sohei monk. I don't really recall ever seeing this really happen ever, though I admit my (movie) monk-fu is fairly weak.
So yeah, only a few, but I figured it was worth mentioning to see your thoughts and ideas. :)
You know, I'm going to skip the formatting for now! (Sorry)
Weapons and Armor Proficiency: A monk is proficient with all simple weapons, with the exception of the heavy crossbow, heavy mace, long spear, morning star, and spear. Monks are not proficient with any armor or shields. When wearing armor, using a shield, or carrying a medium or heavy load, a monk loses his AC bonus, as well as his fast movement and flurry of blows abilities.
Again, I read the discussion earlier, but why would you remove the long spear and spear? Those are classic monk weapons in literature and stories. Again, while I understand the removal of the heavy mace and morning star, I'm not sold on it. You first simplified monk weapons by stating "all simple weapons" as you, rightly, pointed out that many of their exotic weapons were simply revisions of simple weapons, but then you complicated it with "all of a, except v, x, y, and z". I understand the idea, but I'd suggest going more for straightforward and simple (the "all simple") or go the extra mile ("monk proficiencies: <insert specialized list here>".
Despite what I said earlier, we're not going for strict historical accuracy, and while those two do deal good damage, some might not want them because of:
a) money
b) iconic elements
c) not really too useful despite that potential extra +2 (or +4, if they're lucky) damage.
This also works fairly well if someone wanted to use your variant but run a medieval-ish campaign. Suddenly, they don't have to revise your revision - they've already got the medieval weapons. And, due to the fact that this particular set of monks have martial bents and those are supposedly "simple" weapons, I find it difficult to justify them being unable to work out the comparatively simplistic (for one trained in martial combat) tenets of how to work what amounts to a cudgel/spike-ball-on-stick.
But that's just me.
Oh, the inanity! The nitpicking, as it were!
AC Bonus (Ex): When unarmored and unencumbered, the monk adds his Wisdom bonus (if any) to his AC and his CMD. In addition, a monk gains a +1 bonus to AC and CMD at 4th level. This bonus increases by 1 for every four monk levels thereafter, up to a maximum of +5 at 20th level.
These bonuses to AC apply even against touch attacks or when the monk is flat-footed. He loses these bonuses when he is immobilized or helpless, when he wears any armor, when he uses a shield, or when he carries a medium or heavy load.
First, eeeeeeeeeeeeexcellent idea adding their AC bonus to their CMD. This is something they've needed for a long, long time. Second, good job simplifying the formula and clarifying what does and doesn't work. I also love the fact that it's not listed as an insight bonus - whether intentional or not, ioun stones are useful now!
Now, the (really tiny) nitpick: why is it still called "AC Bonus"? Would "Defense Bonus" or "Defensive Bonus" work? Because of the inclusion of CMD, it feels a bit strange to still only refer to it by half of its mechanical effect.
I'm also going to make another suggestion that I'll elaborate on later: one possibility is actually tying it to unarmed enhancement bonus. In other words, make those two progressions the same. Now, please realize, that by "suggestion", I don't actually mean "you should do this", I mean instead, "here's something that might (or might not!) be worth discussing." Let me know your preliminary thoughts.
Ok. Let's take these one at a time.
All great so far. One of the things I think that you nailed about the monk is it's style. They've been painted as everything from a defensive workhorse (which they sort of are), to a melee specialist (which, again, they sort of are), to a stealth master (which, again, they sort of are), but really, what they've always wanted to be, as-written, is a skirmisher. I think this really works with that. While you acknowledge the other "roles" as well, you clarify their secondary nature, and that's good, too. Everything else is traditional, so that's nice.
Thank you. I have played monks since 1st edition and in my experience they have always been skirmishers and scouts. Which the Dragon article (and I highly recommend anyone who can find a copy to get it and read it) made even better.
Alright, I like the skills. They're great. I understand the desire to avoid granting too many skills, so I'm not sure what's the best thing. A few other nitpicks/questions, though:
* I know it was discussed earlier, but I'm not certain that intimidate really should have been taken off the list. While few heroes (at least monk heroes) use intimidate often (there've been a few times), there's many a martial arts flick I've seen when villainous monks use it to cower their foes into submission.
* Knowledge (Arcana) and Knowledge (Geography) are not on the list, though the former was, and the latter makes perfect sense for either the classic sojourning monk wandering the land or a monk guarding lore and libraries. I'm not really off-put by the lack of either, however I thought I'd mention it and ask your opinions and feedback. Knowledge (nobility), knowledge (local), knowledge (nature), and knowledge (planes), too, would have a strong precedent, though I don't think dungeoneering would do much for them. Engineering seems solid only since it was blended with architecture, and monasteries often have distinctive styles, however since it's no longer included, I'd suggest leaving it out (as you have).
* Ride - I'm not really certain why this is here, aside from their ability to talk to animals, and for certain things like the Sohei monk. I don't really recall ever seeing this really happen ever, though I admit my (movie) monk-fu is fairly weak.
So yeah, only a few, but I figured it was worth mentioning to see your thoughts and ideas. :)
One thing I am considering is to allow players to pick either Diplomacy or Intimidate as a class skill at 1st level. That way, they get one or the other, but not both. Basically remove both from the class skill list and have a Bonus Class Skill that they can pick from those two.
I tried to keep close to what the Pathfinder skills already are, so I didn't add any further Knowledges, but I take your point.
Ride is a strange beast. But, in my own experience, monks don't run everywhere. LOL. And this version of the monk is only as fast on foot as a barbarian, unless he spends ki, which means if he needs to move overland faster, he is going to need to ride a mount of some sort.
Again, I read the discussion earlier, but why would you remove the long spear and spear? Those are classic monk weapons in literature and stories. Again, while I understand the removal of the heavy mace and morning star, I'm not sold on it. You first simplified monk weapons by stating "all simple weapons" as you, rightly, pointed out that many of their exotic weapons were simply revisions of simple weapons, but then you complicated it with "all of a, except v, x, y, and z". I understand the idea, but I'd suggest going more for straightforward and simple (the "all simple") or go the extra mile ("monk proficiencies: <insert specialized list here>".
