In a thread started in Conversions, the question posted was whether or not the Dragonlance noble class had been converted to PF. I know Green Ronin published a Noble's Handbook (or similarly titled release), but I've always been of the opinion that being a noble doesn't necessarily mean you born into it. Perhaps you were granted your title as a reward, or you've set yourself up as such after conquering a powerful foe.
Which is why I ask this question: Should Noble be an archetype, template, or stand alone class? My vote used to be for template, but with PF's archetype options, I think that would be the best choice, IMHO.
Which is why I ask this question: Should Noble be an archetype, template, or stand alone class? My vote used to be for template, but with PF's archetype options, I think that would be the best choice, IMHO.
imo neither of those. Noble is just a title and should have no effect on your character class.
Edit: It's a good candidate for a trait in my opinion.
Noble: You gain +2 on Diplomacy and start with some equipment or more gold.
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Which is why I ask this question: Should Noble be an archetype, template, or stand alone class? My vote used to be for template, but with PF's archetype options, I think that would be the best choice, IMHO.imo neither of those. Noble is just a title and should have no effect on your character class.
Edit: It's a good candidate for a trait in my opinion.
Noble: You gain +2 on Diplomacy and start with some equipment or more gold.
+ 1 cal
A trait for +2 diplomacy, and its a class skill.
Also take "rich parents".
If anything I think Cavalier is a good noble.
I would just use the Rogue class, concentrate on Charisma and social skills and call it a noble. The variations on different nobles from different nations could be represented through the Rogue Talents.
I've always been a big fan of using existing material whenever possible over introducing new stuff. After awhile, loads of new stuff can make a system seem...messy.
A Cavalier might make a good noble if you're trying to recreate Arthurian legend or something like that but otherwise, nobles just don't strike me as that fighty. YMMV.
SJ
There's a feat for it. It's called noble scion.
The Noble class of the Noble's Handbook is more accurately called the "Organization Head" class.
The "Noble House" can be a Thieves Guild or a sprawling merchant empire as easily as a true "noble house".
I have my issues with it, but for people who like political games and want mechanics for things like Influence and Resources, the noble houses are good for that.
The class has been revised for Pathfinder in the Pathfinder Freeport Companion. That version is not tied to the noble house mechanics. It still has some good abilities that reflect privileged upbringing and leadership of others.
Naturally, you don't *need* a class to have a noble background.. but if you want to play a character with some mechanical effects to support that.. neither version is a bad choice.
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Noble
BAB: +3/4
Good Saves: Will
Hit Dice: 1d8
Class Skills: Appraise, Bluff, Craft, Diplomacy, Disguise, Handle Animal, Intimidate, Knowledge (all), Linguistics, Perception, Perform, Profession, Ride, Sense Motive, Survival, Swim.
Skill Ranks Per Level: 6 + Intelligence modifier.
Nobles are proficient in all Simple and Martial Weapons, All Armors, and Shields (except Tower Shields).
LEVEL ABILITY
1. Baron's Influence, Noble Pool, Noble Will
2. Noble Talent
3. Noble Skill Use
4. Noble Talent
5. Viscount's Influence
6. Noble Talent
7. Noble Skill Use
8. Noble Talent
9. Earl's Influence
10. Noble Talent
11. Noble Skill Use
12. Noble Talent
13. Marquis's Influence
14. Noble Talent
15. Noble Skill Use
16. Noble Talent
17. Duke's Influence
18. Noble Talent
19. Noble Skill Use
20. Noble Talent
Baron's Influence (Ex). The Noble can influence his allies to provide them bonuses and influence his enemies to penalize them. Each use of the Baron's Influence uses up one point from the character's Noble Pool (see below).
To influence his allies, the Noble must make a Knowledge nobility skill check as a move action. For every 10 points of the skill check, the Noble grants the one of the following benefits to all allies who can hear and understand him: +1 circumstance bonus to Attack and Damage Rolls, +1 circumstance bonus on all Saving Throws, or +1 circumstance bonus to all Skill Checks. This bonus persists a number of rounds equal to the Noble's Charisma bonus (minimum 1 round). Thus, a 20 on the Knowledge nobility provides a +2 bonus, a 30 provides a +3 bonus, etc.
