So, I've seen tons of shots of minis that were hand painted. Some excellent, some good and some not so good (SKR's example of stuff he did as a teen hit that spot ;p ).
So what would the realistic costs, in dollars, be to get started in painting minis? Basically, and market rates shifting by location, what would be the start up costs? I'm thinking of the absolute must-have items to start. Then the should-have items, before getting into the nice to have.
So, I've seen tons of shots of minis that were hand painted. Some excellent, some good and some not so good (SKR's example of stuff he did as a teen hit that spot ;p ).
So what would the realistic costs, in dollars, be to get started in painting minis? Basically, and market rates shifting by location, what would be the start up costs? I'm thinking of the absolute must-have items to start. Then the should-have items, before getting into the nice to have.
Absolute minimum you need:
A large pack of craft brushes, across a range of sizes. I'd go to Michael's or Hobby Lobby and get a synthetic (white bristled) set. Around $10 will get you started.
Spray-primer. Wal-mart has 99c cans of equipment grey, flat black, and flat white spray paint that work well enough. If you've never spray primed before, then you'll want to read some tips on how to do this without damaging detail.
Sprat-sealant. Initially, go for a matte clear coat from Krylon. About $5 a can.
Paint: To start out cheaply, I'd use Americana/DecoArt craft paint, which you can get for about $1 a bottle online. You need, at minimum:
White, Black, Blue, Green, Red, Yellow, Brown (2 shades), silver, and gold. $10 for paint.
That's all you *have* to have. Other possible purchases would be Future Acrylic Floor polish (cheap and effective acrylic agent for mixing and thinning paints), mixing jars, palette, more expensive brushes, more expensive paints, inks, washes, glazes, basing materials...
So brushes, paints, primer, and sealant: about $30 to start.
So, I've seen tons of shots of minis that were hand painted. Some excellent, some good and some not so good (SKR's example of stuff he did as a teen hit that spot ;p ).
So what would the realistic costs, in dollars, be to get started in painting minis? Basically, and market rates shifting by location, what would be the start up costs? I'm thinking of the absolute must-have items to start. Then the should-have items, before getting into the nice to have.
It varies a little depending on what exactly you are trying to go for, and where you buy your stuff.
But this is what you'd need, off the top of my head and some net searching... the links are not necessarily best, just what I knew I could find.
Model Prep and Assembly
Needle Files - $8-9 (this is the best DEAL I could find, 12 for 9 bucks, not necessarily the cheapest set. You really only need a few files)
Sprue Cutter/Flush Cut Clippers - @ $14 (and a note, if you can afford it and make use of it, you're better off getting a small plier set like this which is $30 for 4 needlenose pliers, a flush cutter, and a non-flush sprue clipper
A precision knife, such as a #1 XActo - @$2-3
Cyanoacrylate (CA+) Glue, Medium Cure - @ $7-8 (different people will recommend different glues)
Brushes
1 GOOD quality, size 2 round kolinsky sable brush - Look for discounted ones around $6 (It is ABSOLUTELY worth it to spend more on a good brush, as it will last you longer and ultimately cost you less--cheaper to spend $8 on a brush that lasts 1 or 2 years than $2 on a brush you replace every few months)
An old brush or stiff synthetic brush good for drybrushing -
Such as a small cat's tongue nylon brush - Can't find a good example online but let's say don't spend more than $6 and use an old brush for free if you've got one
Cake of brush cleaner -- yes, this is a necessity; lasts a long long time and will make your nice brushes last a long long time -- @ $5-6 and I'm pretty sure there's a smaller size that goes for $2
Primer
IF YOU WANT TO BRUSH ON - I suggest Acrylic gesso in the color of choice: @$5
IF YOU WANT TO SPRAY - I think it's Krylon Ultra Flat that people usually suggest? @$5
Paint
This REALLY depends on the individual buyer and what they want to use and what they are going for.
Some people are willing to be on the cheap and use something like Apple Barrel acrylic. Going this route is super cheap, around a dollar a bottle, but you need to get some acrylic paint thinner along with it and be confident about not obscuring detail.
My personal preference is Reaper Master Series Paint, which is really well formulated for miniature painting. It, like most specialized miniature paints, retails around $3.00 a bottle, and usually you can get discounted for $2.50 a bottle.
I also like Citadel Foundation Paint for basecoating and terrain (but normally don't like to promote citadel/GW hobby stuff because it's usually on the more expensive end of the line)
At the very minimum, and hoping you have a good background for mixing paint colors (which takes some knowledge of color theory and the like) you will want black, white, red, yellow, blue, and a metallic silver and/or gold. Call that 6 colors for $6-18.
Most people will want more (and some colors don't result well from just mixing) -- a more generally useful basic set would be something like black, white, red, yellow, grass green, medium blue, vibrant blue, medium purple, a "flesh" tone, yellow ochre, a cool dark brown, a warm light brown, and metallic gold and metallic silver. 14 colors.
You can also buy according to need--frex, you know you're going to paint a bunch of skeletons, so buy off-white/cream, brown ink, and white paint.
There are some good starter boxes by various companies to also check out, for example Privater Press sells a 6 color kit for $14-18.
You may also want stuff like inks and washes (Citadel washes are great) which makes painting some things easier.