Despite what I said earlier, we're not going for strict historical accuracy, and while those two do deal good damage, some might not want them because of:
a) money
b) iconic elements
c) not really too useful despite that potential extra +2 (or +4, if they're lucky) damage.This also works fairly well if someone wanted to use your variant but run a medieval-ish campaign. Suddenly, they don't have to revise your revision - they've already got the medieval weapons. And, due to the fact that this particular set of monks have martial bents and those are supposedly "simple" weapons, I find it difficult to justify them being unable to work out the comparatively simplistic (for one trained in martial combat) tenets of how to work what amounts to a cudgel/spike-ball-on-stick.
But that's just me.
The spear and longspear are d8 damage weapons. The shortspear is a d6 weapon and is more monkish. What I wanted to do was to keep the weapons that a monk can use in a flurry on the same general playing field of either being light or having a d6 damage. I am not sure of the longspear being a traditional monk weapon--it is modeled after the pike, after all! The heavy mace and morning star are pretty hefty in weight and unwieldy in balance, so they were top on my list to cut. And the heavy crossbow? Well, light crossbows make sense, but the heavy (an arbalest) was simply not something I pictured as a monk using.
First, eeeeeeeeeeeeexcellent idea adding their AC bonus to their CMD. This is something they've needed for a long, long time. Second, good job simplifying the formula and clarifying what does and doesn't work. I also love the fact that it's not listed as an insight bonus - whether intentional or not, ioun stones are useful now!
Now, the (really tiny) nitpick: why is it still called "AC Bonus"? Would "Defense Bonus" or "Defensive Bonus" work? Because of the inclusion of CMD, it feels a bit strange to still only refer to it by half of its mechanical effect.
I'm also going to make another suggestion that I'll elaborate on later: one possibility is actually tying it to unarmed enhancement bonus. In other words, make those two progressions the same. Now, please realize, that by "suggestion", I don't actually mean "you should do this", I mean instead, "here's something that might (or might not!) be worth discussing." Let me know your preliminary thoughts.
I think this is pretty the Pathfinder monk ability ported over directly from the Core monk! Excellent ideas all around, but I just went with the simple 'AC Bonus'. Certainly it might have been called all sorts of things, but at its heart that is what it is. They aren't tied together because a monk wearing armor loses his AC bonus, but he retains his enhancement bonus on unarmed strikes (even if he can't flurry in armor). Makes a profound difference.
Next question?
Master Arminas
Two this time, because they're relatively short. At least one is. Sort of. Whatever!
Bonus Feat: At 1st level, 2nd level, and every 4 levels gained as a monk thereafter, a monk may select a bonus feat. These feats must be taken from the following list: Combat Reflexes, Deflect Arrows, Dodge, Improved Grapple, Improved Sunder, and Weapon Focus.
At 6th level, the following feats are added to the list: Improved Bull Rush, Improved Disarm, Improved Trip, Ki Stand, Mobility, and Weapon Specialization.
At 10th level, the following feats are added to the list: Greater Weapon Focus, Improved Critical, Medusa’s Wrath, Snatch Arrows, and Spring Attack. A monk need not have any of the prerequisites normally required for these feats to select them.
Sweet, sweet monk feats. I like them. Well thought out, quite a good selection. However, I'm surprised things like...
* the entire Blind Fight tree
* Quarterstaff Master
(and related feats, Tripping Staff and Tripping Twirl)
* Spider Step
(and related feat Cloud Step)
... or everything underneath improved unarmed strike is missing. Care to comment or mention possibilities?
Fast Movement (Ex/Su): A monk’s land speed is faster than the norm for his race by +10 feet. This benefit only applies when he is wearing no armor and is not carrying a medium or heavy load. This bonus stacks with any other bonuses to the monk’s land speed (such as the effects of an expeditious retreat spell, a haste spell, or any other effect that increases a monk’s speed). This ability is extraordinary.
At 4th level, when a monk gains access to his ki pool (see below), the character can achieve literally superhuman bursts of speed for limited periods of time. As a free action, a monk can spend 1 point of ki to increase his speed by +20 feet. This speed increase lasts for 1 round per monk class level and is a supernatural ability. At 6th level, and again every two levels gained thereafter, the monk's speed when using this ability increases by an additional +5 feet, to a maximum increase of +60 feet at 20th level.
The bonus speed granted to a monk through the use of this ability is a supernatural ability and is not considered to be an enhancement bonus.
I like it, mostly. I'm of the school that more speed for a monk is better speed for a monk, but I'm willing to admit that I'm probably in the minority on that. I like that they have both the mundane improvement and the supernatural one. Good call. I'm curious - does the supernatural effect stack with haste, or is it only the extraordinary ability? Because that's not entirely clear. I'd suggest allowing both to stack, but then again, I'm all about the higher speeds. :)
Anyway, temporary stop here to feed my son and then do other pressing chores. I'll get cracking again when I have time, but that might not be until tomorrow! Later!
Sweet, sweet monk feats. I like them. Well thought out, quite a good selection. However, I'm surprised things like... stuff
Had to make decisions. The bonus feat list should be short and concise, but there are definately many feats I wish I had put on there. Still, I think it covers all bases and the basics. And improved critical is on the bonus list, lol.
like it, mostly. I'm of the school that more speed for a monk is better speed for a monk, but I'm willing to admit that I'm probably in the minority on that. I like that they have both the mundane improvement and the supernatural one. Good call. I'm curious - does the supernatural effect stack with haste, or is it only the extraordinary ability? Because that's not entirely clear. I'd suggest allowing both to stack, but then again, I'm all about the higher speeds. :)
I guess you wear red robes too, 'cause red ones go faster? LOL. Seriously, neither of the two bumps in speed (the +10 that all monks get OR the later +20 and higher for spending a ki) are considered enhancement bonuses. Which means they stack with boots of striding and springing, expeditious retreat, longstrider, haste, boots of speed, or any other effect that adds an enhancement bonus to a character's speed. So, a 20th level human monk has a base speed of 40 feet, gains +30 feet when under the influence of a haste spell, and gains another +60 feet by spending a point of ki, for a total movement of 130 feet as a standard move (260 feet on a charge, 520 feet running).
Master Arminas
Master Arminas
I gots some house chores to do! (Clean up, dishes, the like). I'm typing one-handed now and without much focus, 'cause my infant needs to sit up for at least 20 minutes after a feeding: no real time for either good focus or good commentary. :)
Will get more into it later!
