So as you said, rules for designing your classes, i agree with that, would this book also be based on introducing new base classes or just additional info for existing classes?
Actually I really enjoyed the idea of breaking up the system and tinkering with it. I know most people will say "play game X if you want Y" but what I would like is the ability to see a value of some sort that showed where mechanical balance was. Like an additional feat at level 1 is worth x points (They used xp cost of leveling in 2e). I just like the option of playing D&D/d20/PF with an ala carte aproach to classes. I know this is near impossible as it is very hard to balance things in the system, and every little thing can turn into something big, but itd still be cool. Sadly I know too many people who would just try their hardest to get the most out of it in a munchkin way...
I'd like to see something that allows for the creation of new classes that currently people would probably dismiss due to believing they fall under the purview of an existing class when instead the new class may be interpreted as very different by the one doing the wanting.
+ 1,000,000.00
Interesting -- if other threads from today can be believed, it looks as though this product will actually exist!
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Put simply -
An artificer/engineer. Cheapy has amassed a collection/compiled a list of scores of these - let's see Paizo make an official one!!!
Swashbuckler - again, there are a lot of these floating about. Same again, let's see Paizo make one!!!
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1. a Swordsage Alike; uses a series of Martial Techniques that provide options pooled from a variety of disciplines and are useable at will. but not explicitly faux-oriental. the techniques would all Be Ex or Su and would mimic a lot of heroic exploits from mythology. elements of eastern fantasy would be a appreciated if given a not so eastern skin on their eastern feats. think more Gourry and Kenshin Himura and less Guard 24.
2. a Spellcloak; a roguelike class that uses illusion spells to be a better assassin and set up sneak attacks. has a few buffs, some enchantments, teleportation, a few heals, a form of pounce light, but is generally more roguish and less castery. has a means to augment attack bonus and means to set up sneak attacks and ignore immunities to sneak attack
3. a custom class creation system
4. a chameleon type class that can mimic the features of other classes but can only mimic so many at one time based on their level. gains inspiration points per encounter to mimic other classe's features. gains every skill as a class skill and has a roguish base
5. an at will based caster class akin to the 3.5 warlock. has limited options, but can spam those options all day. should be roughly equal in power to an alchemist or inqusitor
6. a spontaneous casting counterpart to druids that in exchange for being less versatile with their spells, gains access to better animal companions and better combat features. such as templated wildshape forms or templated pets
7. an artificer/gadgeteer who builds magic items and creates infusions, has no true spellcasting power, but can fake it with a high enough UMD check for the purpose of crafting and has a resource pool that scales with level and gives free items. add a series of gadgetlike talents for the heck of it
8. a system for inherent bonuses based on leveling akin to Ashiel's Vow of Asceticism for the purpose of playing low magic games
9. guidelines for the class builder that don't sound like they were fudging the point costs to make every class equal
10. a series of general optimization guidelines made with PCs in mind who intend to do some minmaxing, none of the suboptimal iconic garbage. include sample builds that show what Paizo's boards have accomplished in the DPR olympics with step by step builds at intervals of 1st, 5th, and 10th.
That whom ever needs to die at Hasbro dose and leaving the rights to the Factotum to Lisa in their last will and testament so I can ones again play my favorite class and not feel gross about using a class from the past edition.
but until I find that lamp i will be happy with another great Paizo book because i have not been disappointing by one yet.
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Classes that are NOT way better than the core classes.
Classes that are NOT way better than the core classes.
the splat classes aren't WAY better. it just happens to be that optimizing them is a simpler and more straightforward process because the options are spelled out for you.
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The problem I see with custom class creation is that a class' power is determined a lot by how different abilities interact with each other. It would be difficult to make a class creation system. I mean, yeah, I still want to see it, but I would be fine without one.
I just hope we get a more martial capable shapeshifter.
The problem I see with custom class creation is that a class' power is determined a lot by how different abilities interact with each other. It would be difficult to make a class creation system. I mean, yeah, I still want to see it, but I would be fine without one.
I just hope we get a more martial capable shapeshifter.
that sounds cool, a martial shapeshifter
i also want to see
Wyvern and Pegasus mounts for cavaliers for the fire emblem fans
some specialized summoner-likes for different specialties with reasonably customizable pets
such as a conjurer/evoker who gets an elemental pet and focuses on elements rather than summons
a necromancer/diviner/abjurer with an undead pet
an illusionist/enchanter/transmuter with a cohort and thralls
I am going to wait till we see more info on the book...I just have a feeling it is going to be not just about those hybrid classes....there is going to be a couple more base classes...I just have that feeling.
