|
BrightHammer 40K: 2nd EditionI know you are being funny, but it already sounds more fun to me :).They could always play Brighthammer 40K. In the Noble Brightness of the 41st millennium, there is only HIGH ADVENTURE!Basically it's far too grim for me.That is what I love about the Warhammer Universe. It is not rainbows puppydogs and Unicorns.
Dude, Brighthammer was hysterical, it totally reads as if Paizo re-wrote Warhammer 40k: In the Bright Cheerfulness of the 41st millenium, there is only RAINBOWS and PUPPIES! I definitely prefer the grim darkness of the 41st millenium though, where there is ONLY WAR!
By the way, to continue the commentary on rules and game mechanics for the OP: experience in 40k differs from D&D/Pathfinder in that in 40k, you "spend" experience points to buy bonuses to stats, skills, and talents. The best way I can describe talents is they are the 40k equivalent of feats. They give you bonuses in combat with certain maneuvers, or they make new combat maneuvers possible. Some talents only provide non-combat bonuses though.
There is a levelling system in 40k, with eight "ranks". Characters start at rank 1 and eventually reach rank 8. The way you level is by spending a certain amount of xp. Note that simply receiving a certain amount of xp doesn't level you, you have to spend that amount. Each rank gives you access to new skills, talents, etc that you can buy with xp.
Hope this helps!
My group has been playing Dark Heresy for years now - I totally love the setting. We basically stopped played DnD 3.0 and went 40k.
As others have mentioned there are three flavors of 40k, in my opinion DH is the best way to actually get to know the setting.
If you want to play DH I would advise you to get the intro adventure: The Edge of Darkness. It is a good adventure and showcases the setting in a good way.
I've read that the other official adventures are sorely lacking so I would like to point you to some that I wrote ;> (see my profile for a link)
ETA
Link no longer seems to work, so search for these titles: The Arastus Affair, Operation Cleansweep and Leave no Stone Unturned.
That's the one. Edge of Darkness is the second one we played. It was quite good with some minor modification...and some reconstructive work because of funky editing/formatting.
M
WH 40K is also a morally relative setting. Meaning that there is no black and white, right and wrong, politically correct liberal hippy care bear morality that the GM must enforce with an iron fist.
I disagree. 40K is not a morally neutral setting. Traveller's Imperium is a morally neutral setting. Warhammer, fantasy or 40 K, is more of a morally bleak setting. The only analogy I can use is Paranoia played straight, or rather played for internal laughs. But that's what makes it unique.
Looked at differently, 40 K trades the "politically correct liberal hippy care bare mentality" for bigotry as parody. If your character isn't a racist jihadi, you've missed the point.
The rules are suitably grim, yet equally accessible. If you want a game that's full of stark action and black comedy, it's perfect. What's possibly the only downside is that it's better the more you are "in on the joke" in the sense of knowing Warhammer and it's universe.
As for Ciaphas Cain, he's OK but really I'm not a fan of the "accidental hero who's really a coward" schtick. Terry Pratchett does it far better with Rincewind and even then he's one of my least favourite Discworld characters. Basically, it's been done. Rincewind, Flashman, Blackadder, they have all done it better. That said Cain isn't really high on my least favourite things from the 40k universe list so I'll give him a pass.
The cleverest thing about Cain is that he isn't just Flashman in space (which is a common shorthand for him). Cain is actually much more obsessed with his image and protecting it, even if it means charging into battle with a Chaos Space Marine solo. Flashman doesn't give that much of a toss about his image if it's a choice between that or his life. So, whilst it's not always for the most laudable of reasons, Cain is actually a much braver and far more capable character than most make him out to be.
If we want to give it a try, how knowlegeable do we need to be on the game world and it's story / history? Few, if any, of us have ever played Warhammer in any incarnation ...
It's basically the 18-rated, giga-DUNE-sized version of STARCRAFT (possibly a mistake to mention that in a WH40K thread, as the relationship between the two franchises can be a sore point for some fans).