Minor thought:
Monastic Skill Training (Ex):
Choose any four of Diplomacy, Intimidate, Knowledge (religion), Knowledge (history), Knowledge (geography), Knowledge (nobility), knowledge (local), knowledge (nature), or knowledge (planes). These are class skills.
Customibility without over-powering!
(copy/paste is my friend)
EDIT: could have sworn there was a post that said "what happened?" I was responding to. Anyway! I'm away!
Good idea; I'll have to incorporate it in the next version!
MA
I'm back, baby! (For now. This might take more than today, too!)
First: Glad you like the skill idea!
Second:
I guess you wear red robes too, 'cause red ones go faster?
Why do you think I like Thay? (And the Scarlet Brotherhood, for that matter. Hm... two racist [humanocentric] organizations... wearing red... do you sense a pattern? Maybe I should rethink liking them...)
Third: regarding speeds, I understood that, based off your wording of "enhancement" bonus, and such, but the possible confusion lies in the placement of the sentence...
This bonus stacks with any other bonuses to the monk’s land speed (such as the effects of an expeditious retreat spell, a haste spell, or any other effect that increases a monk’s speed).
At the end of the extraordinary speed but before the supernatural speed. It seems that the clause relates only the paragraph it's in (the extraordinary), not the whole fast movement. My only suggestion would be to put that sentence at the end, possibly modifying so it says:
Because neither are enhancement bonuses, these bonuses stack with any other bonuses to the monk’s land speed (such as the effects of an expeditious retreat spell, a haste spell, or any other effect that increases a monk’s speed).
Unarmed Strike (Ex): A monk gains Improved Unarmed Strike as a bonus feat. A monk’s unarmed attack may be made with his fists, elbows, knees, feet, or even his head. This means that a monk may make unarmed strikes with his hands full. There is no such thing as an off-hand attack for a monk striking unarmed. A monk may thus apply his full Strength bonus on damage rolls for all his unarmed strikes.
Usually a monk’s unarmed strikes deal lethal damage, but he can choose to deal nonlethal damage instead with no penalty on his attack roll. He has the same choice to deal lethal or nonlethal damage while grappling.
A monk deals more damage with his unarmed strikes than normal; from 1st-3rd level the damage is 1d6. This increases to 2d4 at 4th level. At 8th level, and every 4 monk levels gained thereafter, the damage increases by an additional 1d4, to a maximum of 6d4 at 20th level. The unarmed damage is for all monks, regardless of size. The techniques a monk learns do not alter the base damage of the class due to being either smaller or larger, although both Strength bonuses and penalties apply as normal.
I like this. I don't think I entirely agree with all of it, but I see what you're going for, and, over-all, I approve. Also I've no particular "thought" on how to make it work like I'm thinking, so, yes. Well done!
One thing I think needs revision, however... uh... hm. Nevermind! Somehow I thought monks weren't able to benefit from magic fang at lower levels, but I'm not seeing it there, now. I must have missed that conversation/change in the thread. So, yeah, basically, this is great!
Chuckle. I put that in as a place holder. The boards showed that you replied, and then didn't post the post! Usually putting another one in afterwards brings it up. I then edited it once I read your actual post.
I'll be around for a while, so if you have questions, feel free to ask and I will get right back with you.
MA
And lo, a flurracious spectacular of critiqueing!
Stunning Fist (Ex): The monk gains Stunning Fist as a bonus feat, even if he does not meet the prerequisites. At 4th level, and every 4 levels gained as a monk thereafter, the monk gains the ability to apply a new condition to the target of his Stunning Fist. This condition replaces stunning the target for 1 round, and a successful saving throw still negates the effect.
At 4th level, he can choose to make the target fatigued. At 8th level, he can make the target sickened for 1 minute. At 12th level, he can make the target staggered for 1d6+1 rounds. At 16th level, he can permanently blind or deafen the target. At 20th level, he can paralyze the target for 1d6+1 rounds. The monk must choose which condition will apply before the attack roll is made. These effects do not stack with themselves (a creature sickened by Stunning Fist cannot become nauseated if hit by Stunning Fist again), but additional hits do increase the duration.
A monk gains one use of this feat for every monk level he possesses, as described in the Stunning Fist feat.
So, yeah, pretty excellent, actually. Well played. :)
Evasion (Ex): At 2nd level or higher, a monk can avoid damage from many area-effect attacks. If a monk makes a successful Reflex saving throw against an attack that normally deals half damage on a successful save, he instead takes no damage. Evasion can be used only if a monk is wearing no armor and is not carrying a medium or heavy load. A helpless monk does not gain the benefit of evasion.
Perfectly fine!
Flurry of Blows (Ex): At 3rd level, a monk gains the ability to make a flurry of blows. When using unarmed strikes, simple melee weapons with which he is proficient, or darts a monk can make a flurry of blows attack. Flurry of blows can be added to either a standard attack or a full-attack; in either case, flurry of blows is not an action itself. When using this ability a monk may make one additional attack using any combination of unarmed strikes or weapons at his highest base attack bonus. However, this attack, as well as all others made by the monk in that round, suffers a penalty of -2 to hit.
At 8th level, the penalty on his attacks decreases to -1.
At 10th level, the monk gains a second bonus attack at his highest base attack bonus when making a flurry of blows attack.
At 13th level, the monk no longer suffers a penalty on attacks.
A monk applies his full Strength bonus to his damage rolls for all successful attacks made with a flurry of blows, whether the attacks are made with an off-hand or with a weapon wielded in both hands. A monk may freely substitute disarm, sunder, and trip combat maneuvers for unarmed attacks as part of a flurry of blows. A monk with natural weapons cannot use such weapons as part of a flurry of blows, nor can he make natural attacks in addition to his flurry of blows attacks.
Flurry of blows cannot be combined with two-weapon fighting (as per the feats) for additional attacks, even if the monk wields two weapons while making a flurry of blows attack. The penalties (if any) given above replace those normally associated with two-weapon fighting when the monk is making a flurry of blows attack only.
Well structured and presented, and I like it!
