Updated Wizard Guide?

[Sentack]

When it comes to guides on wizards, the only one I've seen so far is this one.

http://paizo.com/paizo/messageboards/paizoPublishing/pathfinder/pathfinderR PG/advice/treantmonksGuideToWizardsOptimization

And while I figure for the most part, it's still fairly accurate, I get the impression that it's a tad out of date. If not only because of all the additional content that's been put out lately.

I've searched the forums and tried to find some additional information about the class. Namely I'm trying to decide if specialization is worth it. While the extra spell slot and additional zappy power are pretty cool. I want to specialize in Conjuration or maybe Illusion. The problem is trying to find two schools of magic I want to oppose. I can find one, Necromancy. While it has a few gems, for the most part it's mostly situational. The second, I've had more trouble with.

So, I was going to just try and list out all the schools of magic, and why opposing them is fairly difficult, I find. Often because there's at least one or two spells that you would find yourself using regularly. Which is problematic. Here we go.

Why not Oppose this School:

- Abjuration: Dispel Magic is going to have to come up, and while you could get a wand of this, it's expensive. There are a few other nice spells but most of those you might make the sacrifice for on a case by case basis. But you will use Dispel Magic, a lot.

- Conjuration: All the Summon spells are felt to be the workhorse spells of the Wizard. You want to cast these, why make it harder on yourself?

- Divination: Really, Read Magic is the only spell you'll use with great regularity. Many others are very useful but are perhaps situational enough that when you need them, it won't be too much of a bother to sacrifice an extra slot for them.

- Enchantment: Hideous Laughter and Confusion seem to be strong spells that help hold this line. Still, they aren't so critical that you'll miss using them should you chose not to spend the extra slot to memorize them. The rest of the spells are situational at best.

- Evocation: Fireball and Magic Missile aren't the best spells int he world but they seem so iconic that it's hard to ignore them. Not to mention that there are a number of very useful spells here.

- Illusion: These spells seems tricky to me. It seems to me that how they are resolved are best defined as 'DM interpretation'. Which means the player and the DM could sit arguing for hours over the concept of "interacted with". It seems like they are very potent spells, but if the DM has monsters 'seeing through the effect' too easily, then it's almost not worth using them.

- Necromancy: Already been through this. Seems to me that there are some great gems in here, but just deciding to not use them or to learn them only when it's a situation that seems necessary, sounds like a good reason to make this an opposed school.

- Transmutation: Your buff spells, also another reason to play a Wizard. Too many good spells to count. I can't see opposing this at all.

So that's it. I guess after writing down my thoughts, it becomes a little easier to see what one I might oppose, but I figure other people here have comments about such things to add. What do you guys think about the various schools. What one is worth specializing in, an what ones are acceptable sacrifices to oppose?

[LazarX]

You forgot this one...

Why Oppose Any?

While I take Treantmonk's work as a good guide, I don't take it as gospel. (and from what I see he never intended to have it taken as such)

One of the ways I defy it is that I've never been partial to specialist wizards. I see and agree with some of the advantages, but they've never been enough to override my personal roleplaying preferences as far as wizards go, a maestro of all forms of the Art.

[Sentack]

Going universal will give you a couple minor benefits and no extra spell slot but, of course, no spells cost double slots. So yes, it is an option to go with "none of the above", but I find that at least some of the benefits of going specialist can outweigh some of the random spells you have a penalty too. As long as the spells you take as "Opposed", aren't ones you expect to use frequently and find sufficient alternatives at the spell levels to utilize, then it's not a major loss. Still, a few basis need to be covered by any wizard. A wizard is expected to detect magic, dispel magic, be invisible, fly, summon creatures, buff the melee classes, and occasionally throw out a fireball or magic missile. If casting any of those spells comes at a penalty, then what you gained needs to compensate for that, in some way.

I guess really I'm just looking for a way to make my wizard a little more unique then just a standard wizard. Not that he needs to be for any specific reason but because it would be nice to have.

[w0nkothesane]

I strongly recommend specializing. It sounds like you aren't especially attached to the Enchantment school, so why not oppose that as well?

Even if you prepare a few enchantment spells here and there, as long as you don't do more than 1 enchantment spell per spell level per day you'll wind up with at least as many slots overall; most days you'll wind up with more.

You'll also get better school powers out of it. The Conjuration power that extends summon spell durations is a godsend at early levels, Diviner's boost to initiative is awesome, the Illusionist powers are useful....

[Tiny Coffee Golem]

I usually play a universalist, but in the off times I choose to play a specialist it's generally for the intersting powers, not the extra spell slot.

I generally give up necro and illusion. Invisiblity is the only thing in this school that I use regularily and i can get/make an item/ring of this with relative ease. necro has a few gems also, but nothing insurmountable.

Edit:
Oh, enchantment is something I rarely use also. A few gems, but too many creatures make their saves. Plus their is always diplomacy and intimidate.

I've also, with very few exceptions, I've never found divination overly helpful. DM's are only going to tell you so much anyway. Even if it's not restricted I rarely prepare them. I just make it a point to have a lot of knowledge skills.

[Jaryn Wildmane]

Why not take one of the elemental schools? Personally I would choose water or fire just because the Air and Earth schools have too many staple spells in them to make them a forbidden school.

[Tiny Coffee Golem]

Jaryn Wildmane wrote:

Why not take one of the elemental schools? Personally I would choose water or fire just because the Air and Earth schools have too many staple spells in them to make them a forbidden school.

Air is the coolest to me. Palpatine lightning plus fly at will, SCORE!

Water is cool too, but I hardly ever see a boat in our campaigns. I always wanted to play a ships mage.

[thomas nelson]

Of the elemental wizards I like Earth the best, and acid de-buff with a stinking cloud effect is pretty awesome and earth glide will save your ass more than flying will.

[Sir Jolt]

This has come up a lot in our games as we don't generalist wizards in our (mostly my) homebrew. And we've been playing in that homebrew since TSR dumped Greyhawk in the early 2E days. It was an easier choice back then because the different specialists were not balanced against each other.

My previous most common to be barred from were Necro, Illusion and Ench. unless I was specialising in those; I think those 3 schools have good synergy between them. Also, I don't think Evocation is as needed as it once was. Many direct damage spells have shifted to other schools.

Summoning is great especially when the party is small but in larger groups I often see less summoning spells being cast. In any case, I don't think any choice has the weight it used to when you were completely barred from casting spells from your opp. school. Compared to that, the current penalty is low-moderate IMO.

SJ

[Jon Kines]

Sir Jolt wrote:

This has come up a lot in our games as we don't generalist wizards in our (mostly my) homebrew. And we've been playing in that homebrew since TSR dumped Greyhawk in the early 2E days. It was an easier choice back then because the different specialists were not balanced against each other.

My previous most common to be barred from were Necro, Illusion and Ench. unless I was specialising in those; I think those 3 schools have good synergy between them. Also, I don't think Evocation is as needed as it once was. Many direct damage spells have shifted to other schools.

Summoning is great especially when the party is small but in larger groups I often see less summoning spells being cast. In any case, I don't think any choice has the weight it used to when you were completely barred from casting spells from your opp. school. Compared to that, the current penalty is low-moderate IMO.

SJ

An easy work around is to scribe scrolls of the opposition spells you think you might need, that way you have it if you need it and it isnt eating 2 slots.

[leo1925]

You might want to check this thread i had started some time ago. The advice people gave me was very good.