Essentially, it's 38,000-odd years in the future, everything's pretty miserable and everyone's got a headache. The Emperor of Man is a semi-comatose cripple whose been kept alive by life-support tech for 10,000 years. His psychic essence allows human FTL travel. If he dies, the Imperium will fragment apart and be consumed by various ravenous dark gods, evil alien races or bored to death by sanctimonious space elves (who caused everything to screw up in the first place but are too stuck up to admit it). The Imperium is protected by a hundred-billions-strong standing army, the Imperial Guard, and a hundreds of thousands-strong army of genetically-engineered, eight-foot-tall superhuman Space Marines who are dedicated to wiping out the enemies of humanity with extreme prejudice. They're cranky all the time as they never get to have sex.
Humanity's principle enemies are green space cockneys (aka the Orks), the unrelenting forces of Chaos (who are pretty similar to the unrelenting forces of the Imperium, but have an unhealthy obsession with the colour purple, not the Whoopi Goldberg film), the Necrons (undead Borg) and the Tyranids (whom WH40K fans will tell you repeatedly are where Blizzard stole the idea for the Zerg from, whilst glossing over their debt to the ALIEN movies). There's also the Eldar (aforementioned Space Elves From Space) and the Tau (irritating aliens who have some cool mechs) who are frequently also at war with humanity, but have been known to form (very) brief alliances with the Imperium against their mutual foes (everyone else), though probably not as frequently as the DAWN OF WAR games would have you believe.
The best thing about the setting is its ludicrous and grandiose over-the-top, SF-if-it-was-written-by-Spinal Tap premise and the everything-and-the-kitchen-sink nature of the setting, which allows for everything from mech battles between war machines so huge that they could crush the entire BATTLETECH roster of merchs under one foot to very tense and claustraphobic, ALIEN-style bug-hunts on ancient derelict spacecraft and everything inbetween. This is also the worst thing about the setting; finding the part of it (either in fiction or gaming) that appeals best to your own tastes can be a tricky task.
But, Werthed, where do the players fit into all this misery? If they don't play eight-foot-tall sex-starved death machines, who can they play?
But, Werthed, where do the players fit into all this misery? If they don't play eight-foot-tall sex-starved death machines, who can they play?
Well, they play the heroes of the game! The lowly mooks that keep the imperium running by ferreting out Chaos, Mutants and everyone else who made the non-human list.
The PC's die so that MAN endures!
This is the essence of the game, you are going to die, maybe not the first session, but sometime soon as the enemies of MAN are numerous. As an acolyte of the Inquisition you aspire to become Gilded - your deeds will be written down in a book, book is covered with molten gold and laid down before the god-emperor (the dead guy on the golden throne) so that he may know your deeds.
I am GM-ing now but the fate of my characters:
Tauron Hunt - Pilot (adept), shot in the head by fellow acolytes after becoming infected by a zombie mutagen on a space hulk.
Zed - psyker and gifted swordsman, got sliced and diced by a cyborg assassin.
? - mind wiped assassin, captured by a foul cult he and his fellow acolytes tried to escape, took a wrong turn and after slaying many cultists he was downed in a hail of bullets.
|
|
It's basically the 18-rated, giga-DUNE-sized version of STARCRAFT (possibly a mistake to mention that in a WH40K thread, as the relationship between the two franchises can be a sore point for some fans).
...
and the Tyranids (whom WH40K fans will tell you repeatedly are where Blizzard stole the idea for the Zerg from, whilst glossing over their debt to the ALIEN movies)
Interesting trivia. Games Workshop licensed the brand new Blizard Games to create a RTS based on it's Warhammer IP. When the game was about 3/4 of the way completed, Games Workshop pulled the license. So Blizard did the only sane thing for a fledgeling company to do, they completed the game and changed some stuff, releasing it as "Warcraft". Just as GW eventually took Warhammer into space, Blizard also took Warcraft into space, calling it Starcraft. They've never been overly shy or sublte about the fact that Warcraft/Starcraft borrows HEAVILY from Warcraft/40K.
Does kinda make you wonder if World of Warhammer would exist if they had never lost the license.
But, Werthed, where do the players fit into all this misery? If they don't play eight-foot-tall sex-starved death machines, who can they play?