My only question is if he should lose the penalty first, and gain the extra attack after that. That seems a smoother way to increase it, but it really doesn't affect me one way or the other: I'm pleased with your wording and clarifications.Maneuver Training (Ex): At 3rd level, a monk uses his monk level in place of his base attack bonus when calculating his Combat Maneuver Bonus and his Combat Maneuver Defense. Base attack bonuses granted from other classes are unaffected and are added normally.
I entirely approved
Still Mind (Ex): A monk of 3rd level or higher gains a +2 bonus on saving throws against enchantment spells and effects. This bonus increases to +4 at 10th level and to +6 at 17th level.
I'm so glad you did this. So. Very. Glad. It needed to happen.
One question regarding this and evasion - have you thought about granting something akin to the stalwart ability of the unbreakable fighter archetype? Perhaps only for will? I'm not sure, myself, but that's something that I was thinking of.
Ki Pool (Su): At 4th level, a monk begins to slowly access his internal ki, a supernatural energy that he can use to accomplish amazing feats. The monk gains a pool of ki points, equal to his monk level + his Wisdom modifier. By spending 1 point from his ki pool as a swift action, a monk can invoke any one of the following options: he can gain a +4 dodge bonus to AC for 1 round; he can gain a +4 insight bonus to his attacks for 1 round; he can gain a +4 insight bonus to his damage for 1 round; or he can gain one additional attack at his highest base attack bonus when he uses his flurry of blows ability (see above).
A monk gains additional powers that consume points from his ki pool as he gains levels. The ki pool is replenished each morning after 8 hours of rest or meditation; these hours do not need to be consecutive.
Prrrrrrrrfect. Yes, I did just purr. What of it?
Ki Strike (Su): At 4th level, a monk can focus his ki into his unarmed strikes, making them the equivalent of enchanted weapons. When first gained, the monk gains a +1 enhancement bonus to hit and damage. At 8th level, and every 4 levels gained thereafter as a monk, this bonus increases by +1, to a maximum of +5 at 20th level. A monk’s unarmed strikes are considered magic weapons for the purpose of attacking incorporeal creatures and for overcoming damage reduction.
At 12th level, a monk’s unarmed strikes count as alchemical silver and cold iron weapons for the purposes of overcoming damage reduction.
At 16th level, a monk’s unarmed strikes count as adamantine for the purposes of overcoming damage reduction.
At 20th level, a monk’s unarmed strikes bypass any alignment based damage reduction.
This is also a flawless win! In 3.0 it made little sense and was just kind of awkward to get random +x bonuses (and they weren't even that great of +x bonuses), but given PF's bonus=defeat damage reduction, this is exactly the streamlining that has to happen in order to make the monk make sense. I approve entirely.
Catfall (Su): At 4th level or higher, a monk can fall incredible distances without suffering damage. When falling, a monk always lands on his feet. In addition, he reduces the damage inflicted from a fall by 1d6 per monk level he possesses, to a maximum reduction of 20d6 at 20th level. Unlike magical spells (such as feather fall) with similar effects, a monk is not slowed during his descent, making this ability a favored method for higher level monks to rapidly descend great distances quickly.
Okay. This right here? Stroke of genius. Again: I approve entirely. This typifies everything you've done right about the monk revision!
Agility Training (Ex): At 5th level, a monk adds one-half his level (round down) to all Acrobatics and Climb skill checks. In addition, he always counts as having a running start when making jump checks using Acrobatics. By spending 1 point from his ki pool as a swift action, a monk can gain an additional +20 bonus on Acrobatics checks made to jump for 1 round.
Purity of Body (Ex): At 5th level, a monk gains immunity to all diseases, including supernatural and magical diseases (such as lycanthropy and mummy rot).
I put both of those together, because really - it's perfect. It's exactly what they need. I might want to add "swim" to the agility training, or that might be an optional thing: perhaps they receive either climb or swim, depending (similar to their monastic skill training that you're going to be adding in, now)?
Anyhoo, this post is long enough, so I'm going to break here.
Next time, on Tacticslion Talks To Much, tune in for: SOMETHING HE DOESN'T LIKE?!?!? Hey, who wrote that typo in this script?! Wait, we're still rolling! Cut! Cut! Cu-
*after these messages, we'll be riiiiiiiight back!
hahahahaha. Thank you. I am certainly glad that you enjoyed it and so enthusiastically as well! Really, I think you only had a single question (or two) in there, so here goes.
One question regarding this and evasion - have you thought about granting something akin to the stalwart ability of the unbreakable fighter archetype? Perhaps only for will? I'm not sure, myself, but that's something that I was thinking of.
I thought about it, but with all good saves, having evasion, improved evasion, and stalwart would probably be a bit over the top. (For those you playing along at home, stalwart is Pathfinder's version of mettle.)
I put both of those together, because really - it's perfect. It's exactly what they need. I might want to add "swim" to the agility training, or that might be an optional thing: perhaps they receive either climb or swim, depending (similar to their monastic skill training that you're going to be adding in, now)?
Reasonable and certainly allowed for a specific order. As long as you keep acrobatics (no choosing just swim and climb). It is a minor change, but one that I will incorporate.
Master Arminas
Servant of Order (Su): At 6th level, a monk deals an additional 1d6 points of damage with his unarmed strikes against chaotic-aligned creatures. This additional damage is not multiplied on a critical hit.
Okay, so, I see where you were going with this. I understand why you put this here. I really get it. It's not even a bad ability - it's quite good, when taken out of context, and I like it in that way, and it also neatly ties up the monk's previous ability to bypass DR/law. Yet. Something about it says "No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no."
I think my problem lies in the fact that this makes monks militantly lawful against the universe, which seems to be kind of the opposite of their point. Their abilities aren't built to automatically inflict the monk's way on the world, per se, but this one - well, it doesn't seem like a method of self perfection. This is, so far, the only thing that I've really gone "no, that's really quite wrong" with (and I think it's the only one, really, though I can't be sure at this moment).
One suggestion, I have in replacing this is making this instead a bonus against chaos attempting to afflict the monk. In other words, turn this puppy into a defensive thing. Give him bonuses on saves against chaotic effects (maybe even allowing Still Mind's benefits to apply to all effects with the [chaos] descriptor as well starting at this level), and if a chaotic something attacks him with natural weapons, then they take the damage.
