Zen Archer
drunken/hungry ghost
Allow padded armor,no one uses padded armor so give it to the monk.
Yea its only +1 but it could get enchanted it's "something" at lower levels and doesnt break anything. It also allows for monks that arent all wearing monks robes.
allow monks to take rogue talents instead of the bonus feats they can get (just trade a feat for a rogue talent) fast stelth for a monk would be a ball!
Let the monk use Wisdom or Dexterity in place of Strength for attack/damage, Wisdom in place of Dexterity for AC, or otherwise futz around to make it a less MAD class.
Give the monk some synergy between his exceptional movement abilities (for a non-caster) and his flurry of blows. Either something that rewards movement, like the 3.5 scout's skirmish, or the dervish ability to strike and move, or something that fixes this break in monk abilities.
Move some of the monk's abilities around to levels where they make sense. A monk has to reach high levels to speak with anything, yet the casters all got the tongues spell at 5th level or so, to name an example.
monk weapons are lame.
ditch em, all of them.
Give the monk things like long spear or polearm like they did originally.
A monk with a reach weapon and combat reflexes is alot more effective, and is really the only class that can combat reflexes AND use a reach weapon for AoOs all around.
Alternatively give the monk combat patrol as an optional bonus feat.
Full BAB as a matter of course.
I still don't understand the logic behind them ever not having it. Yeah yeah, feat progression. And?
The monk grew out of a 2nd edition cleric kit, hence cleric BAB, which carried to Pathfinder.
I allow monks to use a feat to make a weapon considered a monk weapon. Been considering giving them a bonus feat at first to use specifically for this, a way to differentiate schools.
"You scimitar style is inferior to my spiked chain style!"
Also monks of certain schools can use shields and/or light armor.
Give them a way to recover ki points. For example:
Make there ki points equal to 1/4 their monk level + their wisdom modifier. Let them recover 1 ki point per 5 minutes of light activity.
Also, the core monk is more of a debuffer than a damage dealer, which some people don't get.
Here are some of the house rules that I have that help Monks.
MONK
At 8th level a Monk can use his Flurry of Blows as standard attack action. When doing so he may make one additional attack using any combination of unarmed strikes or attacks with a special monk weapon (kama, nunchaku, quarterstaff, sai, shuriken, and siangham) as if using the Double Strike feat (even if the monk does not meet the prerequisites for the feat). For the purpose of these attacks, the monk's base attack bonus is equal to his monk level.
Double Strike (Combat)
You can hit with a weapon in each hand as fast as others hit with one weapon.
Prerequisite: Dex 15, Two-Weapon Fighting, base attack bonus +6.
Benefit: If you are wielding two weapons and make a standard-attack action you can make one attack with each weapon. All of your attack rolls take a –2 penalty when using Double Strike.
Note: You may uses this feat after a charge or during a Spring Attack, but you can not use this feat in conjunction with Vital Strike. You may make a 5' step between these attacks if it is your only movement for this round.
Amulet of Mighty Fists
Increase the maximum bonus from +5 to +8. The amulet can't have an enhancement bonus higher than +5. Use the prices for bonuses higher than +5 to determine price when special abilities are added in.
Price 4,000 gp (+1), 16,000 gp (+2), 36,000 gp (+3), 64,000 gp (+4), 100,000 gp (+5), 144,000 gp (+6), 196,000 gp (+7), 256,000 gp (+8)
I really agree on the two issues of making monks more mobile (maybe copy from mobile fighter? basically the monk´s problem is the same as the twfers problem, you imagine some kind of high mobile blade weaver and the result is a most stationary build) and giving him more stylish weapons (chakus are nothing but converted farmer tools, flexible spears, chain whips and jian swords are far more stylish for a monk)
VoP, maybe its just me but I think in most cases alone it makes the monk as powerful, if not more than an average pc. Sure they don't get much versatility due to no magic items but still as fas as combat is they will wreck.
Full BAB as a matter of course.
I still don't understand the logic behind them ever not having it. Yeah yeah, feat progression. And?
It is probably feat progression and it makes it too easy to multi-class, warrior types all will end up with a few monk levels.
Just ask yourself the question what you want the monk to do and rewrite the class stripping it's other abilities, the main problem with the monk it is trying to do too much.
Sure crazy movement is fun, but it is not really what I am looking for in a martial artist, spell resistance.. as much bother as blessing, abundant step.. strip, personally I want a bit less supernatural mojo and more kickass.
how does the vow of poverty work
"Hi, I'm lawful good and I choose to give any possesions I have to charity (my groupmates) and I want to receive super powers" In the form of..
+4 ac and 1 more every 3 levels
Extra feats every other level
Endure elements as a constant effect
Non magical items you weild as weapons are treated as magical and get a +1 enhancement every 4 or so levels and at 10 are treated as good alligned for by passing DR
No need to eat or drink for me thanks I'm poor!