Well, they can play the eight-foot-tall, sex-starved death machines (the Space Marines) and as mentioned upthread, that's the premise of DEATHWATCH.
Or they can play as the Inquisition (the mostly-human investigators/Gestapo, delete as appropriate, of the Imperium) or as rogue traders (civilian starship crew, or the closest equivalent). There does seem to be a gap in the RP market in that the Imperial Guard - the 'normal' human soldiers - don't have their own game yet and neither do the aliens (playing as Tyranids or Necrons is presumably impossible, but playing as Eldar or Tau would seem to be viable, or Orks for a bit of comedic variety), but I assume homebrew rules allowing people to play as those factions exist somewhere.
Interesting trivia...
Hah, I did know that but didn't want to get too far OT. And I am surprised that Games Workshop never took legal action. The 'taking your fantasy game and setting it in space' thing was very close to the knuckle, as were the Space Marine/Terran Marine, Eldar/Protoss, Tyranid/Zerg comparisons. I actually think STARCRAFT has done a reasonable job of taking the same very basic building blocks and forging a different kind of setting and story out of them, but certainly at the beginning things were very eyebrow-raisingly similar between the two franchises.
But, Werthed, where do the players fit into all this misery? If they don't play eight-foot-tall sex-starved death machines, who can they play?
The one game that draws me to the 40K universe is Rogue Trader. The group starts in a place where most other campaigns end. They hold positions of power and the ability to create their own destiny. The ship they command has tens of thousands of troops and their actions can change the course of planets.
The scope of the game is well beyond any other game I've seen out there.
For the record, I'm *very* interested in Rogue Trader.
Travelling the 40K universe on a warrant of exploration for profit is a great campaign premise and if the $60 price tag weren't so intimidating, I'd already be playing it.
Clarify one thing for me, though, RT players. I understand the assumption is that the Traders are leading a huge ship filled with dozens or hundreds of faceless crewmembers. Is this true? Since I'm more a fan of the Firefly-like small crew of wealth-seekers, would it be a challenge to just sort of ignore that part and play the game as if the PCs were the only people on the ship?
Also, as a big fan of the ol' Warhammer Fantasy RPG rules, how closely does the RT rules adhere to that?
Oh, and how are the adventures published by Fantasy Flight?
The crew of the ships in the main book, are in the tens of thousands. In the other books and support pdf's(like Drydock) there might be smaller ships, but I am not sure of that.
Let me start by saying I have not played the game yet. I was not familiar with the setting so I read the Eisenhorn series (suggested by people on the FFG boards) and I liked it. I have owned the core book for a little over a year now, along with 3-4 of the accessory books. We have 3 DMs in our group so we usually take turns running campaigns and my next one should be a RT game. With this in mind I'll try to answer your questions.
One player plays the "rogue trader" or the guy in charge, the rest of the group are his most trusted allies. I think you could play it anyway you like (never watched Firefly) but according to the book the "ship" should be like an NPC of sorts. The ships in the setting have long histories, most of them are thousands of years old. The rules include ways to define your ship's characteristics. These ships are kilometers long so they are more similar to cities than they are ships. As such, I think you could have the opportunity to introduce some good NPCs that the party can have regular interactions with considering the "city" goes everywhere they go!
I don't think RT is very close to the WH Fantasy at all. From what I know about the fantasy game you use a dice pool while RT (DH and DW too) use a percentage system. You have ratings in your abilities from 1-100, if you roll lower than your score you succeed. When you gain XP you "spend" it to gain new abilities. Every class has about 10-15 abilities at each level to choose from. Also in RT there are rules to resolve larger scale conflicts using command checks which seem good in theory but I've never used them.
From what I've read the adventures from FFG are a mixed bag. There are really good ones, and some not so good ones. They have quite a bit of free stuff on their site, including an intro adventure for every setting (RT, DH, and DW) that includes any rules you need to run the scenario. You could check it out there for free if you wanted and decide if it's for you. There are also some pretty good campaign threads on their boards, especially the one by Marvin the Arvin titled "For Profit and Plunder- A PC's Tale".
I'll post a few links below. The first two are on the FFG website, the third is a campaign blog I stumbled across that I liked. Good reading!