To influence his enemies, the Noble must make a Knowledge skill check appropriate for the type of creature the Noble is attempting to influence as a move action. For example, to influence a dragon, the Noble must make a Knowledge arcana skill check; to influence a humanoid, he must make a Knowledge local skill check. Opponents of the Noble may make a Will Saving Throw with a DC of 10 + 1/2 the Noble's class level + the Noble's Charisma modifier to resist being influenced. For every 10 points of the skill check, the Noble grants the one of the following penalties to all targets who can hear and understand him: -1 circumstance penalty to Attack and Damage Rolls, -1 circumstance penalty on all Saving Throws, or -1 circumstance penalty to all Skill Checks. This penalty persists a number of rounds equal to the Noble's Charisma bonus (minimum 1 round).
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Noble Pool (Ex). The Noble possesses a Noble Pool with a number of Noble Points equal to 1/2 his Noble class level plus his Charisma bonus (minimum 1), which is replenished each day at dawn. The Noble may spend these points to activate some of his class abilities.
Noble Will (Ex). As long as the Noble has at least 1 Noble Point in his Noble Pool, he adds his Charisma bonus (if any) to his Will Saves.
Noble Talent. At 2nd level, and every even level thereafter, the Noble gains one of the following Noble Talents. Each Noble Talent may only be selected once unless otherwise noted in its description.
Ancestral Knowledge (Su). By spending 1 Noble Point as a free action, you add your class level to a single Knowledge skill check.
Charm (Ex). Choose one sex. You add 1/2 your class level to all Charisma based checks to members of the chosen sex.
Combat Talent. You gain 1 Combat Feat that you qualify for.
Commanding Presence (Ex). Spend 1 Noble Point as a free action and add your class level to a single Diplomacy or Intimidate skill check.
Curse of Regicide (Su). As long as you have at least Noble Point in your Noble Pool, whenever an opponent drops you to negative hit points, or kills you, it must make a Will Save with a DC of 20 + your class level + your Charisma modifier or be subjected to a Bestow Curse effect that can only be removed by a Miracle or Wish.
Extra Class Skill. Choose one cross-class skill. It is now a class skill for you. You may select this Noble Talent multiple times, each time choosing a different skill.
Favor (Ex). Spend 1 Noble Point and you can make a Favor check (1d20 + 1/2 your class level + your Charisma bonus) and gain a Favor as described under the Charismatic Hero Talent of the same name in d20 Modern.
Feat. You gain 1 bonus feat that you qualify for. You must be 10th level to select this Talent.
Great Ally (Ex). When using or targeted with an Aid Another action, you gain an additional +1 bonus. When you flank a creature, you gain an additional +2 bonus on your attack rolls.
Knowledge Talent (Ex). You gain a bonus equal to 1/2 your class level on all Knowledge skill checks.
Leadership. You gain the Leadership feat. You must be 6th level or higher to select this Talent.
Lesser Magic Talent (Sp). Choose one 0 level spell. You can cast it a number of times per day equal to your Charisma bonus.
Magic Talent (Sp). You must have the Lesser Magic Talent before choosing this talent. Choose 1 spell from the following list with a level that does not exceed 1/2 your class level. By spending a number of Noble Points equal to the spell level, you may cast that spell. The Save DC, if any, is equal to 10 + the spell level + your Charisma modifier. You must have an Intelligence score of at least 10 + the spell level to choose that spell.
1. Cause Fear, Charm Person, Command, Doom, Lesser Confusion, Sanctuary.
2. Augury, Calm Emotions, Enthrall, Scare.
3. Nondetection, Rage, Suggestion.
4. Charm Monster, Crushing Despair, Discern Lies, Fear, Lesser Geas.
5. Dominate Person, Greater Command.
6. Eyebite, Geas/Quest, Mass Suggestion, Repulsion.
7. Insanity.
8. Mass Charm Monster, Mindblank
9. Dominate Monster.
Noble Fate (Ex). When you fall below 0 hit points, you may spend 1 Noble Point as an immediate action and gain a number of temporary hit points equal to your character level. These temporary hit points last for 1 minute.
