Scribe scroll -- how to balance?

[Beckman]

I've got a different take on this...

The player is heroic, and has craft feats. He should make money in line with exactly how heroic he is and how much demand/supply there is for his items.

I would be tempted to let him make around a 20% profit. Remember, he is not the only person with Scribe Scroll in the town. If he is, they probably don't have the money to buy his expensive scrolls.

Here's the thing: If his temple is paying for things to help him make scrolls which other merchants have to pay for out of pocket, he's really making money OFF OF the temple. The temple had to pay out its money in order to provide those services to you! Which doesn't seem like what his deity would want. He would DEMAND to be compensated out of FAIR TRADE for the same expenses and services that the temple is providing to the cleric in the course of the cleric's trading. There is, of course, a benefit to being a member of the church, buying in bulk gets you better discounts and rates for just about everything... But NOTHING should be free at the temple of trade.. Including living costs.

Still, I do think that a percentage of the total gold cost of the items created should be profit...

[Trimalchio]

The player is offering a great opportunity to explore the game world.

If I understand correctly all sales are being done through the temple -- the church is providing the front end and taking a 10% cut of the proceeds.

Is your player creating particular 3rd level spells or just any that sell? Looking over the list, several jump out at me: Animate Dead, Create food and water, cure serious, dispel magic, locate object, remove curse, remove disease, speak with dead.

Since Abadar is LN there is wide variety of potential buyers and markets. It is great you have downtime in your game, perhaps you can turn that around? I.E., a war breaks out in a neighboring province and the local church magistrate needs the PC to spend time writing more cure seriousm animal dead, and speak with dead scrolls. Perhaps the magistrate even demands the PC spend time creating scrolls above and beyond the "down time" required by the other PCs, meanwhile you present other 'hooks' involving the war that that the other PC's which to investigate.

Or a mysterious plague breaks out, requiring additional remove curse and remove disease spells, meanwhile the plague continues to worsen with large rewards being offered to put an end to the cause of the problem. Give your players choices of how to handle events in the game world.

Dispel magic is always useful, so is cure serious, perhaps players run into a competing group with more than enough scrolls of both to give them a serious obstacle -- later on the cleric PC realizes the scrolls which helped the competing group were the very scrolls he scribed.

Basically, instead of finding ways to punish the player or take away the players revenue, find ways instead for his actions to have serious consequences on the game world, consequences which effect him or his party, or even consequences which change the way the world functions.

Look up typical gold by level and look at the difference between PC level and two levels above them (about 12,000?) seems close to what the character generates in a few months time, perhaps an NPC rogue stages a heist of church scrolls and the church cannot pay the PC because of the theft -- also a way to get the players back on the road in search of adventure/stolen goods.

Most DMs would love to have players interact with their world outside the typical dungeon crawl, reward him or her and use it to give depth to your world.

[MasterArtificer]

Just be happy he isn't an Artificer from Eberrron...

All creation feats as class feats along with bonus feats? With Exceptional Artisan and Extraordinary Artisan taken four times each (beacause thier effects stack), you could, with only 8 actual feats, create any item with no gold cost and no time devotion...

Now, having done this, you have to work something out with him. My DM and I worked out somewhat of a burn-out rule where I could only create a certain number of items per day/week or I was subject to insanity from an overload of magical discharge.

Just remember, inventive solutions to simple problems can make the game more fun for all. Heck, you could have the Wizard's Guild demanding he close up shop, give them a cut, or leave before they have to take "desperate measures."

[Maxxx]

MasterArtificer wrote:

Just be happy he isn't an Artificer from Eberrron...

All creation feats as class feats along with bonus feats? With Exceptional Artisan and Extraordinary Artisan taken four times each (beacause thier effects stack), you could, with only 8 actual feats, create any item with no gold cost and no time devotion...

Nowhere in the description of these feats does it say that you can take them more than once.

[kikanaide]

StevenPine wrote:

Lots of really good stuff...

+1. I would play at your table.

[MasterArtificer]

Maxxx wrote:

MasterArtificer wrote:

Just be happy he isn't an Artificer from Eberrron...

All creation feats as class feats along with bonus feats? With Exceptional Artisan and Extraordinary Artisan taken four times each (beacause thier effects stack), you could, with only 8 actual feats, create any item with no gold cost and no time devotion...

Nowhere in the description of these feats does it say that you can take them more than once.

Look at the Feat list page (49) see the little 2 next to the names of those feats? Now look down the bottom of the page, see the matching number 2? "You can gain this feat multiple times. Its effects stack."

[Spacelard]

Maybe a Church or Guild might take exception to some punk a$$ adventurer types muscling in our scroll business *sounds of knuckles cracking*

[LazarX]

Douglas Muir 406 wrote:

Scribing a scroll for a third level spell takes one day, costs 325 gp, and will earn 750 gp if the scroll is sold for cash. That's 325 profit: nice. So the question becomes, how many times can this be done before the market is saturated?

It's not a hypothetical question. I have a 5th level cleric of Abadar IMC. The player has pointed out that Abadar would want him to engage in trade for profit, and I can hardly disagree. He has access to all third level clerical spells, so he can pick whatever there's a demand for.

Remind him that not even Abadar can grant profit when there's no market to sell to. Fact is, outside of other adventuring types there really isn't a market for scroll spells. So you're justified at putting the brakes on this activity at whatever level as you see fit. Also keep in mind where you are. the market for scrolls at the Village of Hommelet is pretty much nonexistant.

The solution to this problem.... keep the characters busy. A playing session should be like an episode of an action TV show.. And how many episodes are about protagonists just sitting around?

[Adam Ormond]

StevenPine wrote:

I.E. [sic], a war breaks out in a neighboring province and the local church magistrate needs the PC to spend time writing more cure seriousm animal dead, and speak with dead scrolls. Perhaps the magistrate even demands the PC spend time creating scrolls above and beyond the "down time" required by the other PCs, meanwhile you present other 'hooks' involving the war that that the other PC's which to investigate.

I'm not quite clear what the scroll-scriber is supposed to be doing here. He's assigned a boring AND impossible task in order to earn a modest sum of money while his compatriots get to go out and do cool stuff and get lots of loot? Sounds like the character retires to fulfill his civic duty and the player brings in a new PC.

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Or a mysterious plague breaks out, requiring additional remove curse and remove disease spells, meanwhile the plague continues to worsen with large rewards being offered to put an end to the cause of the problem. Give your players choices of how to handle events in the game world.

I like this one a bit, although if the scroll-scriber doesn't have these scrolls readily available, I don't see any way to succeed. He can only scribe one spell a day, and any spell he's scribing is one less spell he's casting.

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Dispel magic is always useful, so is cure serious, perhaps players run into a competing group with more than enough scrolls of both to give them a serious obstacle -- later on the cleric PC realizes the scrolls which helped the competing group were the very scrolls he scribed.

I doubt this tactic will prove particularly effective. Offense is substantially better than defense in D&D, in large part because a character is just as capable at 1 hitpoint as 50. Most times enemy casters can't get through their prepared spells, which are going to be more effective than casting from scroll. Unless you throw two or three lower level clerics at the party toting around scrolls.

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perhaps an NPC rogue stages a heist of church scrolls and the church cannot pay the PC because of the theft -- also a way to get the players back on the road in search of adventure/stolen goods.

This is win. He gets his loot when he reaches the appropriate level, and the motivation for chasing down this thief is genuine.