Aaaaand, that's basically it. It's an expensive hobby, in all fairness. If you were desperate, just glue, primer, paint, and brushes could probably be a go.
Optional add ons would include stuff like needle pliers (also mentioned above), a cutting mat, pin vise and drill bits, matte spray varnish like Testor's Dullcote, and basing material like sand and flocking, which I am too tired to look up right now. Oh, and as mentioned by others, mix-ins like glaze medium (or Future :) ), thinner, retarder, etc.
OH! And of course if you want to get into heavy conversion, you will want Kneadatite Blue/Yellow Epoxy Putty (aka Green Stuff, or your other favorite putty of choice) (also generally good for gap filling), some wax carvers (Amazon of all places is actually the best place I've seen for prices on those), and a jar of vaseline.
Household tools you should hopefully already have: paper clips, toothpicks.
OH and one more thing: Simple Green for stripping minis, if you want to repaint them. (Soak overnight in undiluted Simple Green, run under warm water while scrubbing in the morning to get paint off. Safe for most plastics too, and Simple Green is safe to pour down your sink.)
Other possible purchases would be Future Acrylic Floor polish (cheap and effective acrylic agent for mixing and thinning paints),
I know Sean basically swears by Future.
Rather than continually edit my increasingly lengthy post, one more thing, not directly related to cost:
I got a huge amount of my hobby supplies from folks who bought them for me in exchange for painting work. Basically I painted a few Warhammer 40K armies and Bloodbowl teams and the like, and as payment got a ton of tools, paint, and my own minis in exchange.
So if you like to paint but can't fully fund your own hobby, often you might find other friends who do (especially if you know wargamers).
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I know Sean basically swears by Future.
Think it's called like Pledge with Future Shine now though.
More to the point of the OP, the investment isn't too big so long as you think about what your going to paint before hand.
You'll probably need a metal or two, a flesh tone, maybe a brown wash (it's so versatile, leather, wood, and more!) and then a color or two for your outfits.
You want to make sure to prime your models before painting and even before that step I recommend properly cleaning the little extra bits and mold lines from your models and then probably washing them off with some warm water and soap. So don't forget the cost of a set of small files when looking at things. Primer and paint really help to bring out the flaws in a model.
Other possible purchases would be Future Acrylic Floor polish (cheap and effective acrylic agent for mixing and thinning paints),I know Sean basically swears by Future.
The first time I used Future, I was astonished by the difference it made. Honestly, I think people should be required to paint their first 10 or so minis with cheap craft paint just to see what it's like, and then be given the same paint, mixed properly with a future/water mix. Suddenly, all your paints have flow and coverage.
I swore by citadel paints for ages, but now? I buy cheap paint and use the bottle of Future I bought 8 years ago. I mix it right in my watercolor palette if I'm using one-off colors, or mix bottles of it if I'm painting an army or a squad or anything really that requires a consistent color palette.
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My "first one's free, kid" starter kit would be this:
* cheap $.99 craft paints in red, yellow, blue, black, white, silver metallic (such as Apple Barrel). You can use the three primary colors to make secondary colors or brown, you can use the black and white to make them darker or lighter, and the metallic covers your basic metal. subtotal: $6.00
* a little brush for doing most of the work and a bigger brush for drybrushing; at the University Bookstore by my apt they have a bargain bin for $.99 brushes. You can go crazy and get a bunch of different brushes (once you get the hang of it I'd add a medium brush for faster painting of large areas like cloaks) subtotal: $2.00
* an X-Acto knife, though you can get by without one if you have a box cutter or even a sharp kitchen knife. Generally about $6
* flat white Krylon spraypaint. You can get cheaper stuff but it can look junky. Generally about $6
* a bottle of Pledge with Future. Generally around $10
Total cost is about $30.
You can avoid having a pin vise if you only use one-piece minis.
Clean off flash with the X-Acto knife.
Wash the mini with an old toothbrush and some dish soap.
Dry the mini or let it dry.
Prime it with the Krylon.
Paint it with the craft paints. You probably will need to thin them a little bit with water on your palette (an old plastic lid is fine) and need two or more coats depending on how well the paint covers.
Let it dry.
Dip the mini in the Future, shake off most of the excess (it tends to create a film in holes, so blow on it to knock those out). Let it dry 30 minutes.
(Some people mix the Future with the paint on the palette to bring out the colors and help the flow and coverage, but I worry that the Future will gunk up the brush... and a Future dip just at the end brings out the colors really well.)
You can even skip the Krylon and use Future as your primer (Jodi likes this) though you may initially find it weird painting on the bare-looking metal.
Future dries kinda shiny, so if you don't like that, after it dries you can go over it with a spray coat of Krylon matte clear finish (or, if you're hard-core, you can get some Testors Dull Cote clear spray).
Other options are buying one of the Reaper starter kits, which include a couple of minis, several relevant paints, two brushes, brush-on primer, and instructions. Reaper Kit 1 ... Reaper Kit 2 ... Reaper Kit 3 ... each is about $25, then just get some Future. The Reaper paints are good quality and they'll last you a while.