Anyway, I'm actually genuinely sorry to find something I dislike this strongly. It certainly doesn't ruin the monk for me (it's not even close!), but it does feel rather out of place in his build.
(I still like this monk, though!)
No, solid critique with good reasoning. I went with the servant of order (and later champion of order) ability in order to boost damage (which many decry as the weak point of the monk). Although your ideas are most excellent on this ability, I think I am going to keep it as is.
I am not certain it makes the monks militantly lawful against the universe, but rather that it simply allows them better fight against those dedicated to chaos. But, that is only my opinion.
Master Arminas
Re: Acrobatics/Climb/Swim: exactly what I meant. Either climb or swim (not switching out acrobatics, as that's a pretty fundamental element of the way the class is structured), so, yes, you read that totally right.
Re: Stalwart - yeah, I was wondering if it was overpowered. Really, though, it just feels right for the monk, I just can't find anything to sacrifice or change out for it. And you know mettle! Yay! No one I talk to knows Mettle! (... though I don't think I talk to people on this forum very much about that, so that's probably why...)
Ah! I don't like that I didn't like something! I must find something positive! Quick! Oh: here's a really cool thing:
Speak with Animals (Ex): At 6th level, a monk can converse with any creature of the animal type, as per the spell speak with animals. Such conversations are limited by the animal’s intelligence (or lack thereof).
Eeeeeeexcellent! I see why (and how!) you did this, and I entirely like it. One question/suggestion (as in something to think about, not as in "do this"): perhaps add linguistics as a class skill and/or grant the monk some bonus languages as they level up. I'm not sold on either idea, but it also helps "justify" their sudden ability to speak all languages later. And linguistics is useful beyond just being able to know languages. Anyway, that's just an idea, and I don't know what you think of it. One other possibility is making something like stone tell a ki-power as well at later levels, or something similar - effectively, the tone of these abilities is that a monk is learning to be at peace and communion with the natural world as they learn their own inner peace.
Wholeness of Body (Su): At 7th level or higher, a monk can heal his own wounds as a standard action. He can expend 1 point from his ki pool to heal a number of hit points of damage equal to 2d8 + his monk level + his Wisdom bonus (if any).
Yes. +1 billion. This is exactly what this has always needed to be. I always liked the concept of having a structured/ordered number of hit points a lawful monk can heal in a day, but it just doesn't function well. This, on the other hand, is perfect. My only question is if it heals too much. I don't think so, but that's a possible concern, comparatively.
Nonetheless, these are great!
Also, this may be my last one tonight, but I might have time for one more later. :)
HAH! Fooled you! I'm back for one more round tonight! Sneak attack dice go! A flurry of sneak attacks at that! What? When did I become the ninja?!
No, solid critique with good reasoning. I went with the servant of order (and later champion of order) ability in order to boost damage (which many decry as the weak point of the monk). Although your ideas are most excellent on this ability, I think I am going to keep it as is.
I am not certain it makes the monks militantly lawful against the universe, but rather that it simply allows them better fight against those dedicated to chaos. But, that is only my opinion.
Master Arminas
I'm glad it wasn't offensive, as I really didn't want it to be, I just wasn't sure how it'd come off! I really do like this monk over-all, and again, I entirely understand these abilities' purpose. It just feels wrong to me to make this the damage boost. Nonetheless - as it's your monk, keep it! As you think it works (and I certainly think it accomplishes it's purpose), use it! One other idea, might be to re-flavor the two abilities: actually calling them "Servant of Order" and "Champion of Order" (though those are good names) might be one of the things that make it feel so militant, to my mind! :)
Also, I admit, I'd forgotten about the upcoming Champion of Order ability!
Now: ONWARD!
Spiritual Endurance (Ex): At 8th level, a monk's training and inner reserves of ki allow him to comfortably exist in environments and conditions that would quickly sap the strength from others. He is considered to be under the influence of an endure elements spell at all times, ignoring the extremes of heat and cold. In addition, he may go for a number of days equal to one-half his monk level without eating or drinking before beginning to suffer adverse effects. He requires only four hours of sleep per night, provided that he also meditates for at least four hours as well. While meditating, a monk remains fully aware of his surroundings and may make Perception checks without penalty.
This is pretty beautiful. I love this, and it's so terribly thematic. One other possibility is to eventually negate his need to eat (say, at twentieth level) - it's thematic, it works with the whole "transcendence" idea. Duty Never Tires, Diamond Body, Timeless Body, Stalwart Soul, and Perfect Self are all perfect candidates to receive this trait, although I'd recommend at least level fifteen or higher (so they can go without food for an entire week before not needing food at all), and probably perfect self would be the best thing for this (which also would work for FR's tenday structure, so that's a bonus, too).
Also, one idea is to halve the normal sleeping requirements, instead of making it a static four hours. I'm not certain you wish to, but that's one thought I had.
Excellent idea and execution, all 'round.
Improved Evasion (Ex): At 9th level, a monk’s evasion ability improves. He still takes no damage on a successful Reflex saving throw against attacks, but henceforth he takes only half damage on a failed save. A helpless monk does not gain the benefit of improved evasion.
Perfect!
Duty Never Tires (Ex): At 10th level, a monk gains Endurance as a bonus feat. Furthermore, by spending 1 ki point as a swift action, he can ignore the effects of fatigue for 10 minutes per monk level.
I think this is phenomenal. One thing you may wish to note under the ability (or not) is whether or not this counts against the duration of the fatigue, or this specifically only delays the fatigue. Excellent ability, though, and perfectly thematic!
Touch of Law (Su): At 10th level, a monk’s unarmed strikes are treated as lawful weapons for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction.
Hey, I recognize this! And it's nice that this comes so early, but also that they can bypass all alignments later.
Diamond Body (Ex): At 11th level, a monk gains immunity to poisons of all kinds.
Perfect as-is! Unless it also allows them not to eat anymore! (I think it's too early, however).
Abundant Step (Su): At 12th level or higher, a monk can slip magically between spaces, as if using the spell dimension door. Using this ability is a move action that consumes 2 points from his ki pool. His caster level for this effect is equal to his monk level. Unlike the normal use of dimension door, the monk may take any remaining actions in a round after using this ability. He may take up to one willing creature with him when he uses this ability.