But here is a short list.
1) Swashbuckler
2) finally lets see psychic magic(one of the reason why I think it is just not going be just ten base classes)
3) A Cleric/Rogue hybrid
4) A artificer type class
i wouldn't mind seeing openly takable alternate class features for rogues that replace sneak attack with some kind of passive static damage bonus that applies against everything. as an example
Dirty Fighting (Ex); a rogue with the dirty fighting alternate class feature gains a competence bonus to damage rolls equal to her rogue level when wielding a weapon she is proficient with due to her tendency to target weak points and the like. a rogue with dirty fighting for the purpose of prerequisites and effects based on number of sneak attack dice; is treated as having a number of sneak attack dice equal to half her rogue level rounded up. a character with dirty fighting who multiclasses into another sneak attacking class may sacrifice her sneak attack progression in that class to continue her dirty fighting progression. dirty fighting replaces sneak attack and all improvements of it
Pierce the Gap (Ex); a rogue of 3rd level or higher ignores 1 point of armor class and damage reduction from a foe she attacks, at 6th level and every 3 levels after, she ignores an additional point of armor class and damage reduction from that foe, to a minimum damage reduction of 0, and to a maximum amount of armor class ignored equal to the sum of her foes armor, natural armor and shield bonuses to armor class. this ability replaces trap sense. a ninja who takes this archetype instead replaces no trace.
such things would be welcome in my book
I just want some more prestige classes. Ones that are unique and useful, any way. Paizo is usually good about that, but every now and then, a really lackluster one shows up.
Oops. Posted in the "announcement" thread:
Seeing as they are apparently bringing out ten new Base Classes, I'm hoping they aren't all hybrids.
* At least one (or more) dedicated martial would be nice - a Swashbuckler definitely fits that design space. Or a shapeshifter - with SLAs perhaps, but not spells...
* If there is an artificer/engineer I'd like at least an option (archetype or hardcoded into ability suites) for a non-magical version - more steampunk and less arcanotech...
Heh. Seems I was two years ahead of my time when I posted this thread. :)
so did not see that..... weird ....
what am i geting for my birth day no wait what tomorrow lotto numbers
Swashbuckler - The main class missing in the line-up, IMO.
Martial Artist - A non-mystic frontline class which is based around martial arts.
As for the rest, I'll see what Paizo comes up with.
Heh. Seems I was two years ahead of my time when I posted this thread. :)
Prescient Base Class
I would like to see...
1)A Swashbuckler that is a full BA class that is dex based.
2)Shaman class that is a cha based spontaneous caster that uses the druid class list and has totem animal spirit instead of bloodlines or mysteries.
3)A full BA class that is like Jungle girl/tarzan archtypes, no armor, primitive weapons, monk like AC but uses cha, option animal companion or nature bond, favored terrain but more specialized in the terrain they were raised.
4)An artificer/engineer/inventor type class.
5)Psychic class that is a int based spellcaster like a wizard.
6)Esper class that is a cha based spontaneous caster for psychic magic.
7)Beastmaster class that specializes with animal comapanion, may get magical beast companions and/or magical beast version of animal companions, no spellcasting, full BA, gains some monster abilities like energy resistance, natural armor, breath weapon, etc. has wild empathy and can use it on magical beast with 2 or less int without penalty.
8)Psychic Warrior class that is like the magus but with psychic magic. Uses psychic ability to enhance there own abilities like jumping, str checks, mobility, etc.. Maybe a high level ability were they can use there highest mental stat for there str score.
9)A class(or archetype for bard)that uses art as a weapon, like creating short "lived" golems from blocks of wood/stone, creating portals through paintings, wall of paint, painting objects and creatures and making them real, pottery as weapon, etc..
Arcane Hierophant (Companion Familiar)
Monk + Spellcaster
Rider (Summoner + Cavalier)
Choir (Cleric + Bard)
Classes that I would like to see
Dex-based Swashbuckler
Shaman as a druid spontaneous caster
Engineer/artificer class, that gets a robot/clockwork companion
Psychic Magic classes, including a dedicated psychic magic user, a skill monkey psychic dabbler, and a fighter that augments his abilities with psychic magic
Necromancer (although Paizo would probably treat it like a anti-paladin)
An Assassin class
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Yeah I would like to add my voice to the call for a swashbuckler.