Some unsolicited basic advice if you are just starting (this is stuff I wish was in the beginner's manual, and ended up learning by messing up):
1)Spray primer from a distance (maybe 12", see what works), and pass the paint over lightly, moving the can slowly as you go. It is much better to spray on a thin coat, then another thin coat when that one is dry (and you can always touch up with a brush before painting) than to spray too much on or get too close and end up with a gloppy or bubbly job. I like to place my minis on newspaper or cardboard (something I can rotate if I want to, so I can move the mini without touching it) and spray them outdoors, both because I don't get high from the fumes and because I don't have to worry about getting paint on my carpet etc). Also, I usually wear vinyl or latex gloves when I work, not just to keep my hands clean but to minimize skin oils, moisture, or dirt getting on the mini after I have cleaned it.
2)Wash your brushes obsessively. If you leave paint on them, especially after you finish, they will dry up and be ruined. Another tip for preserving brushes and painting well: don't load your brushes with too much paint. You're not dunking the brush in the paint (there shouldn't be paint anywhere near the ferrule. Just put a small amount on the end.) Same advice for painting as for priming: it is much better to apply multiple thin layers of paint. Also regarding brushes: drybrushing will destroy a brush. Don't use any brush you care about for drybrushing.
3)Always thin your paints with a few drops of water before applying them. You want perhaps a thickish milky consistency. Never apply paint directly from the pot onto the model.
So, I've seen tons of shots of minis that were hand painted. Some excellent, some good and some not so good (SKR's example of stuff he did as a teen hit that spot ;p ).
So what would the realistic costs, in dollars, be to get started in painting minis? Basically, and market rates shifting by location, what would be the start up costs? I'm thinking of the absolute must-have items to start. Then the should-have items, before getting into the nice to have.
Absolute minimum you need:
A large pack of craft brushes, across a range of sizes. I'd go to Michael's or Hobby Lobby and get a synthetic (white bristled) set. Around $10 will get you started.
Spray-primer. Wal-mart has 99c cans of equipment grey, flat black, and flat white spray paint that work well enough. If you've never spray primed before, then you'll want to read some tips on how to do this without damaging detail.
Sprat-sealant. Initially, go for a matte clear coat from Krylon. About $5 a can.
Paint: To start out cheaply, I'd use Americana/DecoArt craft paint, which you can get for about $1 a bottle online. You need, at minimum:
White, Black, Blue, Green, Red, Yellow, Brown (2 shades), silver, and gold. $10 for paint.That's all you *have* to have. Other possible purchases would be Future Acrylic Floor polish (cheap and effective acrylic agent for mixing and thinning paints), mixing jars, palette, more expensive brushes, more expensive paints, inks, washes, glazes, basing materials...
So brushes, paints, primer, and sealant: about $30 to start.
Two absolutely necessary things got left off of this otherwise fine list.
1. A hobby knife. Might cost you from $5 to $10. No sense priming and painting a mini with a bunch of flash and mold lines on it.
2. A mini. If you just want to start on a basic archetypal character, you can probably get away with paying a little over $4 for a Reaper.
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Also there are Hobby-Q starter sets (put out by reaper) that contain 1 brush, 4-5 figures and mini paint pots of the major colors needed to paint those minis. It even comes with a step by step painting guide for those minis (what color to basecoat, what to mix to get the different shading colors, ect.) They give you about 20 colors, most of which are less than half empty when you finish the minis that come with it, so it work as a good starter set.
I would still recommend buying a few more brushes before doing this, as the one provided with the set is a 'medium' size for what I use.
Do you have any friends who paint minis? If so, the costs of getting into the hobby could be significantly lower. You might be able to talk your buddy into letting you paint a bit with his paints (sell it as him/her teaching you the ropes), while you build up your stash. Depending on how generous your friend is, all you'd need is your own brush, really.
I know I've done that for several friends of mine.
The teaching part, not the mooching. I mooch in other ways.
If there's an FLGS near you, call them and ask if they have any painting workshops, or if anyone there teaches. Usually you can go use what's there. There's a group I periodically paint with, and several of them have basically the entire Reaper line. They are more than willing to let me partake, even though I have my own meager set of paints with me.
Do you have any friends who paint minis? If so, the costs of getting into the hobby could be significantly lower. You might be able to talk your buddy into letting you paint a bit with his paints (sell it as him/her teaching you the ropes), while you build up your stash. Depending on how generous your friend is, all you'd need is your own brush, really.
I know I've done that for several friends of mine.
The teaching part, not the mooching. I mooch in other ways.
If there's an FLGS near you, call them and ask if they have any painting workshops, or if anyone there teaches. Usually you can go use what's there. There's a group I periodically paint with, and several of them have basically the entire Reaper line. They are more than willing to let me partake, even though I have my own meager set of paints with me.
Good advice, because you want to have some time to decide if you really like painting before becoming heavily invested.
While we are on the subject, does anyone recommend a cheap black primer or stain for wooden bases. I used to buy 1 inch wood circles for miniature bases from the local craft store so I could transfer figures from heroscape. Stain seemed to work fine, and I could just drop them directly into the can over night and let them dry. However, I bought some new wooden bases from Litko, and the stain doesn't seem to penetrate as well. However, I want the bases to have a flat black look to them, and would like use the same method of dropping them in the can until the next day.
While we are on the subject, does anyone recommend a cheap black primer or stain for wooden bases. I used to buy 1 inch wood circles for miniature bases from the local craft store so I could transfer figures from heroscape. Stain seemed to work fine, and I could just drop them directly into the can over night and let them dry. However, I bought some new wooden bases from Litko, and the stain doesn't seem to penetrate as well. However, I want the bases to have a flat black look to them, and would like use the same method of dropping them in the can until the next day.