Noble Smite (Ex). Spend 1 Noble Point as a swift action and add your Charisma bonus to your next attack roll and your class level to your damage roll if you successfully hit.
Skill Mastery. Select a number of skills equal to 3 + your Intelligence modifier. You make take 10 on the selected skills even if doing so is not normally permitted.
Skill Talent. Select either Skill Focus or a +2/+2 feat.
Slippery Mind (Ex). If you fail a Will Save, you may make a single additional Will Save 1 round later.
Taunt (Ex). You target 1 creature that can see and hear you and understand the language you are speaking. As a move action, you spend 1 Noble Point and the target creature must make a Will Save with a DC 10 + 1/2 your Noble level + your Charisma modifier or attack you for 1 round.
Weapon Talent. You gain Weapon Focus in a weapon of your choice that you are proficient in.
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Noble Skill Use (Ex). At 3rd level and every 4 levels thereafter (7th, 11th, 15th, and 19th), the Noble learns a special use of a class skill.
Appraise. By spending 1 Noble Point and making an Appraise skill check with a DC of 20 + the caster level, the Noble gains the benefit of an Identify spell for the object in question. This takes 1 minute.
Bluff. You can use the Bluff skill to sow distrust amongst your enemies. You must know the name of the target you are seeking to influence, as well as the name of the character you are seeking to sow distrust against. As a full round action, you spend 1 Noble Point and make a Bluff skill check opposed by the Sense Motive skill check of your target. If you are successful, your target's attitude towards the designated character worsens by 1 step (from helpful to friendly, friendly to indifferent, indifferent to unfriendly, unfriendly to hostile). If you succeeded, you may continue to use a full round action to continue to influence your target by making additional Bluff checks opposed by his Sense Motive checks. When the target's attitude towards the designated character becomes hostile, the target attacks the designated character. Once the target succeeds on a Sense Motive check, he cannot be affected by this ability for 24 hours.
Diplomacy. The Noble can spend 1 point from his Noble Pool as a swift action and make a Diplomacy check opposed by an opponent's Will Save who can understand him. If the Diplomacy check is successful, the opponent will not attack the Noble for 1 round. If the Diplomacy check beats the Will Save by 20 points, the Noble can direct the opponent to attack a target of the Noble's choice for 1 round.
Disguise. The Noble can emulate another alignment. If an opponent attempts a magical means to determine the Noble's alignment, the opponent must succeed on a caster level check opposed by the Noble's Disguise skill check to get an accurate reading. If the opponent loses the opposed roll, he detects the alignment that the Noble has designated.
Handle Animal. The Noble can spend 1 point from his Noble Pool as a swift action and make a Handle Animal check opposed by an animal opponent's Will Save. If the Handle Animal check is successful, the opponent will not attack the Noble for 1 round. If the Handle Animal check beats the Will Save by 20 points, the Noble can direct the opponent to attack a target of the Noble's choice for 1 round. The Noble can also use this ability on a magical beast with an intelligence of 1 or 2, but he takes a -4 penalty to his Handle Animal skill check. The Noble can use this ability against any other creature type with an Intelligence of 1 or 2, but takes a -8 penalty to his Handle Animal check. Creatures with an Intelligence score of 3 or more, or without an Intelligence score, are immune to this ability.
Intimidate. The Noble can spend 1 point from his Noble Pool as a swift action and make an Intimidate check against all opponents within 30 feet. Any who fail their Will Save are shaken for a number of rounds equal to the Noble’s Charisma bonus (minimum +1). At 7th level, the Noble can spend 2 points from his Noble Pool and cause affected characters within 60 feet to be frightened. At 11th level, the Noble can spend 3 points from his Noble Pool and cause affected creatures within 120 feet to be panicked.
Linguistics. By spending 1 point from your Noble Pool and observing a creature for 1 round, you gain an instinctive insight into briefly communicating with it. This allows you to use a language-dependent effect against the creature even if you are unable to communicate in a language it knows. The language-dependent effect must be used or begun the round immediately after you activate this ability.