There does seem to be a gap in the RP market in that the Imperial Guard - the 'normal' human soldiers - don't have their own game yet and neither do the aliens (playing as Tyranids or Necrons is presumably impossible, but playing as Eldar or Tau would seem to be viable, or Orks for a bit of comedic variety), but I assume homebrew rules allowing people to play as those factions exist somewhere.
I believe there are rules in RT that allows you to play an Ork Freebooter or a Kroot Mercenary.
|
There does seem to be a gap in the RP market in that the Imperial Guard - the 'normal' human soldiers - don't have their own game yet and neither do the aliens (playing as Tyranids or Necrons is presumably impossible, but playing as Eldar or Tau would seem to be viable, or Orks for a bit of comedic variety), but I assume homebrew rules allowing people to play as those factions exist somewhere.I believe there are rules in RT that allows you to play an Ork Freebooter or a Kroot Mercenary.
The rules can be found in: "Into the Storm", which is available here at Paizo.
It's basically the 18-rated, giga-DUNE-sized version of STARCRAFT (possibly a mistake to mention that in a WH40K thread, as the relationship between the two franchises can be a sore point for some fans).
...
and the Tyranids (whom WH40K fans will tell you repeatedly are where Blizzard stole the idea for the Zerg from, whilst glossing over their debt to the ALIEN movies)
Interesting trivia. Games Workshop licensed the brand new Blizard Games to create a RTS based on it's Warhammer IP. When the game was about 3/4 of the way completed, Games Workshop pulled the license. So Blizard did the only sane thing for a fledgeling company to do, they completed the game and changed some stuff, releasing it as "Warcraft". Just as GW eventually took Warhammer into space, Blizard also took Warcraft into space, calling it Starcraft. They've never been overly shy or sublte about the fact that Warcraft/Starcraft borrows HEAVILY from Warcraft/40K.
Does kinda make you wonder if World of Warhammer would exist if they had never lost the license.
I read an article in a computer game mag where Blizzard claimed that the original Starcraft game was a Star Wars license - that got pulled and they had to recreate it. I don't know what to make of that.
But one thing worth considering is that maybe IP laws aren't all that. Would the world have been a better place if it didn't have Starcraft?
I wasn't advocating that GW should have sued Blizzard (though people have done so and won in cases with less cause). WARCRAFT and STARCRAFT are fun and they've certainly developed over the years in very different (for example, panda-oriented) directions to the GW originals. I actually spent a long time trying to get my old gaming group to play the STARCRAFT RPG (the ALTERNITY-based one) as I thought it would be a lot of fun, and the relatively small scale and constrained setting of the franchise is a good contrast to 40K.
I didn't know about the optional rules for Imperial Guard and some of the alien races in the core books. I might look into picking them up, though it's been a while since I last gamed.
I don't think RT is very close to the WH Fantasy at all. From what I know about the fantasy game you use a dice pool while RT (DH and DW too) use a percentage system. You have ratings in your abilities from 1-100, if you roll lower than your score you succeed. When you gain XP you "spend" it to gain new abilities. Every class has about 10-15 abilities at each level to choose from. Also in RT there are rules to resolve larger scale conflicts using command checks which seem good in theory but I've never used them.
If you look at 2nd ed WHFRPG, that is where the base rules where DH, RT, and DW come from, not 3rd.
Thanks to the heads up, I was able to download the RT intro/quickstart rules and check it out. Rules-wise, it does seem very comprable to WHFRP. (2nd edition at least. I don't know that I was even aware of a 3rd edition)
City-sized space ships of 10,000 crewmembers seems a bit beyond the scope of what I enjoy, though. I didn't see anything that suggested I'd be arrested for fudging that at my table and declaring ships to be a lot smaller with a very reduced crew.
I'll have to take a peak at those ship creation rules and see what I can manipulate.
Step 3, then, is to invite my local Pathfinder group over some night for a Rogue Trader sampler.