For a brush-on primer for miniatures in general, I use acrylic gesso, which is a material artists and crafters use to prepare any surface, from pottery to canvases (and pewter figures :), to take acrylic paint. Their black is a very, very nice deep, flat black. One bottle costs about $5 and lasts a long time.
The trick to gesso is that it's a bit goopy when applied. It shrinks, however, as it tries--when done right, it does not "thicken" the surface, completely covers the surface, and shows no brush strokes (it CAN be applied TOO thickly and cause these problems however).
I have used it on a very large wooden base for sort of a diorama and it seemed to work fine (and it doesn't goop up a lot on wood because the grain absorbs it a little). I don't know if it's what you're looking for--it's certainly not a stain, but an actual paint-like substance you have to brush on and let try.
How is acrylic gesso on wear and tear when throwing multitple figures in a plastic bin to transport. One of my concerns with paint based primers, is it chipping over time. The other concern, when painting inside, is what type of fumes a primer would give off when drying. Probably not a big issue with spring and summer arriving, but most of the time I do this type of stuff during the winter months.
I do like the idea of using a brush based primer, especially if it is low maintenance and the result is a smooth black finish.
How is acrylic gesso on wear and tear when throwing multitple figures in a plastic bin to transport. One of my concerns with paint based primers, is it chipping over time.
It is sturdier than just paint primer; it will scratch off but only with concerted effort. Spray paint is probably slightly better IF it is in good condition. I have had gesso-primered models chip, but usually only after massive wear and tear. Varnish helps protect them.
The other concern, when painting inside, is what type of fumes a primer would give off when drying. Probably not a big issue with spring and summer arriving, but most of the time I do this type of stuff during the winter months.
No fumes--acrylic gesso being acrylic doesn't have anything like that.
I do like the idea of using a brush based primer, especially if it is low maintenance and the result is a smooth black finish.
That is indeed the results. You might search around--I recall seeing a few "pro" reviews of using gesso as a primer if you want a second or third opinion.
Don't forget a magnifying glass.
You are going to need one when you try to make those eye pupils on those 30mm minis!
Don't forget a magnifying glass.
You are going to need one when you try to make those eye pupils on those 30mm minis!
I got a Helping Hands with Magnifier for $3.19 at Harbor Freight. I've priced them other places at over $15. Next time I'm out near Harbor Freight I plan to buy a second one.
Next on my shopping list is a bottle of that Pledge with Future Shine and maybe black gesso. I've been using black spray primer but that basically meant I couldn't do any priming in the winter.
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1)Spray primer from a distance (maybe 12", see what works), and pass the paint over lightly, moving the can slowly as you go. It is much better to spray on a thin coat, then another thin coat when that one is dry (and you can always touch up with a brush before painting) than to spray too much on or get too close and end up with a gloppy or bubbly job.
+1 to that.
I used to hang at my local indie GW store, as I had friends who worked there, and I'd sometimes help out customers on the crafting area while I did my own stuff. I also helped set up a gaming club in my town, so I got viewed as one of the go-to guys by the younger generation.
I'd get lots of new gamers asking for help because they couldn't get good results, and most often the major reason was poor prep.
Failing (or not bothering) to remove flash and mould lines will not save you any time, since it will cost you time trying to bodge around the issues it creates.
One of those issues I saw constantly was the temptation to layer on the primer or paint in thick coats to obscure the offending seams. In order for this to work, they had to obscure much of the desired detail as well.
I also saw people trying far too hard to get the primer into deep recesses, believing that keeping their finger on the spray trigger would somehow force the paint into the hollows. What they got is a figure that looked like the Pilsbury Doughboy...that still had silver unprimed recesses.
What you're aiming for is a surface like an eggshell, to form a 'tooth' for the subsequent layers of paint to grip. This is best done by an initial light spraying (maybe one or two passes) from several angles.
This initial spraying doesn't have to deliver 100% opaque coverage; it's main purpose is to reveal where the blind spots are, that the spray won't reach.
Accept the fact that you may, almost always, have to apply some primer to these recesses via a brush.
Wait for the initial spray to dry (go prep some other figures while you wait), come back, apply liquid primer to the recesses via a brush, go away do something else while this dries, then give another light spray from all angles, to restore that eggshell satin finish.
I don't bother using a magnifier. One, it messes with your depth perception, making it harder to know when your brush is about to hit the mini (at least for me it does, but I have unequal visions so that may just be me). Two, the magnifier magnifies the brush and the mini and the tiny motions of your hand, so overall I've seen little or no improvement when using a magnifier.
But YMMV.
I agree with Sean - don't worry about a magnifying glass. If you're just starting out, you really don't need to worry about dotting in eyes. A simple bit of black for the eye is plenty good. Besides, a decent brush is way more important than a magnifier.
Now, I will say that as I've gotten a bit older and become more focused on the really tiny details (like the white dot on the black pupil to represent the light reflecting off the eye), I do occasionally use a pair of Optivisors. They're kinda like the magnifiers dentists wear, but for hobbyists. You definitely DO NOT need them to start, but they're great things once you really start getting into the hobby.
