| Azurelink |
I am new to Tabletop role playing games so I am unsure as to how to proceed with this idea, so I am interested in seeing what other people suggest I do.
I just started as an Elf Wizard, using only the core book. After working on a backstory for my character, I noticed that my backstory sets him up for an interesting plot twist; it makes him motivated to be a traitor. He wouldn't be a traitor out of any evil motivations either, it would all be justified, just in a twisted and odd way. So I now know what may eventually happen with my character, I may have to combat the rest of my party.
And I want to win.
Based upon the spells located in the spell list (using only the basic spells) I noticed a few ways to shut down certain members, at least for a period of time. The other people in my party are a Fighter (Max AC from what I can see, doesnt seem to focus on offense), a Barbarian, a Druid and a Ranger (using a bow).
Windwall seems like it could possibly shut down the ranger. I am an evocation specialist so I also gain access to Elemental Wall, and Fire Wall, granting me a 2x walls I can use and force people to walk through to get to me. These are some defensive measures I can use.
Now for some offensive things.
Quickened True Strike/Spell Charge: I have a bonded Rapier which I would like to upgrade with Spellcharge. I was also thinking of adding in a quickened True Strike to allow me to hit and then cast a spell (planning on either Lightning Bolt or Vampiric Touch, so any of the characters who get near me risk allowing me to heal). Does this Work out the way I think it should? Am I allowed to use a Quickened True Strike and then attack? Which would be better for this situation, Vampiric or Lightning Bolt?
Eldritch Knight:
Because this may mean I have to stay in melee combat to do that, I was wondering if becoming an Eldritch Knight would be a good idea. It seems to offer me some defensive abilities (more armor!) and keep my spell abilities high. I was unsure if my Caster Level for when using spells would be Wizard+Eldritch or if I stick with Wizard level. Would Lightning Bolt be Wizard Level d6 or Combine the two?
What class would be ideal for becoming an Eldritch? I need the Martial Weaponry so I was thinking Barbarian for the level 1 bonuses they grant (I only need 1 level in it afterall). At that point, I was thinking of getting Breastplate and using some feats on that reducing Arcane Failure (leaving me at 5% only). This should make me a little but more survivable.
Other than that, anyone have advice on if I should go pure Wizard or Wizard/Barbarian/Eldritch and what spells I should get?
LazarX
|
It really doesn't matter how you manage it because unless you stab them in the backs or kill them while they sleep, you vs the party is going to comeout as a dead you. That's why most folks who decide that thier group needs to die basically either murder them all in their sleep,or bug out and come back with some new friends.
| Detect Magic |
I don't advise you backstab your party, especially if the people playing them are your friends.
Might actually kill one of 'em, and I guarantee you that the player isn't going to be happy that the character he has so much time invested in has just been ganked. More over the rest of the group isn't going to be happy, especially the DM if you just spring this on 'em.
Most likely your character will die (you simply don't have enough actions to thwart all the aggro you'd be getting; the ranger could probably down you in one round and don't get me started about the druid) and you'll be out a group.
| wraithstrike |
I am new to Tabletop role playing games so I am unsure as to how to proceed with this idea, so I am interested in seeing what other people suggest I do.
I just started as an Elf Wizard, using only the core book. After working on a backstory for my character, I noticed that my backstory sets him up for an interesting plot twist; it makes him motivated to be a traitor. He wouldn't be a traitor out of any evil motivations either, it would all be justified, just in a twisted and odd way. So I now know what may eventually happen with my character, I may have to combat the rest of my party.
And I want to win.
Based upon the spells located in the spell list (using only the basic spells) I noticed a few ways to shut down certain members, at least for a period of time. The other people in my party are a Fighter (Max AC from what I can see, doesnt seem to focus on offense), a Barbarian, a Druid and a Ranger (using a bow).
Windwall seems like it could possibly shut down the ranger. I am an evocation specialist so I also gain access to Elemental Wall, and Fire Wall, granting me a 2x walls I can use and force people to walk through to get to me. These are some defensive measures I can use.
Now for some offensive things.
Quickened True Strike/Spell Charge: I have a bonded Rapier which I would like to upgrade with Spellcharge. I was also thinking of adding in a quickened True Strike to allow me to hit and then cast a spell (planning on either Lightning Bolt or Vampiric Touch, so any of the characters who get near me risk allowing me to heal). Does this Work out the way I think it should? Am I allowed to use a Quickened True Strike and then attack? Which would be better for this situation, Vampiric or Lightning Bolt?