Thanks to the heads up, I was able to download the RT intro/quickstart rules and check it out. Rules-wise, it does seem very comprable to WHFRP. (2nd edition at least. I don't know that I was even aware of a 3rd edition)
City-sized space ships of 10,000 crewmembers seems a bit beyond the scope of what I enjoy, though. I didn't see anything that suggested I'd be arrested for fudging that at my table and declaring ships to be a lot smaller with a very reduced crew.
I'll have to take a peak at those ship creation rules and see what I can manipulate.
Step 3, then, is to invite my local Pathfinder group over some night for a Rogue Trader sampler.
No one is going to send in a wetwork team to deal with you no.
However, when you might consider is using elements of the rules from both dark heresy and rogue trader to play the crew of a much smaller vessel, confined to a single, if every large star system.
At that level you would be able to play a much more firefly like game, struggling for freedom within the imperium of man.
City-sized space ships of 10,000 crewmembers seems a bit beyond the scope of what I enjoy, though. I didn't see anything that suggested I'd be arrested for fudging that at my table and declaring ships to be a lot smaller with a very reduced crew.
You won't be arrested, but to my thinking, it's changing a fact that operates on a core thematic level (and attaches to some of the ship rules), which I find a curious choice to make.
*cough* Traveller: it's firefly in space! *cough*
City-sized space ships of 10,000 crewmembers seems a bit beyond the scope of what I enjoy, though. I didn't see anything that suggested I'd be arrested for fudging that at my table and declaring ships to be a lot smaller with a very reduced crew.You won't be arrested, but to my thinking, it's changing a fact that operates on a core thematic level (and attaches to some of the ship rules), which I find a curious choice to make.
*cough* Traveller: it's firefly in space! *cough*
The traveller ruleset would suit "firefly' a lot better - the rules state that running around ship getting it ready for hyperspace is doable and often done on a 100 ton vessel
For the individual who wants to play a "Firefly" like game using these rules. Just because the average ship is gigantic and has hundreds of people on them doesn't mean that the concept wouldn't be the same. The PC's will be the ship's main crew and do their part to ensure the ship keeps flying. All other people on board can be replaced with "mindless" servitors whose only function is to do the same mundane task over and over again because someone has to do it. That way the focus can be on the PC's ensuring they do their job and if the whole rest of the ship gets vaporized for some reason, it's ok, because they were mostly machines anyways.
Definitely check out the EISENHORN and RAVENOR trilogies from Dan Abnett, which seem to have been inspirations on the RPGs. They're primarily about an Inquisitor (actually, two different Inquisitors with rather different ways of operating) and his retinue and how they confront the forces of Chaos, but several different Rogue Traders show up as well with their ships and they are shown to vary a lot. Tons and tons of servitors (think of STAR WARS astromechs, but cyborgs with probably less individuality) make up most of the ship crews with notable human crewmembers somewhat few and far between.
Also, a few Deathwatch Space Marines show up at one point as well, so you actually get a taste for all three RPGs from the books. Plus they're pretty damn good as well :-)
All other people on board can be replaced with "mindless" servitors whose only function is to do the same mundane task over and over again because someone has to do it.
How is that different from the regular crews of Rogue Trader ships? ;)
There does seem to be a gap in the RP market in that the Imperial Guard - the 'normal' human soldiers - don't have their own game yet...Dark Heresy, Guardsman career path.
The new RPG "Only War" seems to be the answer to the original conundrum... But I'm very interested in Black Crusade at the moment.
I thought I would try my hand at creating a character, so I "rolled up" a Psyker (I didn't realize they were "overpowered" for the game)... =(
He seems to right now be torn between Slaanesh and Tzeentch as far as advancements go, but since they are allied, he'll probably keep it pretty balanced.
Hmm, does anyone know if these play well on pbp?
We are playing both Dark Heresy and Deathwatch, and they are fun to play on pbp. Our GM is really good at descriptions and that does play out well. We were learning the rules together and do not get upset with rule corrections or interpretations. If you are willing to put the effort, the result can be a ball to play or GM.
Sounds good. I'd love to play in a pbp game (not as DM).
I just ran a couple of sessions of DH for the first time. I ended up doing a homebrew adventure and it went well. The rules seem to work fairly well, and combat was fun with the hit location and crit rules.