Okay, this is the thing I wanted to get to with this post tonight. Reason being: THIS IS AMAZING. I THINK THIS ROKZORS.
Effectively, with this and Catfall, you "fixed" the monk for me. Everything else has just been that oh-so-delicious frosting that covers said pastry of excellence. This is exactly something that had plagued the monk for so long to make it frustrating in the extreme. Well played, sir. Well played.
One other thought, reference the ability to speak to creatures (which I'm going to get into more tomorrow, I hope!) and my thoughts on stone tell/linguistics - I'm not entirely sold on it, and I don't want you to think that it's something I think you should add. I think it's completely viable, and I think it makes distinct sense, when thinking about the thematic growth of monks, but I am not sold on either of those ideas solidly. The entire suggestion is to go with the theme, rather than "this should really be here"!
Anyway, that's it for tonight! God's blessings, peace, and a good evening. :)
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Eeeeeeexcellent! I see why (and how!) you did this, and I entirely like it. One question/suggestion (as in something to think about, not as in "do this"): perhaps add linguistics as a class skill and/or grant the monk some bonus languages as they level up. I'm not sold on either idea, but it also helps "justify" their sudden ability to speak all languages later. And linguistics is useful beyond just being able to know languages. Anyway, that's just an idea, and I don't know what you think of it. One other possibility is making something like stone tell a ki-power as well at later levels, or something similar - effectively, the tone of these abilities is that a monk is learning to be at peace and communion with the natural world as they learn their own inner peace.
Linguistics would be cool, I agree, but I don't want to bloat the class skill list too much. I had not considered stone tell to tell you the truth. And it would be fairly appropriate for a nature oriented class. But (and you knew there was a but coming), all of the other monk speak with x abilities are geared towards living creatures. I'm not absolutely certain that it fits to be able to read stone in this manner as well. But it is definately an intriguing idea.
Yes. +1 billion. This is exactly what this has always needed to be. I always liked the concept of having a structured/ordered number of hit points a lawful monk can heal in a day, but it just doesn't function well. This, on the other hand, is perfect. My only question is if it heals too much. I don't think so, but that's a possible concern, comparatively.
Well, when he gets it at 7th level, he heals 2d8+7+Wis, which should be between a 16 and 22 at this level (+3 to +6), so that is 2d8+10 to 13 (average of 19-22). At the same level a cleric can heal himself others with cure critical for 4d8+7 (average of 25) or heal everyone in 30-foot radius via channel energy for 4d6 (average of 14). A paladin of the same level can use lay on hands for 3d6 points (10.5 average) as a swift action to heal himself. I don't think it is overpowered. Indeed, I think it hits that goldilocks zone of just right. LOL
Master Arminas
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This is pretty beautiful. I love this, and it's so terribly thematic. One other possibility is to eventually negate his need to eat (say, at twentieth level) - it's thematic, it works with the whole "transcendence" idea. Duty Never Tires, Diamond Body, Timeless Body, Stalwart Soul, and Perfect Self are all perfect candidates to receive this trait, although I'd recommend at least level fifteen or higher (so they can go without food for an entire week before not needing food at all), and probably perfect self would be the best thing for this (which also would work for FR's tenday structure, so that's a bonus, too).
Also, one idea is to halve the normal sleeping requirements, instead of making it a static four hours. I'm not certain you wish to, but that's one thought I had.
Excellent idea and execution, all 'round.
I had not thought about the idea of no longer having to eat or drink and agree it would be perfect to add to the capstone ability of perfect self. Consider it done. About making it half the normal sleep, I am strongly of the opinion that in the design of a class one needs to be specific about certain details, lest it become abused. Four hours is fine, but I hear you!
I think this is phenomenal. One thing you may wish to note under the ability (or not) is whether or not this counts against the duration of the fatigue, or this specifically only delays the fatigue. Excellent ability, though, and perfectly thematic!
I actually was not thinking about magical fatigue here. I intended for the fatigue to be suppressed over the duration, since once you are normally fatigued you remain so (or become exhausted) until you either rest or have the condition removed. I might need to clarify this. Thank you.
And once again, thank you for the (not so faint) praise. I am glad that you are enjoying my work on the class. Look forward to more.
Master Arminas
Mwahahahah! I start early, today! Meet Sneak Flurriganza!
I had not thought about the idea of no longer having to eat or drink and agree it would be perfect to add to the capstone ability of perfect self. Consider it done. About making it half the normal sleep, I am strongly of the opinion that in the design of a class one needs to be specific about certain details, lest it become abused. Four hours is fine, but I hear you!
I understand - that's why I phrased it the way I did, as I was uncertain of what you'd want to do, precisely, but it was one thought that had occurred to me.
I actually was not thinking about magical fatigue here. I intended for the fatigue to be suppressed over the duration, since once you are normally fatigued you remain so (or become exhausted) until you either rest or have the condition removed. I might need to clarify this. Thank you.
Your welcome!
And once again, thank you for the (not so faint) praise. I am glad that you are enjoying my work on the class. Look forward to more.
Master Arminas
Hey, man, you're welcome: you obviously put a lot of work into this. I came in not knowing what to expect, but kind of thinking I'd give this a once-over and go, "hey, that's pretty cool!" and leave it alone, but not only had a number of people done that, I was really impressed with the thought, revisions, and refinement you've put in, and have been totally on board with most of the changes. I would totally jockey (as others have done) for a summary of changes from the PF version - in addition to, not in exclusion to -, but I've gone through each of your revisions (and probably would have done so anyway!) and figured you could use feedback on each part of the class... after all you had to write it! It just kind of made sense that you'd want to see how each part was handled and get a feel for what it looked like piece by piece from someone else. :)
As far as the stone-tell... you're right. They do tend toward living things; in PF, plants are, however, defined as objects as opposed to "creatures", so that's one of the reasons I'd thought of stone tell. I don't think such a thing would be unbalancing, but it's entirely up to you whether or not it'd be thematic.