As for other items:
I found a set of needle files at one of the mega-home-improvement stores (Lowes or Menards) for cheap. Look there before the hobby stores.
I can't recommend craft paints, but I guess if you're just starting out . . . .
The Reaper Learn-To-Paint kits are about the best deal for starting, IMO. Great paint, decent (not great) brush, instruction, a couple minis.
Good luck!
I do occasionally use a pair of Optivisors. They're kinda like the magnifiers dentists wear, but for hobbyists. You definitely DO NOT need them to start, but they're great things once you really start getting into the hobby.
+1. I have perfect vision, but I will tell you that I notice a SIGNIFICANT reduction of eyestrain when using my Optivisor. There's no need to squint at all, and you realize just how much you normally squint at minis when you put them on. I had to train myself to relax and let the Optivisor do the work. And, because you can't really see anything else while wearing it, it helps you get into the zone and focus on the mini. Also, the Optivisor reminds you to stand up and walk around every so often, and let your eyes focus on something at a different distance. The 'visor is one of the things I wouldn't paint without anymore.
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One thing I would add to the list is a good light. You really need one, unless you always plan to paint just in sunlight, normal houselight just doesn't cut it sometimes.
What you're looking for is called a Compact Fluorescent Full Spectrum Light Bulb.
These will get you as close as possible to natural sunlight if you're stuck in a room with little natural light.
What you're looking for is called a Compact Fluorescent Full Spectrum Light Bulb. These will get you as close as possible to natural sunlight if you're stuck in a room with little natural light.
There are a lot of different varieties of these bulbs, and a huge range of prices. Personally, I use a Cowboy Studio Photography - 45 Watt Bulb, but that's only because I first started using them with my photography work, and only later thought to put one over my painting table. Big warning - Cowboy Studio bulbs are actually a fair bit more expensive than some of the other Full Spectrun Bulbs. But I like the mutiple usage aspect of them, so for me they are what I use.
What sorts of Full Spectrum bulbs do the other painters on the board use and why?
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There are a lot of different varieties of these bulbs, and a huge range of prices. Personally, I use a Cowboy Studio Photography - 45 Watt Bulb, but that's only because I first started using them with my photography work, and only later thought to put one over my painting table. Big warning - Cowboy Studio bulbs are actually a fair bit more expensive than some of the other Full Spectrun Bulbs. But I like the mutiple usage aspect of them, so for me they are what I use.What sorts of Full Spectrum bulbs do the other painters on the board use and why?
Ya, I don't really recommend getting into expensive lighting until you're a bit more serious about painting and can actually recognize the difference in your own models under different light.
I use a couple of GE Reveal 60W for "Room" lighting because they're cheap and readily available at most home reno stores.
For my painting desk lamps I use Alzo 45W 5600K bulbs.
Ya, I don't really recommend getting into expensive lighting until you're a bit more serious about painting and can actually recognize the difference in your own models under different light.
I'm afraid I have to disagree with you VagrantWisper. I don't think you can start practicing good habits too soon. I've taught a number of intro to painting classes at a FLGS where I used to work. I found that even first-time and novice painters benefited from painting under proper lighting.
Seeing how true color (as opposed to color modified by florescent lighting) looks like on the miniature allowed these painters to make better color choices, understand basic color theory faster, and create a better looking figure on their first try. And creating good looking figures prompted more of them to stick with painting as a hobby.
Just my experience. Your mileage may vary.
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Just my experience. Your mileage may vary.
Ya, fair enough. I tend to follow the, "see if you like doing it all first" before investing in large quantities of hobby gear.
Similary to lighting, I've seen people drop $35 on their first brush only to be frustrated and not recognize the kind of care, technique and good basic skills, a brush like that needs, when a $5 GW standard is good enough for their first few (or more) models.
I have dabbled in miniature painting in the past, as I have dabbled in miniature sculpting. Lately I've decided my miniatures are too goofy and cartoonish looking so I've started trying to be "more serious."
I have a pretty decent selection of tools and brushes, and some hobby paints, but my results are still much less than I would like.
I have not been priming or sanding or cleaning my miniatures. I will start doing that. Since the majority of miniatures I paint are miniatures I have sculpted myself, either from poly clay or some epoxy putty, my issue isn't flashing or casting flaws, it's fingerprints and lumpy sculpting... I do try to sand and file them down before painting them, but I suppose I just need to do a better job of sculpting before painting.
My biggest issue with painting is that I tend to use primary colors so the end result looks sort cartoony, with bright reds and greens, etc. I'm assuming most serious painters mix their own colors so that they have more realistic looking shades.
I struggle a great deal with details. I seem to always end up getting stray paint on adjacent areas when I am trying to do something very detailed, like painting a sword hilt or the cuff of a sleeve. No matter how small of a brush I use, I just can't seem to avoid getting paint where I don't want it.
I do a particularly poor job with eyes. All of my eyes seem to come out lopsided or cross-eyed.
I use reading glasses when I paint, but I don't use a magnifying glass. I don't have much choice but to use the reading glasses, I can't focus close enough to do painting without them.
I don't use a vise, mostly because I haven't figured out how to put a miniature in a vise without potentially scratching the existing paint, or having a spot that I can't paint because it's in the vise. So I end up mostly holding the mini in one hand while painting with the other, and as a result I find that I've got paint on my fingers and I've smudged the mini. For those of you who mount the mini in some vise or holder, how do you mount them so that you can paint the entire mini?