+1 deflection at every 6 levels
+1 saves every 7 or so levels
crazy ability score gains
natural armor
immune to thought detecting software
DR/evil
no need to breathe for me thanks
Energy resistance
Freedom of Movement
Regeneration
True sight
I kinda got tired of typing so I left a little out but you get the picture. All that loot he could have got went to his party members and he is no worse off for it. Its a little silly if you think about it, giving up possessions to become stronger just because you took a vow.
It essentially makes or breaks the monk depending on how much magic is obtainable in the world and how often the gm gives out loot and what kind. Some gms allow it since they still have to give up alot of versatility and potential awesomeness.
what is the source of this. Basically where can i find it to show to my DM
Book of Exalted Deeds from 3.5 Wizards of the Coast
They have a lot of nifty stuff if you sift through it, just majority of it is copywrite. :CI miss magic missle mage... An entire prestige based on two spells that I loved.
Personally I got so tired of hearing Vow of Poverty, if mechanically you want to make it work. it is better to just make the monk tithe and gain superpowers (magical powers) equal to the ammount he tithes.
yea I know this makes it just a roleplaying consideration, it also has the side benefit of not giving the other players more treasure on average since they have a monk not taking his share.
I'd make the monk 'pay' for everything and occupy virtual slots to figure out the price if you go that route. Obviously this is an awesome 'villain' to use against an evil party, badass dude with no treasure how evil does it get ;)
Morvik, my memory is a bit fuzzy on the subject (and most of my 3.5 books are in boxes, including the Book of Exalted Cheese), but I remember charity wasn't allowed to be the PC's.
But on the "boosts to the monk" department I can think of two things. The first is to make Amulets of Mighty Fists cost the same as magic weapons (or give monks unarmed damage with monk weapons only) and the second is to allow the monk to spend a Ki point for a standard action instead of merely adding a single attack when they flurry.
It says that you (the monk) shouldn't give it to party members and that you should give to 3rd party charity and that's how the DM should run it but its his call but in the case of magic items the party is likely to just not even bother giving it to the monk's cause. As far as I can see there's no definite "you must", in there. DM disgression I suppose though don't take my word for law I could be wrong.
Obviously this is an awesome 'villain' to use against an evil party, badass dude with no treasure how evil does it get ;)
I love it so much I might just use it. Save for the fact you need to be lawful good to have the poverty thing. Hey we'll just change it to a vow of intentional forgot my loot behind before I died. Batman.
Edit: derp... evil party, right that makes sense now
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Allow padded armor,no one uses padded armor so give it to the monk.
Yea its only +1 but it could get enchanted it's "something" at lower levels and doesnt break anything.
I let monks wear armor with no armor check penalty, and they cam add their wis+monk bonuses to ac still.
Quilted cloth armor is sooooo monkish imho
Easiest fix:
1-20 Base Attack Bonus progression,with the flurry modified to match.
This sounds a bit simple but makes a big difference in terms of overcoming opponents.
For AC, simply let them wear light armor and have it stack with the wis/ac bonus progression they already have.
For me: drop the fast movement; man is it annoying when you are GM and the player gets spring attack.
Our game, the Monk gets a +2 to Flurry attack rolls (So, his Flurry BAB really is equal to his level). He gets a bonus to AC at levels 2, 4, 6, and 8. (So by 8th level he has an AC of 7), then he progresses as normal so level 12, 16 and 20 is an AC of 8, 9, and 10 respectively.
HOWEVER, his additional AC bonuses at levels 2, 4, 6, and 8 do not stack with magical armor such as Bracers of Armor. So basically, he's getting the armor bonus without magic items, at the earliest level he'd be able to buy the item with the mechanics for starting higher level games.
Don't know if this balances the armor, we're still kinda new to the game, just what we decided after a couple of games of seeing how bad the Monk was in combat.
Remove the 'cannot wear armor' clause, and make the Wis+level bonus an Armor bonus. Then it doesn't stack with the regular armor bonus, but they can wear armor and get magical enhancements to it.
I kinda like the monks ac helping versus touch attacks, why not just allow monks to wear light armor, but lose their monk AC if they do. Allow armor enhancement on clothing, like robes and it is all good.
Full BAB as a matter of course.
I still don't understand the logic behind them ever not having it. Yeah yeah, feat progression. And?
The monk grew out of a 2nd edition cleric kit, hence cleric BAB, which carried to Pathfinder.
The monk was originally an AD&D class before being a cleric Kit, and (if my memory serves me right) used the cleric to hit table.
The monk was originally an AD&D class before being a cleric Kit, and (if my memory serves me right) used the cleric to hit table.Full BAB as a matter of course.
I still don't understand the logic behind them ever not having it. Yeah yeah, feat progression. And?
The monk grew out of a 2nd edition cleric kit, hence cleric BAB, which carried to Pathfinder.
There was this base class in Greyhawk I think which pretty much was the monk as is now, the brotherhood of purple something.. can't exactly remember.
RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32
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I must be one of the few people that thinks the monk is fine as is. Not every class needs to be equal in combat. The monk is a mobile combatant with abilities that are very beneficial to adventuring. He should not be standing toe to toe. He is a hit and run all over the place class. I want a monk archetype that can run across walls/ceilings, backflip over an enemy, and knock him off balance.