Also, to the "skill bloat" - yeah, linguistics doesn't need to be there (though you could add it to the monastic skill training list - or not! :D). I was just spit-balling ideas! One way to give it a more gradual feel and make it believable too is to drop in bonus languages as they progress, say one at 1st, 5th, 9th, 13th, and 17th (that's a one per four levels thing). That way, by the time they get to 17th and get tongues, they're already used to not only talking to animals and plants (at 6th and 12th respectively, so no toes-stepping here) it represents the culmination of their abilities, and it would be logical that they wouldn't gain any others after 17th - not only because they've got tongues, but because four levels thereafter, they'd be at 21st level, which is beyond the scope of this progression.
As far as healing - your number breakdown is great! ... I was just referring to the amount per day that a monk could heal himself verses the amount of healing any of those classes could bring to bear in a day. At only 1 ki point, a monk would be able to heal himself once per (class level+his wisdom modifier) per day, should he focus on that! That's a lot! Nonetheless, I still don't think it's broken. This was my only concern and the only reason I brought it up at all.
Anyway... I'm AWAY!
Unfettered Speech (Ex): At 12th level, a monk can converse with any creature of the plant type, as per the spell speak with plants. Such conversations are limited by the plant’s intelligence (or lack thereof). A monk can also converse with any creature of the magical beast type that has an Intelligence score of 1 or 2 (for the purpose of this ability, treat magical beasts as though they are animals and refer to the spell speak with animals).
Excellent. I covered language above, and this keeps on keepin' on with that. Well done!
Diamond Soul (Ex): At 13th level, a monk gains spell resistance equal to his current monk level +11. In order to affect the monk with a spell, a spellcaster must get a result on a caster level check (1d20 + caster level) that equals or exceeds the monk’s spell resistance.
Yeppers!
Champion of Order (Su): At 14th level, a monk deals an additional 1d6 points of damage with his unarmed strikes against chaotic-aligned creatures. This stacks with the bonus damage granted by the servant of order ability, for a total of +2d6 bonus damage. This additional damage is not multiplied on a critical hit.
Already mentioned my only qualms about the class. The fact that these two abilities are my only qualms, is huge! Well done.
Quivering Palm (Su): Starting at 15th level, a monk can set up vibrations within the body of another creature that can thereafter be fatal if the monk so desires. He can use this quivering palm attack once per day, and he must announce his intent before making his attack roll. Creatures immune to critical hits cannot be affected. Otherwise, if the monk strikes successfully and the target takes damage from the blow, the quivering palm attack succeeds. Thereafter, the monk can try to slay the victim at any later time, as long as the attempt is made within a number of days equal to his monk level. To make such an attempt, the monk merely wills the target to die (a free action), and unless the target makes a Fortitude saving throw (DC 10 + ½ the monk’s level + the monk’s Wisdom modifier) it dies. If the saving throw is successful, the target instead takes twice the damage of the monk's unarmed strike (as if the monk had threatened and then confirmed a critical hit) and the quivering palm attack ends; the target may still die if he suffers enough damage from this attack to reduce him to negative hit points equal to his Constitution score. A monk can have no more than one quivering palm in effect at one time. If a monk uses quivering palm while another is still in effect, the previous effect is negated. This ability is a death effect.
So, this is pretty standard and pretty great. Except. (of course there was an "except"!). The Scorpion Style Feat Tree. Especially of note is that last one, Cockatrice Strike. The reason? Well, it takes four feats, but by the end (which would basically be a capstone ability for a monk, aka 19th level for that +14 BAB), you can insta-kill something at will. This greatly weakens the monks' power (comparatively) if his personal one is only once per day. What if you made it for at no cost once per day, but made additional uses possible by spending, say, 6 ki? Again, this is me tossing an idea around, rather than saying "this is how it should be done!", but it just seems that monks should be able to do this super-special maneuver more than once. And, I mean, it's fifteenth level. It's not exactly like it's broken by that point, even with the ability to activate it later, it's still not super-powerful. Anyway, that's just me thinking! (Agh, run away!)
Adamantine Touch (Su): At 16th level, a monk’s unarmed strikes are treated as adamantine weapons for bypassing hardness.
Wonderfully done! (I'd rather it be "ex", but I guess that's asking for too much... :D)
Timeless Body (Ex): At 17th level, a monk no longer takes penalties to his ability scores to his physical ability scores for aging and cannot be magically aged. Any such penalties that he has already taken, however, remain in place. The initial roll made by the DM for the character’s maximum age (according to race) is discarded, and a new maximum age calculated. The random dice are maximized. For example, a human monk who reaches 17th level will live to a ripe old age of 110 years, while an elf monk could see 750 years. Age bonuses to the monk’s mental ability scores still accrue, and the monk still dies of old age when his time is up. This ability is not the same as immortality, and the monk can always die before his time due to violence.
I like this. I like this a great deal. I like how you've rephrased some of it, the maximum age, for example, the clarification of various fiddly bits (and distinction from being immortal) and all of it. Well done. My only hesitation is the bit about penalties physical ability scores. It seems that penalties should be erased, to me. I know that's how it is and has always been... but that's just me thinking aloud, of how I'd like it. Nonetheless, it really doesn't need "fixing". Just my preferences!
So, yeah, I'll set up shop working on the next one, but I think this is a good break point, for now! Peace!
This is it! The Final Countdow-, er, I mean the Final Critique!
One final thing before I start the... er... final thing: I don't think I ever picked up the conversation about weapon proficiencies: to clarify, I've seen a few movies in which martial artists used weapons akin to the long spear. I understand your reasoning for each of the weapons, and it's completely fine, but the basis of my suggestion was for public consumption and complete integration with PF rules - since there are the exotic weapons, it seems to make sense to mention them, even if, in game terms, they don't do too much. Nonetheless, go with what you prefer!
Here we goooooooo!
Tongues (Ex): At 17th level, a monk can converse with any creature, as per the spell tongues. To communicate, a creature must be within 30 feet of the monk and both the monk and creature must have line-of-sight to each other.
Welp, I've pretty much spoken my peace*, on this subject, so you know where I stand. This could be a place for stone tell, or 18th level (keeping with the every six levels a strange "talk with" ability going ever-more arcane). Obviously, this is a great ability.
* HAH! I SLAY ME**!
** No.
Stalwart Soul (Ex): At 18th level, a monk no longer suffers any penalties for being fatigued (he still remains fatigued, however, for purposes of exhaustion). If the monk becomes exhausted, he may spend 2 ki points as a swift action to ignore the effects of exhaustion for 1 minute per monk level.