I suspect my main problem is simply impatience. I tend to view painting the mini as a one-time effort where I get several minis I've sculpted and then spend an hour painting them. Do most painters spend multiple sessions painting minis?
I'm looking for tutorials on mini painting, but as I said, I suspect my biggest problem is simply that I don't have the patience for it.
My biggest issue with painting is that I tend to use primary colors so the end result looks sort cartoony, with bright reds and greens, etc. I'm assuming most serious painters mix their own colors so that they have more realistic looking shades.
On the contrary, I almost never mix my own colors. Depending on the type of paint you use, most brands have more than enoough colors that mixing your own shades is uncessory - especially if you're going to be using lots of that color.
Personally, I use the Reaper brand of paints, because I like the way they flow, and how the cover. Each paint will have their own reasons for chosing a paint brand - everything from cost to color theory goes into the decision.
If you do a lot of custom mixes, you either have to record the exact proportions (i.e. 2 drops black, 4 drops green, 1 drop brown) in order to replicate the color the next time you want to use it, or make enough of the color at one time, so that you don't run out. For me, that's too much of a hassle.
Don't worry about trying to match colors exactly. That dosen't happen in real life, so don't try and force it on your minis. Even if you use two bottles of the same manufacturers paint, they might not be the same color. The old Armory paints were notorious for this problem - but there are modern paint manufacturers who have the same problem - too little quality control and too little batch testing.
If you don't like bright colors try using a dark wash to tone down the color. Or paint over a black primer, which will also give you a darker, more subdued look to your paint job. Combine both if your color is really bright.
I struggle a great deal with details. I seem to always end up getting stray paint on adjacent areas when I am trying to do something very detailed, like painting a sword hilt or the cuff of a sleeve. No matter how small of a brush I use, I just can't seem to avoid getting paint where I don't want it.
I do a particularly poor job with eyes. All of my eyes seem to come out lopsided or cross-eyed.
That's just due to a lack of practise. I've painted areound 5,000 figures since I started painting in 1975, and I still have trounble with eyes on some sculpts. My best advise is to use a good brush - i.e. small enough to do the job - maybe a 0 or 00 for eyes, with a fine point (no stray hairs poking out at odd angles), and only put a small amout of paint on the very tip of the brush hairs - never get paint on the metal part of the brush, as this will ruin a good brush very quickly.
If your using natural hair brushes, clean the brush at the end of every painting session with a good soap, and then use a condisioner. Natural hair brushes are just like your ouw hair. I use Pert in both my hair and my brushes, but evey painter has his/her own favorites.
I use reading glasses when I paint, but I don't use a magnifying glass. I don't have much choice but to use the reading glasses, I can't focus close enough to do painting without them.
That's OK. I didn't use a magnifyer until just recently, when I got my first pair of bi-focals.
I don't use a vise, mostly because I haven't figured out how to put a miniature in a vise without potentially scratching the existing paint, or having a spot that I can't paint because it's in the vise. So I end up mostly holding the mini in one hand while painting with the other, and as a result I find that I've got paint on my fingers and I've smudged the mini. For those of you who mount the mini in some vise or holder, how...
Try resting your hand that's holding the mini against your painting surface. This will give you a steadyier base to paint from.
I just re-read your question and realized something - you're probably holding your miniature in your hand. If so, DON'T. That's why you get fingerprints and paint smuges. Try gluing your mini to a holder. I use 35mm film cans - because my wife used to be a newspaper reporter and I got them for free. Many painters use empty paint jars - or even full ones of a color that they won't be using on the mini. That way, you hold the jar rather than the mini, and all of the mini will be free to paint.
Hmm... OK, I see a major problem with how I've been doing my own sculpted miniatures...
I have been holding them because I typically sculpt the miniature without a base. Then I've been painting them before gluing them to a base.
Geez, I feel like an idiot... I should glue the sculpted mini to the base FIRST so I have something to hold onto, or better yet, something to glue or put into a vise. (Yes, you are correct, that means most of my hand-made miniatures are sitting on an unpainted base... I'm sure most folks reading this are laughing out loud right now....)
I'm sitting here looking at my latest Yuan-Ti miniature I just finished sculpting last night, and it's just the Yan-Ti, no base. I think I'll try adding the base first this time.
But I'm not sure about gluing it to something. I use a foam circle for my bases, and I'm afraid if I glue it to something, I won't be able to remove it. I probably need some sort of tacky material like is sometimes used for sticking posters to walls, something that doesn't dry, but will hold a miniature on something I can use to manipulate it.
Good advice, as I said I feel sorta foolish....
What Halidan said.
Also, for eyes, consider getting some .2mm pens from Prima, they're great for tiny details like eyes, tattoos, and scrollwork. Example here.
As for sculpting and whether or not to base, I've seen many sculptures just leave the leg wire in the armature extra long, so when they're done they can drill a hole in a base and use the extended wire as a pin. That means it's probably easy to remove from the base if you ever change your mind.
What Halidan said.
Also, for eyes, consider getting some .2mm pens from Prima, they're great for tiny details like eyes, tattoos, and scrollwork. Example here.