Perception. The Noble is keenly aware of attempts to assassinate him. As an immediate action, the Noble makes a Perception check with a bonus equal to his class level against an opponent who is using Stealth or Invisibility to hide from the Noble just prior to an attack; when an opponent uses Sleight of Hand to slip poison into the Noble's drink, etc. If the Perception beats the opponent's Stealth check, the Noble is not considered flat-footed against that opponent's attack.
Perform. The Noble is able to use the Perform skill check instead of the Knowledge (nobility) skill check when using his Baron's Influence, Viscount's Influence, Earl's Influence, Marquis's Influence, and Duke's Influence abilities.
Profession (noble). The Noble is adept at handling his personal finances. Every time the Noble gains an additional Noble level (including the level that this ability is chosen), he makes a Profession (noble) check and gains 100 gp per point of the Profession (noble) check.
Ride. The Noble gains an animal companion as if he were a druid of his Noble class level. The selected animal companion must be a suitable mount for the Noble.
Sense Motive. As an immediate action, the Noble can spend 1 point from his Noble Pool and make a Sense Motive check opposed by the attack roll of an opponent that is adjacent to the Noble. If the Sense Motive check is successful, the opponent's attack roll misses.
Survival. The Noble is an expert tracker and huntsman. He adds one half his Noble class level on Survival checks made to track.
Swim. You add half your Noble class level on all Swim checks and to Constitution checks to determine how long you can hold your breath. You can hold your breath for a number of rounds equal to Constitution score plus your Noble class level.
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Viscount's Influence (Ex). At 5th level, the Noble can influence his allies to provide them bonuses and influence his enemies to penalize them. Each use of the Viscount's Influence uses up 2 points from the character's Noble Pool.
To influence his allies, the Noble must make a Knowledge nobility skill check as a move action. For every 10 points of the skill check, the Noble grants the one of the following benefits to all allies who can hear and understand him: +1 circumstance bonus to Armor Class, Damage Reduction 1/-, or +5 foot circumstance bonus to Speed. This bonus persists a number of rounds equal to the Noble's Charisma bonus (minimum 1 round). Thus, a 20 on the Knowledge nobility provides a +2 bonus, a 30 provides a +3 bonus, etc.
To influence his enemies, the Noble must make a Knowledge skill check appropriate for the type of creature the Noble is attempting to influence as a move action. For example, to influence a dragon, the Noble must make a Knowledge arcana skill check; to influence a humanoid, he must make a Knowledge local skill check. Opponents of the Noble may make a Will Saving Throw with a DC of 10 + 1/2 the Noble's class level + the Noble's Charisma modifier to resist being influenced. For every 10 points of the skill check, the Noble provides one of the following penalties to all targets who can hear and understand him: -1 circumstance penalty to Armor Class, when damaged, take an additional 1 point of damage, or -5 foot circumstance penalty to speed. This penalty persists a number of rounds equal to the Noble's Charisma bonus (minimum 1 round).
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Earl's Influence (Ex). At 9th leve, the Noble can influence his allies to provide them bonuses and influence his enemies to penalize them. Each use of the Earl's Influence uses up 3 points from the character's Noble Pool.
To influence his allies, the Noble must make a Knowledge nobility skill check as a move action. For every 10 points of the skill check, the Noble grants the one of the following benefits to all allies who can hear and understand him: +1 circumstance bonus to the Save DC of their spells, spell-like abilities, supernatural abilities, or extraordinary abilities (if any), +1 circumstance bonus to caster level checks, or fast healing 1. This bonus persists a number of rounds equal to the Noble's Charisma bonus (minimum 1 round). Thus, a 20 on the Knowledge nobility provides a +2 bonus, a 30 provides a +3 bonus, etc.
To influence his enemies, the Noble must make a Knowledge skill check appropriate for the type of creature the Noble is attempting to influence as a move action. For example, to influence a dragon, the Noble must make a Knowledge arcana skill check; to influence a humanoid, he must make a Knowledge local skill check. Opponents of the Noble may make a Will Saving Throw with a DC of 10 + 1/2 the Noble's class level + the Noble's Charisma modifier to resist being influenced. For every 10 points of the skill check, the Noble provides one of the following penalties to all targets who can hear and understand him: -1 circumstance penalty to the Save DCs of their spells, spell-like abilities, supernatural abilities, or extraordinary abilities (if any), suffer a -1 circumstance penalty to their caster level checks (if any), or suffer 1 point of damage per round. This effect persists a number of rounds equal to the Noble's Charisma bonus (minimum 1 round).