My biggest challenge is that I'm not really that familiar with the setting, so just trying to figure out how fairly mundane things in warhammer function in the universe is hard for me. The most challenging part is reconciling the ideas of a society with a lot of really high tech stuff that mixed with a medieval outlook and a baroque asthetic.
I was running an adventure on hive Sibellus, and I found it difficult to imagine what llfe would be like for the citizens. I spent a lot time trying to visualize what things like cars and other mundane tech might look like in warhammer. I think I did a did a reasonably good job at capturing the tone of the setting, but I was wishing that I had a resource with more information on daily life in a hive city. It's much easier to depict a huge futuristic city in a universe where people embrace technology, but I enjoyed the challenge of trying to do it warhammer style.
Don't forget it is a dying society, where ignorance is encouraged, and dogma is emphasized. The Inquisition and Adeptus Astartes can order planets destroyed if they think the heresy, or aliens, or daemons are too entrenched. The planet cannot recovered for The God-Emperer of Man. (Let the galaxy burn. Death to False Emperer. I am a Chaos player in WH40K.)
Lorm, you really should run a Black Crusade PBP :-)
+ Infinity.
Balfic would be better at it, Rad. He knows the history inside and out. I thinking of running a tabletop game with Balfic as one of my players, if my job schedule ever becomes stable.
Where is the elusive Balfic! Countless Worlds are waiting to be seized upon... =P
Here is my Chaos psyker, Adoris Kalmath. I thought I might get some opinions. He's not optimized, most likely, as I was just going with the idea in my head rather than trying to create a most-likely-to-survive character.
Pride Beauty; Disgrace Wrath; Motivation Dominion
WS 35; BS 38; S 35; T 36; Ag 29; Int 41; Per 46; WP 47; Fel 49; Inf 26
Movement 2/4/6/8; Wounds 11
Armor flak cloak (3 all but Head); Total TB 3
Infamy Points 2
Skills Awareness (Per), Common Lore (Screaming Vortex, Tech); Charm (Fel); Deceive (Fel); Dodge (Agi); Forbidden Lore (Int) (Psykers); Linguistics (Int) (Low Gothic); Psyniscience (Int), Trade (Voidfarer);
Talents: Child of the Warp, Jaded, Psy Rating 3, Radiant Presence
Traits: The Quick and the Dead
Weapons:
Laspistol (Pistol; 30 m; S/2/-; 1d10+2 E; Pen 0; Clip 30; Reload Half),
Greatsword (2d10 R; Pen 0, Unbalanced [-10 to parry, cannot lightning attack])
Psychic Powers: Delude, Mind Probe, Precognition, Thought Sending
Remember, you can reroll one characteristic, but you must accept the second roll. I would suggest using a lighter weopon and leave the melee, when possible, to the fighter types. I have a question, what path would you choose, what did you spend your 1000 xp's on?
+5 Willpower, +5 Fellowship, Charm (trained), and Radiant Presence. I see him as a combination Slaanesh/Tzeentch path. (Thus unaligned).
One of the reasons I see him as a melee is because of the background I had originally envisioned for him, but that (like most things in the real electronic world) is mutable.
So retrain to Las Weapons, and go back to a normal blade. =P
The reason I said leave the melee for fighters, is that I play a psyker in the Dark Heresy pbp, and He is definitely a better shot then melee. plus he uses his pschic powers to make him even better shot. I am not saying you can't do it the other way, but considering you made him a telepath, his abilities would come in play better at a distance. (I am still not planning on running a game, but I don't mind making suggestions or talking about the game.)
Another factor is that with ranged weapons, you get bonuses for everything under the sun. Sights, proximity, all sorts of improvements will add to your chance to hit. Melee gets virtually nothing.
Another factor is that with ranged weapons, you get bonuses for everything under the sun. Sights, proximity, all sorts of improvements will add to your chance to hit. Melee gets virtually nothing.
You can get bonuses for melee. Weapon quality, prone targets, gang up bonuses, all out attack, aim action etc...
However, I agree it is easier to get bonuses for ranged attacks.