I really like the sound of the Shaman.
It's a shame "Assassin" is already used because the Slayer might fit that mould very well.
Psychic - With powers based broadly around telepathy, telekinesis, pyro/cryokinesis, ESP, channeling spirits and mind over matter (yogi) would be nifty. Few powers with broad applications.
Engineer - Robot companion, gadgets and gizmos. There's something to that.
So as you said, rules for designing your classes, i agree with that, would this book also be based on introducing new base classes or just additional info for existing classes?
James Jacobs has said that he wishes that Paizo never does this (IIRC). That being said, I believe they also said they were done adding base classes...
A Bard/Druid base class since I loved the fochlucan lyrist but I would love to see Paizos take on the idea.
So as you said, rules for designing your classes, i agree with that, would this book also be based on introducing new base classes or just additional info for existing classes?James Jacobs has said that he wishes that Paizo never does this (IIRC). That being said, I believe they also said they were done adding base classes...
He's also said he dislikes the Factotum and classes that copy others classes.
1)A shape shifting class with fighter AB, no spells, can turn into any creature type eventually, gain more benefits from shape shifting, etc..
2)Magic using rouge mix, cha based spontaneous caster with illusion, transmutation, abjuration, and divination magic.
3)Spontaneous cha based caster magus, maybe as an archetype.
4)Monk/caster mix with more ki and ki powers.
5)Class that has abilities focusing on resisting, dispelling, nullifying, reflecting, absorbing magic.
6)Sorcerer Bloodline based class that gains more sorcerer bloodline powers but focuses on combat, d8 HD, cleric BA, weapon/armor prof., little or no spell casting. Gains choice of bloodline ability at 1st, 2nd, and every two levels after. Must gain abilities based on one creature such as dragons, fey, celestials, fiends, etc..
More Archetypes like a jester one for bards, more summoner archetypes that change the Eidolons type(magical beast, plant, etc.), more spell less ranger archetypes.
Bloodline feats, some for sorcerers, others any one can get.
Chalk up one more vote for a desirable and playable swashbuckler.
1) Dread Necromancer - or similar undead horde leader.
2) Warlock(ish) - good(maybe avg) BAB, magical abilities that doesn't run out of juice(like combat hexes).
3) Arcane version of the paladin - 4th level wiz/sorc spells, good BAB, some arcane themed smite-like ability.
4) Shaman - spontanious druid/martial wildshaper
5) Psychic Magic users
Warlock (3.5ish), Swashbuckler, and rogue-mage. More spontaneous casters, like spontaneous magus.
I'm not having that much trouble with imagining that their new classes will explore not yet filled concepts. After all, when they first announced the APG classes, I was quite surprised at the niches they had discovered.
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I'd like to see a "Gambler" class, one that's abilities are based on manipulating chance/die rolls.
Also the engineer/gadgeteer/artificer type slot needs to be filled as well.
I would like to see them redo certain classes, like introduce a new spell system and have reworkings of some classes like the full casters.
I would also like to see an updated and improved version of the fighter, rogue, and cavalier.
Alignmentless paladins, and spontaneous versions of casters is pretty much guaranteed me thinks.
1) Swashbuckler
2) Swashbuckler
3) Swashbuckler
Probably very difficult to do given the nature of the xp system (which is primarily combat based), but it might be interesting to see some kind of non-combat, non-spellcasting roles filled. Something like a trader, who gains xp through diplomacy and bargaining, or the like.
I second the Artificer and Shapeshifter ideas.
A [primarily dwarf racial class?] "necromancer" class that is based solely on raising their ancestors' spirits and not just defiling the corpses of random creatures they happen to be near to. No alignment restrictions, but perhaps options based around alignment (like the cleric).
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Warlock (3.5ish), Swashbuckler, and rogue-mage. More spontaneous casters, like spontaneous magus.Adamant Entertainment already updated both the Warlock and the Swashbuckler to PF, and made them OGL, so there's no need for Paizo to do it again.
Unless the GM (like me) doesn't allow 3rd party classes. I'll pull bits and pieces from 3rd party adventures, (looking at you Adventure Path Plug-Ins!) but I will not allow 3rd party classes.
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Warlock (3.5ish), Swashbuckler, and rogue-mage. More spontaneous casters, like spontaneous magus.Adamant Entertainment already updated both the Warlock and the Swashbuckler to PF, and made them OGL, so there's no need for Paizo to do it again.
Three letters.
P
F
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Just Sayin'