Eldritch Knight:
Because this may mean I have to stay in melee combat to do that, I was wondering if becoming an Eldritch Knight would be a good idea. It seems to offer me some defensive abilities (more armor!) and keep my spell abilities high. I was unsure if my Caster Level for when using...
If you stay in combat you are in trouble. Depending on the druid build he may single handedly hand your arse to you and so will the barbarian. The druid alone is a tough nut to crack. They also have the action economy advantage. The best you can hope for is to take them out of action during a surprise round. There is also the issue of them running away and then you will be the hunted.
True Strike does not affect lightening bolt since it does not require an attack roll, and they will laugh the vampiric touch spell away unless they are almost already dead.My suggestion is to go straight wizard and play keep away. The ranger can lay the hurt down, and so can the fighter even if he is not focusing on attack all that much. I don't see you winning this one.
PS: I would also make sure the players would not be angry about the betrayal in real life. Some groups handle these things well, while others do not.
| Slaunyeh |
There is Black Tentacles once you hit level 7. Could potentially shut the rest of the party down long enough to get a few extra 'free' actions to do what you need. Trouble is it's probably fairly random if you can lock down the fighter and the barbarian... and if you don't, you die. Someone who prime-stats intelligence might not like those odds. :)
Then there's Dominate... it would even the odds a little bit, but it still leaves you with three angry PCs and a turn that's over.
You basically don't want to be anywhere near them. Max-range fireballs is much safer than trying to survive melee. But it also makes it really hard to stop them from just getting out of there.
To mirror what everyone else has said, betraying your group and trying to kill the other characters isn't a terrible good idea unless the group is good with it in advance. Not even for a 'cool background reason'.
| Chris Gunter |
This a trap alot of new players fall into (including me!), so be careful.
Nearly every game in existence is competitive. The other players at the table are rivals to be overcome. But RPGs are different. In a RPG the point is to create a character that cooperates with the other characters (and players) so that the group can achieve epic and heroic goals. If your character has reasons to turn against the party then you should probably start work on another character... one who's goals are compatible with the groups'. Character motivations aside, in the end it the player's responsibility to make sure his character cooperates with the group as a whole. (The "I was only following my character concept" is an old defense... and a good storyteller won't let you get away with it.)
Now, if you are in a group where these kind of actions are accepted (or even encouraged) then so be it. Games where the other player characters can turn on you can be fun! (Ahhh... the old Vampire: Masquerade days...) But in a lot of ways you won't be playing Pathfinder.
Before you do this consult with the storyteller. Is he OK with your plan? How about the other players? Are they OK with a game where a fellow player can become an adversary... and possibly kill the entire group? If the answer to either questions is no then you have no business going forth with your plan, as everyone's enjoyment is the most important thing in a RPG.
Last, ask yourself if you are OK losing the character... on purpose. Your character falling to the group as a defeated, unexpected villain can also be fun... and a memorable end to the character! (This doesn't mean you should throw the fight... just that you shouldn't go too far with your planning... or rather, that you make your plans like a storyteller, with the defeat of "the villain" as the ideal result.) But in the end, you should be OK with the idea of losing your character.
Once all that is out of the way, and you're sure you're in a group where such interactions and scheming are accepted, and you're sure you're in a group where there will be no bad blood among other players (or the GM) with your character possibly winning... only then are you ready to "possibly, maybe, one day have to fight your compatriots".
And, as a fellow devious player, I would love to help you with your plans! What level is your character now? At what level would this conflict possibly happen?
With two melee combatants in the group your best bet is to fight at range. Learn fly asap. Then you need to have a way neutralize the ranger's bow. I highly suggest the Deflect Arrows feat and a buckler with arrow deflection.
How about the druid... is he/she primarily melee or ranged?
You concerns over AC are legitimate... whether you go Eldritch Knight or not. I'm still working on the problem.
| Chris Gunter |
Really? How do you figure that? Honestly asking.
Sorry, I don't know what I was thinking of when I typed that.
Brain fart, I guess.
True strike affects the next single attack roll you make, even if it is in the same turn. You can cast it as a quickened action and then attack, even with a spell.
(I'm going to go crazy trying to figure out what spell I was thinking of. Certainly not true strike. I've personally used it as such with a lesser rod of quicken metamagic and some of my favorite spells.)
Sorry, again.