Full BAB plus a meaningful way to full attack after a move action like the Mobile Fighter Archetype (sacrifice highest BAB for movement).
Situational Full BAB and full CMB after third seem like such a kludge. Flurry is a full attack, not every round has a full attack, single attacks at 3/4 BAB are dreadful.
Full BAB allows them to do skirmisher stuff without taking a major hit to BAB. It also allows you to get rid of the weird exceptions about the class.
The major thing you'd need to change is to make it less desirable as a 1-2 level dip. All Good Saves + front loaded feats + full BAB make it a great dip for martials and martial casters. For people who've substantially altered all the base classes like Kirth this isn't so problematic, for those that want to keep most of the base classes the same a Full BAB monk can be problematic.
Full BAB as a matter of course.
I still don't understand the logic behind them ever not having it. Yeah yeah, feat progression. And?
The monk grew out of a 2nd edition cleric kit, hence cleric BAB, which carried to Pathfinder.
I allow monks to use a feat to make a weapon considered a monk weapon. Been considering giving them a bonus feat at first to use specifically for this, a way to differentiate schools.
"You scimitar style is inferior to my spiked chain style!"
Also monks of certain schools can use shields and/or light armor.
where do you get the idea that the monk grew out of a 2nd edition cleric kit??
Monk has been a base class since 1st edition AD&D.
I must be one of the few people that thinks the monk is fine as is. Not every class needs to be equal in combat. The monk is a mobile combatant with abilities that are very beneficial to adventuring. He should not be standing toe to toe. He is a hit and run all over the place class. I want a monk archetype that can run across walls/ceilings, backflip over an enemy, and knock him off balance.Oh yeah. The guy playing a monk in my last game helped win a fight that way. The party was 6th level. They were against some high level samurai and their 7th level mounted leader. The monk took on the samurai man on man and lured him away from the party into a thicket where he had cover. Then he kept the guy busy for about 6 combat rounds until the party was finished mopping up his minions and then the summoner's eidelon and the ranger showed up and piled on the samurai.
monks are really good for this. intellectually the perception of weakness comes from the need others have to be better than other damage dealers while not putting ALOT of faith I'n the. monks strength.
two sessions ago ny monk kep a nabasu with 4 growth levels pinned or otherwise occupied while my group killed his little buddy. he'd have probably killed someone if I hadn't.
I use the following rules. They've worked well so far.
Monks attack at full BaB and can use Wisdom in place of Str/Dex (For attack or damage) when using unarmed strikes or special monk weapons, either for attack or combat maneuver. For all other purposes, including qualifying for feats, they have 3/4 BaB.
I like that better than PF's implementation, Kain. Still prefer just giving them full BAB, but oh well.
Honestly, I'm not sure why I kept the complication, other than perhaps keeping a dip in monk from being a no-brainer option for melee clerics? It's been a year or two since I established the houserule, and we've had one player play a monk since then.
Yeah the balancing cost/utility of dipping monk for a level is where I think Full BAB causes problems. I personally like the PF focus on avoiding multiclassing as much as possible. If Monks are too desirable as a dip class then a lot of that move towards discouraging multiclassing goes out the window.
You could come up with something hokey like the mental discipline needed to become and use monk powers requires the full focus of the individual, no multiclassing allowed but that just seems really ham-handed.
Kind of why I like the idea of making the AC bonus an armor bonus. Then a cleric or druid dipping into monk doesn't actually get anything he couldn't get by just wearing armor. It's nice when he just wakes up, but doesn't add much when he's out adventuring.
So, no more stacking with bracers of armor?
Kind of why I like the idea of making the AC bonus an armor bonus. Then a cleric or druid dipping into monk doesn't actually get anything he couldn't get by just wearing armor. It's nice when he just wakes up, but doesn't add much when he's out adventuring.
Hrmm, the key problem I see with that is that if the +wisdom to ac is an armor bonus that prevents the Monk from benefiting from Bracers of Armor which are generally a critical method of boosting monk AC.
I wonder if instead of functioning as a + to AC you could create a level dependent table (instead of wisdom linked) that provides an armor bonus equivalent to the expected Armor Bonus of a light fighter at that level.
Assuming a starting dex of 12/+1 you could have it like
Level 1: Armor Bonus +4 (chain shirt)
Level 3: Armor Bonus +5 (chain shirt +1)
Level 6: Armor Bonus +6 (chain shirt +2)
Level 9: Armor Bonus +7 (chain shirt +3)
Level 12: Armor Bonus +8 (Chain shirt +4)
Level 15: Armor Bonus +9 (Chain Shirt +5)
Not compatible with other armor bonuses.
In effect the Monk would get freebie light armor which I think is relatively fair considering how expensive amulets of mighty fists are. Further because this would require the monk to boost Dex to keep pace with recommended AC numbers it's really not that much of a cost savings.
Further because it's separated from the wisdom mechanics it no longer is a tempting dip for clerics.