So I came across targeted bomb admixture and thought to self, self this could make things interesting.
so let just fast forward our alchemist to level 20
Fast Bombs (+3 attacks), Force Bomb, Sticky Bomb, Rapid Shot (+1 attack), Greater TWF(+3 attacks), Haste(+1 attack)
And we settle out at a full attack of 8 attacks, the attack bonus is basically irrelevant because its all touch attacks.
INT start of 20, +6 enchament, +4 character level bonus, +8 alchemical total 38INT mod of +14
Base bomb damage 10d6+14
Force bomb damage 10d4+14
Splash damage 10+14= 24dmg
now throw on the new admixture
Force Direct Hit 10d4+28dmg = avg 53dmg
Force Splash 10+28 = 38dmg
And now lets throw 8 sticky force bombs at one target
8 x 10d4+28 = avg 424 force damage
and 1 round later = 304 force damage splash
Did I mention there's no save ? Did I mention he can do the same again next round
So round 1 424
round 2 304 + another 424 (sub tot 1152)
round 3 304 + another 424 (sub tot 1880)
round 4 304 + another 424 (sub tot 2608)
round 5 304 (grand total 2912)
and yes I have enough bombs to do that for 4 rounds ;)
so 2912 force damage no save over 5 rounds.
( oh as a side note you'd need to make about 24 hard fort saves or be knocked oh so very prone)
More than a little crazy.
What could stop or at least defuse this kind of damage?
You'd be looking at (unimproved) +14/+14/+14/+14/+9/+9/+4/+4 with greater two weapon fighting, finesse and haste - vs. touch. Most things don't have a high touch AC. About 25% of these attacks will probably miss (with the +4 to hits)
Displacement is a easy start. With 50% miss that's suddenly only 3 average hits. But that's still 100 damage per round with 3 saves.
Do you know how high touch AC can be on a lot of characters at level 20? I'm not 100% familiar with the bombs rules, but I am aware that through luck, morale, Dex, Deflection, and other modifiers, it is more than easy to get a touch AC over 30.
Also, I'd have to look this up, but do bombs make it through a wind wall or other such effects? And what about a wall of Force, or prismatic sphere? WHAT ABOUT THE EIDOLON BEHIND YOU READY TO BITE OFF YOUR HEAD!? Okay, now I am just making stuff up... but there are ways to counter it, I am sure, that would be pretty easy for any appropriately CR encounter.
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Bravo...you have created one of a million level 20 combos that are very impressive in their ability to kill stuff. If this is your proof that Alchemists are over powered throw it on the pile with the rest and get in the line marked axe to grind.
No need for people to be snippy. Did the author ever say this combo couldn't be defeated, or was the greatest thing in history? No. It is just a neat, strong combo he wanted to show off.
You don't even need to be level 20. 6 attacks at level 12, each hitting for 6d4+INT the first round and 6+INT the next is nothing to scoff at. Especially when the damage is hard to resist, offers no save, and can knock enemies prone. A CR appropriate enemy would have 160 hp... so, a one round kill with a modest 22 intelligence. Not shabby at all.
Your right, I appologize...I was being snippy. Personal life, plus disagrement = Overly aggressive post. Very sorry.
That being said this post feels like number 5000 in the unending string of " look, Look the class I dont like is too good at high levels" posts. It grinds my gears that people still feel the need to lobby for everyone to hate the things they dont like.
I always find it interesting how people interpret other people posts.
perhaps my humor was too subtle to indicate a light hearted post ;)
it was simply an isn't that interesting post. Who would ever play such a beast ? I mean really.
Come to the table with this craziness and the first thing your GM would do is Dominate your ass (pitty your will save sucks ;) ) and use you to kill half if not all of your fellow party members.
Or better yet Throw a CR25 version of this alchemist at the party as a BBEG ;)
Not that it matters but I currently play a level 12 Alchemist and although I could already have 8 bomb attacks I instead only have 3 , why ? because I'm not looking to break the game I'm in ;)
That said I still enjoy finding stuff like this.
Consider that at the back end it crazy but what about at first level ?
18INT alchemsit can now run with 1d6+8 fire bombs at level 1 with no splash. seems like a pretty decent attack to me.
I hope my post wasn't snippy... I was tired and crashing when I wrote it. In my group though, as the GM, I have to find ways to provide challenge to anything like that, so I immediately go to "how can this not be as overpowered as it seems?"
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I hope my post wasn't snippy... I was tired and crashing when I wrote it. In my group though, as the GM, I have to find ways to provide challenge to anything like that, so I immediately go to "how can this not be as overpowered as it seems?"
I don't take things on forums personally ;) there's just no point. I assume the person writing the post just has a different style of writing, different sense of humour etc etc and thus don't judge them on tone but instead on content. (well I try anyway ;) )
More than a little crazy.
What could stop or at least defuse this kind of damage?
You'd be looking at (unimproved) +14/+14/+14/+14/+9/+9/+4/+4 with greater two weapon fighting, finesse and haste - vs. touch. Most things don't have a high touch AC. About 25% of these attacks will probably miss (with the +4 to hits)
Displacement is a easy start. With 50% miss that's suddenly only 3 average hits. But that's still 100 damage per round with 3 saves.
IIRC if we're allowing V3.5 stuff located in the Spell Compendium tome are a number of nifty protective lowish level spells.
Forceward - Immune to force effects I think is 4th lvl
Ray deflection - prevents ranged touch attacks 3rd ish.
Scintillating scales - turns natural armor into deflection bonus 3rd
So it is possible to render the attack or damage ineffectual or useless. I don know if there are PF versions of these spells but after Dming a group with Wands of Orbs of Force a hasty search of the Splat books turned up those 3 gems!