As for sculpting and whether or not to base, I've seen many sculptures just leave the leg wire in the armature extra long, so when they're done they can drill a hole in a base and use the extended wire as a pin. That means it's probably easy to remove from the base if you ever change your mind.
I have done this. But I find the wire difficult to hold onto. And the Yuan-ti armatures I am working with right now don't have legs so I ended up with no wire left over for this purpose. My 'normal' humanoid miniature armatures are usually done this way, or else I have a loop of wire from both legs that I then glue to the base.
I went and looked at the Reaper green minis on their website and it looks like the majority of their sculptures are using an armature which has a metal rectangle that is then inserted into a base. That looks like it would work well since the metal rectangle gives a solid base to put into a vise. I don't have anything like that though, my armatures are just made of aluminum wire. And that doesn't solder well.
I'm going to have to give some thought to using a vise and making armatures with a solid base or block or something that I can put in the vise. I think that would make a huge difference in my sculpting and would also make painting easier.
If the wire is stiff enough, you could poke it into a cork and hold the cork.
If the wire is stiff enough, you could poke it into a cork and hold the cork.
Yep, like so many other things, I've realized my initial decision to use easily flexible aluminum wire has been yet another mistake. Steel or copper wire would be stiffer and easier to solder. But now I've got this spool of aluminum wire, so....
Right now I'm testing gluing the armature to a plastic cup to hold it while I add the clay. That might work.
Geez, I feel like an idiot... I should glue the sculpted mini to the base FIRST so I have something to hold onto, or better yet, something to glue or put into a vise. (Yes, you are correct, that means most of my hand-made miniatures are sitting on an unpainted base... I'm sure most folks reading this are laughing out loud right now....)
Don't feel bad. Every painter starts out making mistakes and we all learn along the way. I've been painting for 26 years now, and everytime I go to a painting class (or even teach one) I learn something new.
But I'm not sure about gluing it to something. I use a foam circle for my bases, and I'm afraid if I glue it to something, I won't be able to remove it.
Try a simple white glue, like Elmers or another brand of school glue. It holds tight enough to paint, but comes off with just a simple twist.
I probably need some sort of tacky material like is sometimes used for sticking posters to walls, something that doesn't dry, but will hold a miniature on something I can use to manipulate it.
If your looking to go that way, try bluetack. That's the stuff that you can use to hold posters onto a wall. It doesn't dry out, and you can make it tacky after use by just kneading with your fingers.
I have not been priming or sanding or cleaning my miniatures. I will start doing that. Since the majority of miniatures I paint are miniatures I have sculpted myself, either from poly clay or some epoxy putty, my issue isn't flashing or casting flaws, it's fingerprints and lumpy sculpting... I do try to sand and file them down before painting them, but I suppose I just need to do a better job of sculpting before painting.
The only sculpting I do is on existing models for conversion, but I find a *little* vaseline on a smooth sculpting tool helps smooth out fingerprints.
My biggest issue with painting is that I tend to use primary colors so the end result looks sort cartoony, with bright reds and greens, etc. I'm assuming most serious painters mix their own colors so that they have more realistic looking shades.
This is one of those things that depends on the painter. Most painting tutorials I read at GW, Faustus, and Brushthralls usually start with some pre-mixed colors, but also do a good deal of their own mixing. One big thing if you want to do a lot of home-mixing is learning color theory, which can get a little more complicated than yellow and blue = green. If you haven't, taking a very basic intro to art or intro to painting class can help with this tremendously. Learning little tricks like toning down or darkening red with a green color rather than, say, brown or black, can go a long way to helping mix colors that don't look "off" or "cartoonish."
Not that I am a pro (although I have been paid to paint others' models), but FWIW: I don't pre-mix a lot for my main middle-ground colors, especially if it's a color I am repeating on a lot of models. I have a lot of trouble repeating what I mixed together to get the exact same shade that I got before. I do more custom mixing for accents and highlights.
For non-mixed colors, I really like working with Reaper Master Series paint, because they come in "triads" of shade, middle color, and highlight. RMS paints also come with some flow improver and thinners pre-mixed in so they thin well with just water and are easy to use (once you get used to their consistency).
I struggle a great deal with details. I seem to always end up getting stray paint on adjacent areas when I am trying to do something very detailed, like painting a sword hilt or the cuff of a sleeve. No matter how small of a brush I use, I just can't seem to avoid getting paint where I don't want it.
Don't use a super small brush. This is advice I took that was provided by Jennifer Haley, who painted for Privateer Press and other mini companies: Use a size 2 brush. Why? The larger brush holds more paint, but a good quality, well cared for brush will still come to a perfect, microsize tip. This means that the paint won't dry right away, making it apply smoothly to the model. The problem with teeeny tiny "detail" brushes is that the paint dries in them too quickly (paint retarder can help but not always enough), so when you try to get them where you want to go, they don't go on well or chunk up. It takes a little practice to use them well, but it's really the best option in my experience.
The other thing is you will always need to touch up a little (at least, I do!). Just be patient and just keep working till it looks right. Work with thin paint, so if you end up layering on paint, it doesn't show brush strokes or obscure detail.
I do a particularly poor job with eyes. All of my eyes seem to come out lopsided or cross-eyed.
