Verdant Bloodline / Synthesist Rules Questions


Rules Questions


1 person marked this as FAQ candidate.

Hello everyone,

I am currently planing to play a Summoner (Synthesist) and have a few rules questions. I know that the Synthesist is currently rather strange regarding rules and tried to find answers but so far wasn't able to :(

Here are my questions:

1. Saves: Do I use my own Saves or the Eidolons? Since it says something about Physical Traits of the Eidolon, I would guess Reflex and Fortitude from the Eidolon, Will from the Char itself?

2. Senses: If my race has Low Light Vision, can I use that while inside the Eidolon?

3. Skills: The Description says that I can use all my abilities while fused. Does that mean that I can use Disable Device to open a lock (provided of course that I have ranks in DD) when I am fused to a quadruped Eidolon without arms?

4. Healing: That question has been asked before, I just write it down here to keep my list as complete as possible since ;)
How can the Eidolons HP be healed? It doesn't heal naturally and its HP are added to mine as temporary HP. Temp HP cannout be healed.

5. Abilities: If I have an ability like "Tanglevine" from the Verdant Bloodline that says that somethings grows out of my hand, does my Eidolon need hands so that I can use that ability while fused?

6. Tanglevine and AOOs: If I use Tanglevine from the Verdant Bloodline (acquired through Eldritch Heritage), does that Trip/Disarm/Steal Maneuver provoke AOOs?

Please don't use this thread to comment on my choice of character, feats or whatever, this is strictly about the rules! ;)


This is my best interpretation of the rules:

1) You use your own base saves. Since you use the physical stats from the Eidolon, this will affect your final Reflex and Fortitude scores.

2) Yes. You have all your own abilities.

3) Probably. We don't know exactly how it is supposed to work when fused to a non-biped form though. You could save yourself some headache by settling for the biped form. ;)

4) We don't know. The eidolon can't be target separately, so you can't target it to heal any HP loss it might have taken. I think the main schools of thought are either that: A) The eidolon can never be healed, so once it reaches half hp, it's hp total can never raise above this level. Or B) The eidolon doesn't actually take damage when you lose the temporary hit points it grants to you. Thus, the eidolon will always be at full health when you resummon it. Neither of these solutions are really optimal.

5) No, that's just fluff text. I'm pretty sure a verdant sorcerer could still use tanglevine if he had both hands chopped off.

6) I presume Tanglevine uses all the normal rules for the maneuver you are trying to do. Only it's at range, so the odds that the target can reach you to AoO aren't great. I'd also assume that abilities like tanglevine benefit normally from feats like Improved Trip.

PS. Synthesist + tanglevine is a pretty awesome visual. ;)


Slaunyeh wrote:

This is my best interpretation of the rules:

[...]

PS. Synthesist + tanglevine is a pretty awesome visual. ;)

Thank you for your insight... I really hope that there will be an FAQ or errata for the Synthesist soon!

Going Biped has it's charm, but pounce is just so nice to have... and even a Biped Form doesn't really have Hands since it automatically as the Claws Evolution :(

And a Synthesist in some kind of Basidirond with Tanglevine is what I am going for... the visual aspect is a strong factor for that :)


There was a dev comment, maybe in the "ask James" thread, where it was suggested to look at the temp hp as an extension of the characters hp. Basically, add the two together, and subtract from the eidolons pool first (similar to the normal temp hp rules). Once the eidolon pool is going to hit 0, the character can start "taking" the damage to keep the eidolon at 1 via the link. Taking it further, anything that heals the character/fused creature would heal the character hp pool first and once that was full start healing the eidolon hp pool with any excess up to the maximum of both pools together (unlike typical temp hp, which is where most of the RAW complaints stem from - temp hp should not have been referenced for this archtype).


Skylancer4 wrote:
There was a dev comment, maybe in the "ask James" thread, where it was suggested to look at the temp hp as an extension of the characters hp. Basically, add the two together, and subtract from the eidolons pool first (similar to the normal temp hp rules). Once the eidolon pool is going to hit 0, the character can start "taking" the damage to keep the eidolon at 1 via the link. Taking it further, anything that heals the character/fused creature would heal the character hp pool first and once that was full start healing the eidolon hp pool with any excess up to the maximum of both pools together (unlike typical temp hp, which is where most of the RAW complaints stem from - temp hp should not have been referenced for this archtype).

For reference, here's the quote:

James Jacobs wrote:
You don't heal the eidolon at all if it only gives you temp HP. It might help to stop thinking of the synthesist as a "summoner with an eidolon" but a "summoner IS the eidolon" sort of way. AKA: To heal your "eidolon" you just heal yourself.

From this interpretation (I don't know official it is yet) you might just be best off ignoring the 'temporary' part of the temporary hit points you get, and treat them as a healable pool of bonus hit points. That uses up party resources like everyone else, so that might be the best option. Of course, you could still kill and resummon the eidolon for a quick (well, not that quick) boost. :)

I'd say it's up to the GM to decide whether the summoner's own spells can be used to heal yourself (personally, I'd rule that you can use rejuvenate eidolon to heal the bonus hit points, but not your own).

Silver Crusade

Skylancer4 wrote:
There was a dev comment, maybe in the "ask James" thread, where it was suggested to look at the temp hp as an extension of the characters hp. Basically, add the two together, and subtract from the eidolons pool first (similar to the normal temp hp rules). Once the eidolon pool is going to hit 0, the character can start "taking" the damage to keep the eidolon at 1 via the link. Taking it further, anything that heals the character/fused creature would heal the character hp pool first and once that was full start healing the eidolon hp pool with any excess up to the maximum of both pools together (unlike typical temp hp, which is where most of the RAW complaints stem from - temp hp should not have been referenced for this archtype).

It just would have been easier to say its temp HP like A BArbarian and been through with it, cause thats How I see it

Shadow Lodge

Except that Barbarians don't get temp hp's. They gain a morale bonus to CON which increases their Max & Current HPs They also lose those HP when they lose that CON. If they were to have done that with the Eidolons, you'd end up with a lot of dead summoners.

Community / Forums / Pathfinder / Pathfinder First Edition / Rules Questions / Verdant Bloodline / Synthesist Rules Questions All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.
Recent threads in Rules Questions
Simulacrum