Jaryn Wildmane
|
You can definitely win the fight if you stay pure wizard, although I'm not so sure about the fight that happens with your fellow players when they come across the table. Anyways area affect cc spells are the key to your victory. A persistent stinking cloud on top of them will really hamper them and depending on what level you do this black tentacles has the potential to strangle the life out of several party members.
Blasting is never the answer if you want to kill things, its a good supplement but not your goto method. Saving throws against blast spells like lightning bolt and fireball really cut down on their damage and theres a good chance they will be able to get to you. Touch Spells don't provide the saving throws but they only let you focus on one of your 4 targets.
Besides what is a more "iconic" wizard? A crazy power hungry maniac who goes down in a blaze of glory when his enemies make it through his heavy artillery assault or an evil patient genius who laughs as his enemies die helplessly while he doesn't have to lift a finger?
| VM mercenario |
IF, and I say IF, you think this would be natural character development, that it would be something your character would do, talk with your DM first, tell him that in this or this situation your character would betray the group. Work with the DM to come up with a storyline, and decide, are you willing to lose the character, either dieing or being turned into a villain? Or you can also talk with the group, make sure it's not a fight to the death, maybe you could fight them get them imprisoned and after some character growth he feels guilty and decides to rescue the party, maybe you allow the character to be defeated, use another character for a couple sessions and then the traitor comes back when the group needs his help the most and you can make a sub-plot about the character trying to redeem himself. It would be very dramatic and some pretty cool roleplay. But do not, seriously, do not think that your character has any chance to defeat the rest of the party, action economy says you would lose. And even if you did defeate the party, out of the blue, without some sort of consent from the group, you can be sure that you would have to start looking for a new group.
TL;DR: If it's for the story talk with the group and they might help you. If it's just to 'win' against the other players, it will piss everyone at the table off and your character will probably die.
| tlc_web tlc_web |
If you insist on betraying the party I have some advice, but NOT on how to win. But how to make this event possiblly fun and enjoyable for the group.
1) Tell you GM immediately of your plan. If you pulled that s!!$ on me mid-session that I was STing with no warning, I would yank your character away, make him an NPC, finish the fight (after giving the PCs draws to make you aware of what you were planning), and ask you to leave my home. I would probably let you back in if you were sorry for what you did. Tabletop RPG is a horrible place for PVP for one simple fact. If everyone does not at least half way work together, then there is no game.
2) Leave some clues to what you plan on doing. Have your character spout something that hints at his beliefs or intents. This will increase the chances you will lose, but at least the players will feel they had a chance to react to your actions. How would you like to play a game where the king who patronized your party was actually the villian and you were given NO warning or chances to realize you were being duped by this villian until the day he brought you into a killbox and wiped you out. How loosy of a story would that be? No one wants to play a character who was used and died a hopeless death. That is reality, RPGs are about escapism.
3) If you have a choice, then plan on the perfect escape, not the perfect murder. If you TPK the party that is pretty much end of game. The players are unlikely to want to play new PCs based around your villian. And if your PC wanted to gut the story by TPK, then it is likely he would not want to follow the STs story. However if you plan the perfect escape, then your character becomes a reoccuring NPC villian that that sets up fun for the PCs.
4) As games progress, players pick up short-cut behaviors. These behaviors are essentially sloppy laziness meant to speed up game play. Some of these are just poor roleplaying, but some enhance roleplay by moving the "boring" parts of the game off-stage. Like for instance no one really bothers to delegate campfire building and gathering firewood, since unless a PCs is untrustworthy it is a nonevent. However if you take advantage of this short cut to put a bomb in the fire, it will make the PCs unhappy.
| Abraham spalding |
I had a character in a game that I wasn't able to attend one weekend recently. The GM had me roll a will save before the end of the previous game and then called me during the week.
The will save was a failure (no question there I got a freaking 2 on the dice with only a +9 bonus) and my character had been dominated by an NPC.
The GM discussed what happened with me and had a great place for the character to be a reoccurring bad guy. So a plan was hatched -- if the other characters managed to rescue my character before the end of the next game then I would continue playing that character -- if not the character was turned into a vampire and I started my back up.
Occasionally I get a call during the week from the GM now that goes, "I'll need you to run Ruzil again this weekend for an encounter."
He gets a really effective vampire sorcerer (with an imp familiar and an imp companion from the diabloist class) that he doesn't have to worry too much over. I get to put the fear of death into the rest of the party -- and I'm not having to worry about them wanting to kill my current character, or me for what happened.
It's actually been a lot of fun for everyone (I think) and it's not a case of "player screws player" which is always good.