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Marquis's Influence (Ex). At 13th level, the Noble can influence his allies to provide them bonuses and influence his enemies to penalize them. Each use of the Marquis's Influence uses up 4 points from the character's Noble Pool.
To influence his allies, the Noble must make a Knowledge nobility skill check as a move action. For every 10 points of the skill check, the Noble grants the one of the following benefits to all allies who can hear and understand him: Gain 1 extra standard, move, or swift action that must be used before the Noble's next turn; gain a number of hit points equal to the target's Hit Dice x 1/10 the Knowledge check (rounded down), or gain the benefits of evasion and mettle for a number of rounds equal to the Noble's Charisma bonus (minimum 1 round).
To influence his enemies, the Noble must make a Knowledge skill check appropriate for the type of creature the Noble is attempting to influence as a move action. For example, to influence a dragon, the Noble must make a Knowledge arcana skill check; to influence a humanoid, he must make a Knowledge local skill check. Opponents of the Noble may make a Will Saving Throw with a DC of 10 + 1/2 the Noble's class level + the Noble's Charisma modifier to resist being influenced. For every 10 points of the skill check, the Noble provides one of the following penalties to all targets who can hear and understand him: limited to a single move or standard action, take an amount of non-lethal damage equal to the target's HD multiplied by 1/10 the Knowledge check, or lose the ability to use evasion or mettle for a number of rounds equal to the Noble's Charisma bonus (minimum 1 round).
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Duke's Influence (Ex). At 17th level, the Noble can influence his allies to provide them bonuses and influence his enemies to penalize them. Each use of the Duke's Influence uses up 5 points from the character's Noble Pool.
To influence his allies, the Noble must make a Knowledge nobility skill check as a move action. For every 10 points of the skill check, the Noble grants the one of the following benefits to all allies who can hear and understand him: Gain 1 extra full round action that must be used before the Noble's next turn, restore one negative level per plus of the Knowledge check, or gain SR equal to 5 + 5 per 10 points of the Knowledge check for a number of rounds equal to the Noble's Charisma bonus (minimum 1 round). Thus, a 20 on the Knowledge nobility provides a +2 bonus, a 30 provides a +3 bonus, etc.
To influence his enemies, the Noble must make a Knowledge skill check appropriate for the type of creature the Noble is attempting to influence as a move action. For example, to influence a dragon, the Noble must make a Knowledge arcana skill check; to influence a humanoid, he must make a Knowledge local skill check. Opponents of the Noble may make a Will Saving Throw with a DC of 10 + 1/2 the Noble's class level + the Noble's Charisma modifier to resist being influenced. For every 10 points of the skill check, the Noble provides one of the following penalties to all targets who can hear and understand him: The targets are dazed or stunned (Noble's choice) for 1 round per 1/10 of the Knowledge check, gain 1 negative level per 1/10 of the Knowledge Check for a number of hours equal to the Noble's Charisma bonus (minimum 1 hour), or have their Spell Resistance reduced by 5 per 10 points of the Knowledge check for a number of rounds equal to the Noble's Charisma bonus (minimum 1 round).
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I just let people choose Aristocrat as a half-class. If there were going to be a full-class version of it, I'd probably go with the Marshal from Miniatures Handbook.
Which is why I ask this question: Should Noble be an archetype, template, or stand alone class? My vote used to be for template, but with PF's archetype options, I think that would be the best choice, IMHO.
An archetype for a re-fluffed bard (less entertainer, more entertainee) would make an excellent noble class.
'findel
Noble...Wow. I would've said this shouldn't be a class and it's not something I need for my game but... wow. Really well done.
Thanks! It's a work in progress, and has had zero playtesting, but it seems what the noble class should be: skillful, with a way to influence both allies and enemies, and enough versatility that it would work for an Amazon queen, foppish prince, regal elder, dowager empress, fairy princess, imperial tyrant, moathouse thane, merchant prince, Son of Heaven, tribal chief, and royal king.