Again, the question becomes if this ignoring exhaustion counts against the duration of exhaustion or simply negates it for that time. Still, excellent ability, and sorely needed. It also works well with the earlier trait that allows you to ignore fatigue... and the way it's worded doesn't negate that ability either!
Empty Body (Su): At 19th level, a monk gains the ability to assume an ethereal state for 1 minute as though using the spell etherealness. Using this ability is a move action that consumes 3 points from his ki pool. This ability only affects the monk and cannot be used to make other creatures ethereal.
Quite well structured, and I like that it's a ki power now!
Perfect Self: At 20th level, a monk transcends his mortal limitations. He gains blindsight in a 30-foot radius. He gains immunity versus mind-affecting spells, spell-like abilities, and other effects (this replaces and does not stack with the still mind ability), as well as being the recipient of constant nondetection and undetectable alignment effects (as per the spells). Additionally, the monk gains damage reduction 10/chaotic, which allows him to ignore the first 10 points of damage from any attack made by a nonchaotic weapon or by any natural attack made by a creature that doesn’t have similar damage reduction. Whenever a monk who has attained perfect self confirms a critical strike with an unarmed attack against a chaotic-aligned creature, he deals an additional 1d10 points of damage.
The few monks who reach this level of achievement often retire from adventuring to explore what they are becoming. Only those with the strongest of ties to their companions and their homelands remain, but even these will eventually simply vanish one night, never to return.
Very intriguing. I like the details here, and it's interesting that you made their DR into DR/chaos. I think that makes good sense, over all. The blindsight is a nice touch. Replacing the still mind and granting the nondetection have been necessary for a long time now. I'm still not sold on the anti-chaos-thing, (as you already know), but otherwise, I really like it! Also, add to this the never needing to eat or drink, and "Flawless Victoly"!
Ex-Monks: A monk who becomes nonlawful cannot gain new levels as a monk but retains all monk abilities.
And the nice finishing touch! Excellent.
Well, there's my (far, far too) comprehensive critique of your monk revision! Boy, I bet you didn't know what you were getting into when you asked for it, eh?
I'm still looking at critiquing the mind mage and assassin classes, though, like this one, it may take some time before I'm actually able to do so.
Anyway! I hope this helped and was enjoyable for you, as well!
Peace! Joy! Fuzzy Bunnies!
Tacticslion
Yar! This here be a quote box for the copy-pastin' so I don't gots to be typin' it out all the time! In Pirate! Yar!
So, this is pretty standard and pretty great. Except. (of course there was an "except"!). The Scorpion Style Feat Tree. Especially of note is that last one, Cockatrice Strike. The reason? Well, it takes four feats, but by the end (which would basically be a capstone ability for a monk, aka 19th level for that +14 BAB), you can insta-kill something at will. This greatly weakens the monks' power (comparatively) if his personal one is only once per day. What if you made it for at no cost once per day, but made additional uses possible by spending, say, 6 ki? Again, this is me tossing an idea around, rather than saying "this is how it should be done!", but it just seems that monks should be able to do this super-special maneuver more than once. And, I mean, it's fifteenth level. It's not exactly like it's broken by that point, even with the ability to activate it later, it's still not super-powerful. Anyway, that's just me thinking! (Agh, run away!)
I admit, Cockatrice Strike is a powerful feat. It does come late in the game, though. I did consider using ki to power the Quivering Palm, but rather than that I chose instead to allow for the power to inflict damage even on a successful save (2 x the damage of the monk's unarmed strike). In combat, you use this ability, and if your attack roll is successful you deal your normal damage. Then, at any point in time up to 1 day/level thereafter, you can, as a free action, force the target to make a save or die. And if he makes it, he takes double the damage of your unarmed attack. There is nothing that stops you from using this free action in the same round you deliver quivering palm. Still, it is a thought, and 6 ki is very expensive. Let me think about it.
Again, the question becomes if this ignoring exhaustion counts against the duration of exhaustion or simply negates it for that time. Still, excellent ability, and sorely needed. It also works well with the earlier trait that allows you to ignore fatigue... and the way it's worded doesn't negate that ability either!
Don't have to negate it; after all the monk still has Endurance as a bonus feat. But the ability to ignore the effects of fatigue for 10 minutes per level for a point of ki has become obsolete. After all, he suffers no penalties for being fatigued. But there are very few effects that let you ignore exhaustion, even for a short time. So I think it works.
Very intriguing. I like the details here, and it's interesting that you made their DR into DR/chaos. I think that makes good sense, over all. The blindsight is a nice touch. Replacing the still mind and granting the nondetection have been necessary for a long time now. I'm still not sold on the anti-chaos-thing, (as you already know), but otherwise, I really like it! Also, add to this the never needing to eat or drink, and "Flawless Victoly"!
I didn't want to change the monk's type to outsider (affects TOO many things, and there have been arguments forever over what exactly he gets. But I did want to show a transfiguration, if you will, into a more perfect version of himself. So, I guess I succeeded.
I am just glad that you enjoyed it.
Master Arminas
Yep! I really did like it! A lot! It is an excellent piece of class design!
The change to outsider does make a certain amount of sense, and I've always accepted it (never had any problems with it, myself), but I really like the spin you put on it. The immunities and protections basically do what that did for the monk plus a bit more, in some ways, and I like how it all shook down in the end.
As for thinking about it - that's really where most of my critiques and suggestions come from: the idea of "hey, think about this" as opposed to "hey, yeah, totally do this, you must!", so I'm glade you're taking it the former way, not the latter.
Also, I enjoyed reading about your code. I liked the way it constantly went "yeah, this is great, I-!" and then it totally dipped into evil just a bit when it had been basically "good" before. Well crafted.
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Well, I think our work here is done, folks. I have posted the (please let it be) final revision on a new thread located here: revised monk.
Master Arminas
Heh. Yeah, I did the Strictures and Morals a while back and they were first thing I actually posted here on Paizo's boards. It kind of embraces the duality of lawful neutral monks, doesn't it? The actual character Arminas (that I played for years) was originally Lawful Evil, but he eventually became Lawful Neutral. His order is still tilted along that axis.
Glad you liked it.
Master Arminas