When I first started painting miniatures, I just painted in the eyes with a white or very light grey (which looks less cartoony--our eyes are not "pure white" because our brows shade them) and then with very dilute black ink or paint (ink is better), painted over the eye (the black pigment will sink into the eyelash area, essentially outlining the eye like eyeliner). This makes the eyes stand out but not require a lot of detailing. When you're more comfortable with detail painting you can try more explicit techniques. With big eyes you can often blot in pupils with a micro pen, which is easier than making a dot with a soft brush.
I use reading glasses when I paint, but I don't use a magnifying glass. I don't have much choice but to use the reading glasses, I can't focus close enough to do painting without them.
I don't use a vise, mostly because I haven't figured out how to put a miniature in a vise without potentially scratching the existing paint, or having a spot that I can't paint because it's in the vise. So I end up mostly holding the mini in one hand while painting with the other, and as a result I find that I've got paint on my fingers and I've smudged the mini. For those of you who mount the mini in some vise or holder, how do you mount them so that you can paint the entire mini?
I don't mount a mini in a vise when I paint them, but when I am drilling or sawing a mini or doing other difficult work, I put them in this all position vise. The rubber edges on the vise are pretty gentle on the models while holding them firmly, but you do have to be careful because pewter/white metal is usually quite soft.
When I paint minis, I hold them in my right hand (I'm left handed), lean my elbow on the low painting desk I use, and hold the mini to eye level and paint it (this reduces neck strain). I do paint my fingers constantly and just accept it as part of the hobby. I always glue the mini to a base first before painting it and hold the mini by the base so I don't smudge my work.
I suspect my main problem is simply impatience. I tend to view painting the mini as a one-time effort where I get several minis I've sculpted and then spend an hour painting them. Do most painters spend multiple sessions painting minis?
I'm looking for tutorials on mini painting, but as I said, I suspect my biggest problem is simply that I don't have the patience for it.
Patience is a big issue but it can be overcome. Set yourself a timer for 20 minutes and take breaks. Breaks are also important for ergonomic reasons; you can mess up your neck, shoulders, and wrists over time if you just sit and paint/sculpt for hours (believe me, I know about repetitive stress injury). If you get bored working on one model at a time, paint several.
I say this last because I learned to paint painting 40K minis. I would usually be painting 5-10 miniatures at a time for an army. I'd apply a basecoat to one, then the next, then the next, then the next. By the time I finished the last model, the first model was ready for its next coat of paint. For fantasy minis I sometimes paint two models at a time (I paint them a lot more carefully than I paint whole armies), that way I can apply some paint, let it dry while I work on the other one.
It normally takes me an hour (sans breaks) to paint one mini quickly, a couple-three hours for a nicer job. If it's a larger miniature, I will work on it an hour or two a day over the course of a few days (which reminds me, I ought to snap pics of the dragon I spent about a week working on).
Good luck!
Not that I am a pro (although I have been paid to paint others' models), but FWIW: I don't pre-mix a lot for my main middle-ground colors, especially if....
I am legally required to say, "This is the lesser-known brother of Sir Mix-A-Lot. He likes big brushes and he cannot lie."
DQ, thank you very much for the detailed response and advice. I have bookmarked this thread and will refer back to it in the future.
I also checked some miniature painting videos on Youtube. It appears that I am a rank amateur even by rank amateur standards. Wow, there's a lot you can learn about painting 1" tall sculptures!
I've almost decided that sculpting is easier than painting....
like so many other things, I've realized my initial decision to use easily flexible aluminum wire has been yet another mistake. Steel or copper wire would be stiffer and easier to solder. But now I've got this spool of aluminum wire, so....
Right now I'm testing gluing the armature to a plastic cup to hold it while I add the clay. That might work.
I think things would be easier for you with something sturdier to hold on to. Maybe take a coke bottle, drill holes in the cap for the armature, and fasten the armature wires to the underside of the cap with epoxy putty. You might even get away with just twisting the wires together and supergluing.
Those metal lumps you see on the Reaper greens is a result of the armatures they use. Check 'em out Here.
like so many other things, I've realized my initial decision to use easily flexible aluminum wire has been yet another mistake. Steel or copper wire would be stiffer and easier to solder. But now I've got this spool of aluminum wire, so....
Right now I'm testing gluing the armature to a plastic cup to hold it while I add the clay. That might work.
I think things would be easier for you with something sturdier to hold on to. Maybe take a coke bottle, drill holes in the cap for the armature, and fasten the armature wires to the underside of the cap with epoxy putty. You might even get away with just twisting the wires together and supergluing.
Those metal lumps you see on the Reaper greens is a result of the armatures they use. Check 'em out Here.
Thanks, yeah, I bought some of those premade armature at a local hobby supply store. I used one to make a mini for a major NPC in my campaign and it came out pretty nice. I need to work on poses. The "Starter Level sculpting miniatures" all broke at the waist when I tried to pose them, so I ended up having to put epoxy around their middle. I have some of all but the "Heroic" versions.
I mounted my current mini I am sculpting on a plastic cup and that has helped tremendously. I am very pleased by the result, actually, even though I know it's still very crude by professional or serious amateur standards. But I'm learning. I need to work on posing, I think I've discovered that a good pose is a tremendous help in creating a pleasing result.
Thanks for all the advice, I am improving steadily. Pretty soon I might even create something that I am not embarrassed by. :)