Cool, thanks for the advice... I'm not one of those who completely absorbs Rulebooks, I usually have to play it to understand it better, but I am told that it is easy to pick up. =)
Weapon quality is x10 cost for +10% bonus, which amounts to a honking lot of money - it is ages before you can afford any serious weapons that way. Knives, though? Yes, probably. Prone targets have to be made prone or oblige by lying down, gang up bonuses are tough getting when you're the only meleer, all out attack means you don't get any sort of defense roll, and aim gives the same bonus as for ranged. However, if you use shotguns, rifles and longbows, you make extra "hits" if you hit well enough, leading to hugely massive damage. This, too, is harder to get with melee.
True Sissyl.
However, I would point out that melee is still useful. In our last session the PCs ended up in battle with a gun servitor and a combat servitor, both could soak 10 damage from each hit. That meant that the guns the characters were firing were fairly useless even when they scored multiple hits with semiauto mode because the damage reduction was soaking nearly everything. If they were lucky they scored a point of damage. If they had invested in some specialized ammo (like manstopper rounds) it would have been a different story (or if they had better guns, like bolters or inferno guns).
In the fight, one PC had a good quality sword ( x 3 cost +5% to hit) with a mono treatment. The mono treatment upped the penetration by 2, so even though he was only hitting with one shot a round he was still netting more damage than the PC firing at the thing with a lasgun on semi auto mode. Of course, the downside was he was on the receiving end of the thing's chain axe and ended up losing his right foot to a critical hit before putting it down.
Weapon quality is x10 cost for +10% bonus, which amounts to a honking lot of money - it is ages before you can afford any serious weapons that way. Knives, though? Yes, probably. Prone targets have to be made prone or oblige by lying down, gang up bonuses are tough getting when you're the only meleer, all out attack means you don't get any sort of defense roll, and aim gives the same bonus as for ranged. However, if you use shotguns, rifles and longbows, you make extra "hits" if you hit well enough, leading to hugely massive damage. This, too, is harder to get with melee.
Personally I regard the 40k universe in the exact same way that I regard the 90's comics of Rob Leifeld. Yes it's dark but dark doesn't automatically mean cool. On the contrary there's no joy in this setting, no extravagance, no humour. It's miserable, depressing and unpleasant with not a single character, race or organisation that inspires any form of empathy whatsoever.
First of all, you have to be kidding me...No humour? Your not british, are you?
Dark humour is one underlying and ongoing threads of the setting. There are entire novels which are dedicated to characters like black adde...i mean flashma... no sorry ciaphas cain, who never meet a witch which couldn't be solved with a laspistol.
As for extravagance, this is a universe where shrine world have statues of saints built from mountains the size of Everest, and where millions walk in silent prayer for a week. There is great grandure and extravigance in the setting. It sounds to me like you haven't really had much experience with 40k's setting.
Lol.
Am I British? Yup. Born in Kent, raised in Wales, live in England.
No experience of the setting? Played in 4 40k Grand Tournaments.
Still find the setting humourless.
The reason for the whole grimdark atmosphere is to make the table-top game edgy and cool for the spoilt ten year-olds who make up the majority of the market. GW never advance the plot so you're stuck with a decaying Imperium where nothing ever changes. The fantasy flight games actually let you change that somewhat as there is a sense that you can make a difference.
Also, Fletch, if you can wait a bit they're releasing an Imperial Guard themed version called Only War. Looks like it could be fun. If you want a slightly less depressing campaign stick with Dark Crusade or Rogue Trader though, they're a bit less "My life for the Emperor!" and more "Well I'm going to have a bit of fun, the Emperor be...
Funny, i must be a ten year old, for it was not until I was in my late teens, early twenties that I really started to appreciate the setting of both warhammer and 40k, just like I didn't really get Call of Cthulhu until about the same time.
If you think dark heresy(orignially written while black industries was still around by the way), or any of the other 40k rpgs lets to make a difference, you have missed the point. Your victories are near meaningless on a gallactic scale.
The grimdark has very little to do with making warhammer 'edgy or cool' and has vastly more to with the fact that the guys behind it where massive 2000 AD and Michael Moorcock fans.