There's some stuff that 5e did well that I'd like to try out in Pathfinder. The big one is being able to spend Hit Die to heal during "short rests", which is about an hour long. Basically when you spend HD in this way, you roll the dice, add your Con modifier, and add the total to your HP. You can spend as many HD as you have but they only come back after a long rest (8 hours).
The reason why I'd like to do this is because I don't want the party to feel like they require a healer or buckets of potions and scrolls.
The other thing I wanted to try using is something from 4th edition, and that's minion monsters. In an effort to speed up combat I want to have creatures classified as "minion". Basically, they don't have HP. They only ever have three states: healthy, bloodied, and dead/incapacitated. The first time they're attacked from any source, they go one step down that track instead of damage being dealt. Three strikes and they're out. Thoughts on this?
I think the traditional answer to downtime healing is wands of CLW. Much cheaper than scrolls and potions. You get the bulk discount with wands. But if that's not something you want in your games, sure, your idea sounds fine.
I think monsters only being able to take 2 hits and only 2 hits is going to distort the game though. Someone will make a character, and it's not hard, whose job is to hit every minion twice during the first round, or maybe the surprise round. It disproportionately rewards being able to hit, and ignores damage entirely. 4E was built around it, I assume, but Pathfinder isn't.
What do you suggest on that second thing, then? Because I want combat to be sped up somehow, and I hate how combat is just a slog to see who runs out of hit points first.
What do you suggest on that second thing, then? Because I want combat to be sped up somehow, and I hate how combat is just a slog to see who runs out of hit points first.
Requiring three hits changes the game a lot. TWF becomes WAY better, STR bonuses matter a lot less...
At least against the minions.
I wouldn't change this mid-campaign, but it does sound like minor time saver (I mean, really, how hard is addition/subtraction?)
For minion rules: check out Rule Zero: Underlings by Minotaur Games.
The other thing I wanted to try using is something from 4th edition, and that's minion monsters. In an effort to speed up combat I want to have creatures classified as "minion". Basically, they don't have HP. They only ever have three states: healthy, bloodied, and dead/incapacitated. The first time they're attacked from any source, they go one step down that track instead of damage being dealt. Three strikes and they're out. Thoughts on this?
I'm rather iffy about that as in many ways it leads to the invalidation of builds that focus on fewer but more powerful hits (say a two handed weapon user) in favor of archers/two weapon fighters. Think of it this way:
Three identical Minions standing side by side.
1. Fighter charges in with greatsword and does 40 damage on one swing: Minion 1 is still up.
2. Wizard casts Magic Missile on Minion 2; three missiles streak in and deal about 10 damage total and Minion 2 dies.
3. Archer rapid shots 3 arrows at Minion 3 and deals about 30 damage total; Minion 3 dies.
Fighter glares at the DM.
Minions with flat HP amounts is probably more fair. That gives PC's a target to shoot for as far as damage infliction goes. LOW hp favors multiple attacks, higher HP favors 2h'ers. If you use low hp, then Cleave (the old version) becomes a useful tool again, letting you ream rows of low level minions.
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Healing via HD 5e style comes down to 'not relying on magic items'. Frankly, it's a style call more then anything. If you want to do away with healing magic items, it adds an egalitarian form of healing for everyone that favors high HD melee types, who need it most.
Classes who have healing magic will still have it. Whether or not non-healer classes will have access to healing magic then becomes the question of the day.
Another alternative is to have healing magic work more effectively for certain classes, or on them. Like, all potions drunk by fighters heal twice the HP...this makes them equal to using wands for fighters, and means they don't need to have UMD to use CLW wands. IF, for instance, they also use their character level instead of the caster level for potions, that means potions are actually BETTER for them then wands are!
And they can drink their way back to health. Higher level potions become MUCH more viable for them, then, since the HP cap for healing accelerates with character level instead of remaining fixed. Healing 6d8+30 for the same price as someone else is healing 3d8+5 is a good feeling, and not having to invest in UMD to zap yourself also.
If you combine with a self-healing mechanic that also turns damage to non-lethal, it gets even better, because non-lethal gets healed at the same time as a bonus effect by healing magic.
So, say your fighter has the ability to spend HD to turn Lethal damage to non-lethal, which mends itself naturally at HD/hour. He does this to 40 HP damage, leaving him still down 40 HP. He pops a potion of CMW. Since he's a fighter, it doubles the HP healed, and it works at caster level 10, for 2d8+10 base, x 2, = 38 hp, and we'll just round up to 40.
It heals his 40 outstanding hp, AND immediately gets rid of the 40 temp hp too, bringing him back to full with ONE potion and one self-heal use.
And no CLW wand in sight.
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But again, this is talking specific classes who don't have access to healing magic, and trying to allocate some healing effects amongst them, and how you might go about them.
You can have healing effects for dropping out of a rage, vampiric healing effects for sneak attacking someone, and other things to try to spread out the love.
Or you can be simple and have CLW wands. It all depends on how much healing you actually want in the game, which translates to downtime for the PC's. IN old 1E, you could have the whole party down for days and the clerics doing nothing but memorizing curing spells to get them back on their feet to full HP, due to lack of access to cheap healing (and the fact the only heal spell at low levels was CLW for d8 hp...you had to wait to 7th level for CSW for 2d8+1 hp!)
==Aelryinth
Another alternative is to use Health/Soak rules, and the Reserve Healing feat from 3e.
To wit, Health is physical damage, soak is 'fighter magic' damage.
Ignore the 'crit automatically goes against Health' rule. The PLAYER decides where health and soak damage go.
Health damage can be fixed by healing reserve. Soak damage is basically temp hp, and restores itself at level/hour. True spells fix either/or, health damage going first.
No wands.
Health = First level HP + Con score. That's it. SO healing reserve lets you 'cushion' some damage, and get rid of it for no cost (healing reserve after combat). 'Soak' is all other hp, and is restored naturally and fairly quickly with time.
By giving martial/fighting classes ways to recover Soak faster, you lessen reliance on healing magic, and can step down magical access to such things. Healing Reserve means after combat touch-ups are always useful, but by no means mandatory.
The heal skill working against the lower Health HP conversely means it actually has a stronger effect and is more useful for 'patching up'.
==Aelryinth
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I'm with you on liking the vibe of 4e minions. It was one of the half dozen things which I really liked about the system.
However - you need to design a game with that in mind from the ground up. There are too many ways to increase the # of hits you do (quickened magic missile suddenly becomes amazing at high levels), and far too many huge AOEs for it to be a good idea to transfer minions to Pathfinder.
I like the idea of healing for fighters... that's pretty nifty.
I like the idea of healing for fighters... that's pretty nifty.
Are you talking about my rules or the 5e rules?
==Aelryinth